General questions for first time PotD playthrough

[dambros]

I have just recently finished my first playthrough on normal and got my teeth kicked in several times. Now, sadistic as I am, I want to try another playthrough but this time on PotD, using only companions (the banters are awesome) and the classes I didn't test during my first run. My first party was composed of:

 

- PC blunderbuss cipher

- Edér main tank

- Carnage barb with tidefall (hired adventure)

- Durance full support and firing pistols after buffing

- Ranged rogue (hired adventure)

- Aloth control

 

Most of the trouble I had was with those ****ing shades and rain blights or whenever the fight was on an open space and I couldn't keep the enemies on the melees. I am far from a skilled/knowledgeable PoE player hence my need for help with a couple of things.

 

1- Given the classes I have played before, I want to run this time with druid/paladin/chanter/ranger/monk/X. What would be a good 6th class/build on this party?

 

2- Is this party viable? By "viable" I mean not having to reload 100x per fight or resting after 2-3 engagements. Please keep in mind the limited skill and knowledge of the game.

 

3- Considering I will use companions (and their terrible stats), which of the classes would make the best PC? I don't care that much about playstyle, afterall I will control all 6. The only thing is this time I want to do a 100% evil  playthrough.

 

4- Talking about builds: I have read the stick and I think the builds would be as follow:

 

Monk - KDubya's juggernaut

Druid - Boeroer's bash!t crazy or L4wlight's thundercat

Ranger - L4wlight's strom caller

Paladin - No idea, probably something tanky to be the main tank?

Chanter - Boeroer's Drake Ambassador

 

Are those builds good options for the party? 

 

5- Some of the companions are only acquired in WM. At which level is ok for me to try to do WM and gather them?

 

Thanks in advance for the trouble in helping a noob out!

Edited June 26, 2016 by dambros

[KDubya]

The party is definitely viable.

 

With a frontline of the juggernaut, either druid, Paladin and chanter plus the pet you'll be durable enough to handle anything. The Ranger will be safe in the back plus whatever you want for the sixth man. You could cycle through the companions for the last spot.

 

I believe all of those builds are just as viable using the corresponding companion as in you can make a fine juggernaut using Zahua. This would free you up to pick any of those for the MC or make the MC something else entirely.

 

If you are not making the paladin the MC use Pellagrina. Her unique abilities are very nice and her stats are good enough

 

If I am fixed on a particular companion and class that I can't get until later in the game I'll frequently make up a henchman of the class and use them till I can swap for the real companion.

[dambros]

The party is definitely viable.

 

With a frontline of the juggernaut, either druid, Paladin and chanter plus the pet you'll be durable enough to handle anything. The Ranger will be safe in the back plus whatever you want for the sixth man. You could cycle through the companions for the last spot.

 

I believe all of those builds are just as viable using the corresponding companion as in you can make a fine juggernaut using Zahua. This would free you up to pick any of those for the MC or make the MC something else entirely.

 

If you are not making the paladin the MC use Pellagrina. Her unique abilities are very nice and her stats are good enough

 

If I am fixed on a particular companion and class that I can't get until later in the game I'll frequently make up a henchman of the class and use them till I can swap for the real companion.

 

Thanks for you input. Do you think pally tank would make the best MC? (I am guessing "mc" means the watcher).

[Boeroer]

Don't be disappointed by the early game chanter. You can really make him worthwhile with chokepoints + Come Swwet Winds and then White Worms. After lvl 9 he will be great.

 

Stormcaller ranger + shock based druid like Batsh!t is a good combination.

Sagani and Hiravias can do this good enough. Remember that in the early game (that's the hardest part) the official companions are one level above hirelings. This makes a huge difference because they have more ACC and defenses as you can get with simple stat minmaxing. So from early to mid game it's more easy with the officials.

 

Pallegina can be made into a pretty nice, tanky ranged burst shooter before she switches to weapon + Outworn Buckler. Take Wrath of the Five Suns and two arquebuses or blunderbusses (if you want to hit targets with low DR like casters mainly) and focus on FoD and on kill effects as well as on supporting with Lay on Hands, Exhortations, Coordinated Attacks + marking and buckler after shooting. Later, with Sacred Immolation, she will be good enough for high AoE damage as well.

[KDubya]

Yes, MC is for Main Character or Watcher.

 

An MC Paladin has a slight advantage due to Faith and Conviction and following the Paladin Order's personality but it is not that big. Better to choose whatever you enjoy for the MC.

 

All of the builds you've listed will work with the story companions or with the MC so go with what you enjoy.

 

For me, success at PotD comes down to having a durable team that can survive in melee combat while mutually supporting each other with auras, chants and buffs. I've become a big fan of regen from the Chanter talents combined with Veteran's Recovery, add in some good DR armor and the defensive aura, Zealous Endurance,  from the Paladin and you have a team that will not get KO'd. Keeping your team in the fight is better than having glass cannons that spend the fight trying to escape or flat on their backs. I also play with the crippling effects after being KO'd and try to limit rests as much as possible.

 

Another boon from the team you've listed is that most of their abilities are all per encounter. You can let loose with everything you have in every fight and not feel like you need to hold back in order to save for the next fight. With that style the shapeshifter Druid might be better as you can shift every encounter.

[dambros]

Can someone please give me some phrases combination for the chanter?

 

I tried using chanter on my previous high level group and simply made a "song" starting with only the fire buff and then followed by the fire/slash aoe, but I read something about the aoe stacking with itself so I probably should do something different.

[MaxQuest]

Yeap, Dragon-thrashed does stack with itself.

 

To take [x2 dragon-thrashed] or [aefyllath -> dragon-thrashed] depends on how much damage does your chanter in comparison to the rest of the party.

If it's higher than 33%, or you are facing fire-immune enemies, than double dragon-thrashed is strictly better. Otherwise, and especially if you have ciphers in party (as they will get extra focus), aefyllath gets a higher priority.

 

Also, one more thing you might want to take into consideration, if you start with dragon-thrashed it might start before your chanter has reached the enemies and not affect quite a lot of them.

[Elric Galad]

My choice is Aefillath + 6x Dragon slashed.

 

I prefer Dragon slashed, but if you take it as first chant, there is a risk that ennemies won't be already in range.

 

I like the 30pt shield as initial chant for trash fights because it saves your health if you don't like resting a lot.

[Dr <3]

I go with winds of death and dragon trashed alternate. So at the beginning of the fight also if you miss enemies like maxquest correcly said is not a problem. Moreover dps are quite High ( not much less than mono dragon chant) but the phrase counter go up Pretty famn High and fast, so you can start trowing invocation before Battle is ending

[Dropman]

on the sidenote - is there any difference between taking one chant and taking more of the same? (ie 1X Dragon trashed has same fect as 6X Dragon trashed, right?)

[MaxQuest]

ie 1X Dragon trashed has same fect as 6X Dragon trashed, right?

If there are no other chants in that queue: yeap.

[Boeroer]

Most of the time I do Dragon Thrashed only - together with as much MIG and INT I can get, a Ring of Overseeing plus Voice of the Mountaintop (the +10% and +20% AoE buffs stack whith that from INT). The damage is just too good and the size of the AoE is ridiculously big.

 

If you want more invocations and still do chant damage then a good combination at higher levels is taking The Dragon Thrashed + multiple Come Sweet Winds (so that those fill the linger time). At level 16 COme Sweet Winds only takes 2 seconds to chant! An example of how powerful the combination of multiple fast chanting phrases plus one slow, powerful one can be:

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/86968-class-build-chillfog-cool-soothing-chanter-tank/?hl=chillfog 

Edited June 29, 2016 by Boeroer

[dambros]

Wow, so many good answers, thanks!

 

I am almost ready for starting this. I have been trying different builds on my previous party to see how they perform and the ranger and chanter were the most impressive ones. I disliked how much micro the monk needed and how much rest he required, even though I was always full endurance, my health was constantly dropping pretty fast. Guess I will try the Monksterlasher version.

 

The other thing is I can't find anything ok for the paladin. I ended up taking everything that was related to tank, sworn enemy and liberation and in the end it was just a meat shield worse than Eder (as a meat shield) but with more useful spells/dmg. I guess I am doing something wrong again.

 

What I am mostly fearing is health dropping pretty fast on PotD and forcing constant rests. Endurance can be kept up with Shod-in-faith/chanter/veteran recovery, but since so far almost the entire party is composed of frontlines, I guess health will be a occurring issue.

[Elric Galad]

Shield chant solved many health issues in my current party. Given that I had only casters with 10-12 Con, 12 end/lvl and x4 health and 1 ranger with 8 Con, I think it's a good indicator.

 

(I had 2 chanters, 1 with Aefillath + 6x dragons, the other with 1 shield chant and 6x dragons.)

 

The number of queued chants only matter if you have more than 1 chant. In my case, it leads to 1/7 buff chant and 6/7 damage chant.

 

7 is the max number of phrases.

[Boeroer]

Wow, so many good answers, thanks!

 

I am almost ready for starting this. I have been trying different builds on my previous party to see how they perform and the ranger and chanter were the most impressive ones. I disliked how much micro the monk needed and how much rest he required, even though I was always full endurance, my health was constantly dropping pretty fast. Guess I will try the Monksterlasher version.

 

The other thing is I can't find anything ok for the paladin. I ended up taking everything that was related to tank, sworn enemy and liberation and in the end it was just a meat shield worse than Eder (as a meat shield) but with more useful spells/dmg. I guess I am doing something wrong again.

 

What I am mostly fearing is health dropping pretty fast on PotD and forcing constant rests. Endurance can be kept up with Shod-in-faith/chanter/veteran recovery, but since so far almost the entire party is composed of frontlines, I guess health will be a occurring issue.

I you don't like micromanagement and resting a lot (we're the same here) but still want to play a monk (I love them) then I would recommend the Witch Doctor I made. That build requires way less resting because it also works as a ranged character (as well as melee flanker/occasional offtank). Once you feel you get hit too much, retreat and cast THe Long Pain and kill everything from afar. It'S one of the most powerful monks (dps wise) that I know. 

 

Nice Paladin builds are "Darcozzi Forward Observer" who focuses on raising the ACC of his allies into the skies and the Kind Wayfarer Damaging Healbot. That one uses on-kill effects and special order related talents to heal like crazy. They both can be very tanky - although the Healbot needs a bit of oomph in order to steal kills for his healing.

 

THe only things that help agaisnt low health are high defenses or Wound Binding. But a potion of Infuse with Vital Essence is also not bad: sip it before you go waltk into melee combat - the first 50 health you lose will not be substracted from your (unbuffed) health bar.

[dambros]

Also, considering only companions party, who is a good option for full mechanics? I remember 14 locks on cragholdt and as far as I can tell, without buff only a custom rogue can get this high.

[Boeroer]

7 is the max number of phrases.

Keep in mind that if you didn't choose any invocation of your highest level (maybe because you think they are too bad and you chose one from a lower level instead) your phrase counter will be stuck at that lower level and will not go up.

 

So, for example: if you could choose an invocation that requires 7 phrases but instead choose another invocation that only uses 6 phrases, your phrase counter will not go up to 7, even if your char level is high enough. It will be stuck at 6. It's stupid, but that's how it is...

Edited June 29, 2016 by Boeroer

[dambros]

 

Wow, so many good answers, thanks!

 

I am almost ready for starting this. I have been trying different builds on my previous party to see how they perform and the ranger and chanter were the most impressive ones. I disliked how much micro the monk needed and how much rest he required, even though I was always full endurance, my health was constantly dropping pretty fast. Guess I will try the Monksterlasher version.

 

The other thing is I can't find anything ok for the paladin. I ended up taking everything that was related to tank, sworn enemy and liberation and in the end it was just a meat shield worse than Eder (as a meat shield) but with more useful spells/dmg. I guess I am doing something wrong again.

 

What I am mostly fearing is health dropping pretty fast on PotD and forcing constant rests. Endurance can be kept up with Shod-in-faith/chanter/veteran recovery, but since so far almost the entire party is composed of frontlines, I guess health will be a occurring issue.

I you don't like micromanagement and resting a lot (we're the same here) but still want to play a monk (I love them) then I would recommend the Witch Doctor I made. That build requires way less resting because it also works as a ranged character (as well as melee flanker/occasional offtank). Once you feel you get hit too much, retreat and cast THe Long Pain and kill everything from afar. It'S one of the most powerful monks (dps wise) that I know. 

 

Nice Paladin builds are "Darcozzi Forward Observer" who focuses on raising the ACC of his allies into the skies and the Kind Wayfarer Damaging Healbot. That one uses on-kill effects and special order related talents to heal like crazy. They both can be very tanky - although the Healbot needs a bit of oomph in order to steal kills for his healing.

 

THe only things that help agaisnt low health are high defenses or Wound Binding. But a potion of Infuse with Vital Essence is also not bad: sip it before you go waltk into melee combat - the first 50 health you lose will not be substracted from your (unbuffed) health bar.

 

That sounds good, but the long pain is a rather late (lvl7) spell. How would I fare before it?

 

Actually I am not set into playing a monk. I prefer having a better optimized party (regarding the number of rests/easiness of fights) than playing a specific role. I used the monk for a while now and found it interesting but liked the ranger way more because of the pet/stormcaller :D

Edited June 29, 2016 by dambros

[Elric Galad]

 

 

7 is the max number of phrases.

Keep in mind that if you didn't choose any invocation of your highest level (maybe because you think they are too bad and you chose one from a lower level instead) your phrase counter will be stuck at that lower level and will not go up.

 

So, for example: if you could choose an invocation that requires 7 phrases but instead choose another invocation that only uses 6 phrases, your phrase counter will not go up to 7, even if your char level is high enough. It will be stuck at 6. It's stupid, but that's how it is...

I was wondering about this aj ah ah.

 

I like Animated Weapons.

 

But in case one doesn't, I think it's good to take just as a passive to increase max number of stackable phrases. I use the same Invocations most of the time, so I think saving one Invocation for this purpose worth it.

[Elric Galad]

For Paladins, you can play them more or less as a Dragon Slashed chanter from level 13, using their Immolation ability.

 

They will do less damages but better at tanking (especially against spell).

 

Lay on Hand and Reviving Exhortation are the best single target heal of the game. The aura is good. Sworn ennemy, FoD and martial talents will make them decent attackers (especially for spike damages).

 

You can't go wrong with all these abilities. Paladin is rather easy to play and build.

 

Then you can add the builds stated above for extra spicing.

[Boeroer]

Also good to know for paladins: the Outworn Buckler you can buy in Gilded Vale is one of the best shields in the game, given how early you can get it. It's paladin-only. It is one of the reasons I like paladins.

[Dropman]

Speaking of paladins - how tanky are they? I used chanter and fighter as main tanks (and they were fine), is paladin viable replacement as main tank?

[Boeroer]

He can achieve higher permanent defenses than a fighter (plus the Outworn Buckler I mentioned), has aweseome (self) healing abilities, can shrug off debuffs and can have an aura that gives him (and others) a DR bonus - so yes.

Edited June 30, 2016 by Boeroer

[baldurs_gate_2]

Speaking of paladins - how tanky are they? I used chanter and fighter as main tanks (and they were fine), is paladin viable replacement as main tank?

Best tank in the game with very good AoE damage.

[dambros]

Just got to the point where you get Hiravias and the Grieving Mother (lvl5) and jesus ***k the druid feels out of place in my party... I tried "building" him with weapon and shield talent + heart of the storm but he is simply too squishy to be in the front line while his spells require him to be there. I am now using him with a quaterstaf behind the tanks, but he seems useless.

 

The game has been pretty easy with pc paladin tank/tank eder/ tank kana. The only thing I had to leave behind was the pack of feral druids, because that thing is impossible when your entire party is perma stunned.