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Only Ranger's Swift Aim reload speed bonus supress it and don't stack.

I remember, one time i've made a "machine gun" Sagani trough stacking Swift Aim, Gunner talent, Sure Handed Ila & Forgiveness pistol: +60% ranged attack speed & +70% reload speed even without Frenzy or DAoM ;)

Edited by Phenomenum

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Huh? Since when is that? As far as know those also stack. At least they did in the past.

 

But since reload speed bonuses are multiplicative, you get diminishing results when stacking them. For example 100 * 0.5 (Swift Aim) * 0.8 (Gunner) * 0.8 (Sure Handed Ila) = 32% of the original reload time. If they would be additive you would get 100*(1-0.5-0.2-0.2)= 10%.


Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Huh? Since when is that? As far as know those also stack. At least they did in the past.

I also thought so, but no. At least tooltip says it supressed :mellow:  v. 3.06

 

"But since reload speed bonuses are multiplicative" - ouch, don't know this trick. Ok, 100 * 0.5 (Swift Aim) * 0.8 (Gunner) = 40 (or +60% reload speed) - anyway, this was a really good setup, considering all active abilities or spells/potions stack with this "base" +60%/+60%

Edited by Phenomenum

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Hm... they must have changed this or my memory is failing me. I remember having a conversation with MaxQuest about this some time ago. 


Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Only Ranger's Swift Aim reload speed bonus supress it and don't stack.

I remember, one time i've made a "machine gun" Sagani trough stacking Swift Aim, Gunner talent, Sure Handed Ila & Forgiveness pistol: +60% ranged attack speed & +70% reload speed even without Frenzy or DAoM ;)

 

I enchanted Forgiveness and give it to Pallegina instead. With Fine Enchantment only (-1 ACC) is so good  :biggrin: . I gave Sagani a wand though for Immunities. I hope in Deadfire if it's possible to mod dual damages. Pierce/Crush seems reasonable for powershot i think  :biggrin:.

 

I read somewhere enchantment is Deadfire is... meh. We can no longer enchant the way we want it. For example if it's Fire damage then it become Chain Fire or something. Anyone has any insights on it?

Edited by Archaven

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Hm... they must have changed this or my memory is failing me. I remember having a conversation with MaxQuest about this some time ago. 

Feel free to check it yourself, but i doubt that i'm miss something - tooltip says it supressed... Maybe tooltip is wrong? Then only Max can dig it up


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"I read somewhere enchantment is Deadfire is... meh. We can no longer enchant the way we want it. For example if it's Fire damage then it become Chain Fire or something. Anyone has any insights on it?" - i'm sure enchantment system in Deadfire will be good, don't worry. Becose ench. system in PoE obviously was implemented at the last moment - just to keep promise to bakers.

 

Edited by Phenomenum

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Oh, i get it. That's becose of crasy stacking rules.

Another one - Fighter's ability Disciplined Barrage is stack with Priest's Blessing spell (+5 acc, +10% damage), but Rogue's Reckless Assault modal supressing accuracy bonus from this spell.


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Sure Handed Ila's speed buff stacks with every one of those, the rest doesn't stack.

 

The reason is that Sure Handed Ila is in a different group (code wise) and only affects ranged attack speed and reload - while the others are all in the same group and buff attack speed universially (ranged, melee, casting and so on).

 

Ila's reload buff also used to stack with Swift Aim's reaload buff and also Gunner. Can't say if this is still the case though.

 

Other speed buffs that stack with everything are Two Handed Style (only one handed melee weapons when dual wielding), speed enchantment on weapons (only works when using the weapon for attacks), durgan steel on weapon or shield (same), Bloodlust (barb, universal), Gauntlets of Swift Action (universal) and Anitlei (Zahua, universal). Hope I didn't forget something.

 

All other speed buffs will suppress each other (better one suppresses the weaker one with the exception of Spelltongue's Time Siphon which supresses them all although it's only 15% - for whatever buggy reason).

Edited by Boeroer
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Sure Handed Ila's speed buff stacks with every one of those, the rest doesn't stack.

 

The reason is that Sure Handed Ila is in a different group (code wise) and only affects ranged attack speed and reload - while the others are all in the same group and buff attack speed universially (ranged, melee, casting and so on).

 

Ila's reload buff also used to stack with Swift Aim's reaload buff and also Gunner. Can't say if this is still the case though.

 

Other speed buffs that stack with everything are Two Handed Style (only one handed melee weapons when dual wielding), speed enchantment on weapons (only works when using the weapon for attacks), durgan steel on weapon or shield (same), Bloodlust (barb, universal), Gauntlets of Swift Action (universal) and Anitlei (Zahua, universal). Hope I didn't forget something.

 

All other speed buffs will suppress each other (better one suppresses the weaker one with the exception of Spelltongue's Time Siphon which supresses them all although it's only 15% - for whatever buggy reason).

 

I have not read elsewhere but what are the combinations to reach 0 recovery?

I reached level 9 and took Swift Action. Not sure if this is a wise choice?

 

Swift Action - 20%

Sure Handed Ila - 20%

Gauntlets of Swift Action - 15%

 

That's like 55% another 45%? Is it possible with a ranger? Out of so many builds.. Ranger is my top favorite at the moment :). Glad that i found this build here.

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Most speed buffs that stack do stack multiplicatively, so it gets easier with every additional speed bonus to reach 0 recovery. It's harder with Soulbound Weapons like Stormcaller's though because those can't be enchanted with Durgan Steel (another +15% multiplicative speed boost).

 

Swift Aim is not a good pick if you use a bow or a gun unless you plan to retrain at lvl 13. Because Twinned Arrows or Powder Burns are modals as well and don't work with Swift Aim.

 

If you don't plan to use either bow or gun or if you are willing to retrain at lvl 13 it's a good pick. Attack Speed is a multiplicative damage boost and therefore more effective than additive damage bonuses like +20% damage (if not fighting extreme DR).

In this case it also comes with -10 ACC which is a drawback of course, but a ranger can work around that with Marksman, Stalker's Link and Stunning Shots.

 

If you want to know when you hit 0 recovery try MaxQuest's PoE Attack Speed Calculator: https://naijaro.github.io/poe-speed-calculator/

 

But with Stormcaller it's not possible without consumables or spellbinding (using DAoM).

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Boeroer - do you know if durgan's refined enchant works at all on clothing?  I was under the impression it was a waste of ingots to put on clothing, but I noticed OP had it in the primary post

 

*edit nvm speed calculator asnwered my query, assuming its accurate. 

 

On a side note Im not sure if its a bug but I noticed Durgan's enchant doesn't seem to affect some armors (non souldbound, obviously).  Even after saves/loads, retries etc, for example, on saint's war armor durgan's does change the recovery rate for Eder;  But on Zahua with Argwes Adra Plate, it still reads at -50% recovery in the description, and appears not to affect his recovery in any way.  There's probably a post about this somewhere on the boards, but hey, since attack speed is the topic of the day...

Edited by BlackHat

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Durgan steel on clothes does not make you any faster, because recovery penalty will not drop below zero. It also reduces the recovery penalty of some robes that only have 5% recovery penalty to "only" 0, not -10 or something (see Berathian Robes in Raedric's Keep for example).

 

However, the 15% crit-to-hit conversion will work just fine even on clothes. Don't know if you want to use durgan steel only for that though. ;)

 

If durgan stell doesn't lower the recovery penalty on an armor you most likely encountered a bug (that I didn't hear of until today, so maybe you should post it). 

 

Also note that durgan steel enchantments on armor will not stack with enchantments that already adress the same thing (unlike on weapon and shields where it stacks). For example Hirbel's Protective Skin has a 10% crit-to-hit conversion called "Saveguarding" that will get suppressed by durgan reinforcement's 15% crit-to-hit conv.

 

Same thing happens if you have other items other than weapons/shields that affect the same thing as durgan reinforcement. Pilferer's Grip will give you 10% less armor penalty - but it doesn't stack with durgan reinforcement on the armor - it will get suppressed. 

 

Hope that helps. ;)


Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Hi, just bought Pillars a couple days ago, and was wondering if this build would be good for solo if i got a bear instead of a wolf, also if it is viable what order would you recommend picking the talents?

 

I started making a Anvil monk build, but i dont really find that fun to play (just gotten to the beetles in Caed Nua and not liking how long it takes to cast kicks/comusting wounds) from what ive read this build is faster to play

Edited by Eternal250

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Is there bug with the display of Brutal Take down? In the character level up screen, it shows 25.4 crush damage. But from wolf UI it shows 20.0 crush damage. If just 20.0 crush damage for 2 takedowns, is it worth getting this talent for my wolf pet? Otherwise it seems Faithful companion is a better skill pick.

 

Currently level 9 and i chose the level scale difficulty. Take quite some beating in Russetwood hehe. I was over confident. The lagufeths are tough but when i approach it was not fully rested and don't have Relentless Storm. Going to approach them again with fully rested party.

 

Then the Fampyr encounter. For once i have to take Snowcap for everyone except my wolf pet. Without it seems impossible. When any of my character gets charmed, and Kana's Dragon Thrashed pretty hurts  :biggrin:. I managed to take them out unscathed with a half par party (without high level abilities).

 

Also.. how much skill would you invest for said Ranger? I have 10 hard pumped levels of Survival,  4 levels of Stealth, 5 levels of Atheletics. Is 10 survival enough?

 

As per the guide suggest at level 10: Marksman or Weapon focus. Why would you pick Marksman over Weapon Focus? First WF add +6 ACC regardless of distant or near enemies. Plus Marksman only add +5 ACC?. If i'm taking WF i would be having +84 ACC.. is that enough or over? Should i be spending it on other skill instead?

 

Another question.. does Scion of Flame affects Dragon Thrashed? ... I'm also abusing spear.. did anyone abuse it? With spear equipped it seems you can pumped the +ACC skyrocket high. So i'm having Chanter equipping Spear+Shield. Sparta anyone?

Edited by Archaven

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It's 20 base damage. MIG bonus will get added (if any). I also think Merciless and Vicious Companion's bonus might get added.

 

Brutal Takedown is good because it only has to overcome 1/4th of enemy's crush DR.

 

Because Marksman works with any ranged weapon while Weapon Focus only works with the weapons in that group. However - you can take both because they stack. Stacking ACC is crucial, every point is benefical.

 

Scion of Flame does not affect Dragon Thrashed. All those talents (Scion of FLame, Heart of the Storm and so on as well as Sanctifierm Beast Hunter and so on don't work with DoT - Damage over time - effects). Scion of Flame profits from single weapon use (+12 ACC). You have to decide if you want more sturdyness or give your chant +12 ACC.

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It's 20 base damage. MIG bonus will get added (if any). I also think Merciless and Vicious Companion's bonus might get added.

 

Brutal Takedown is good because it only has to overcome 1/4th of enemy's crush DR.

 

Because Marksman works with any ranged weapon while Weapon Focus only works with the weapons in that group. However - you can take both because they stack. Stacking ACC is crucial, every point is benefical.

 

Scion of Flame does not affect Dragon Thrashed. All those talents (Scion of FLame, Heart of the Storm and so on as well as Sanctifierm Beast Hunter and so on don't work with DoT - Damage over time - effects). Scion of Flame profits from single weapon use (+12 ACC). You have to decide if you want more sturdyness or give your chant +12 ACC.

 

I'm kind of confused on how i should pick my 10th level ability. Is Interrupt +15 a good pick? I'm not sure about how inflated enemies stats were. If i were to pick Interrupt.. my ranger will has 48 Interrupt. Bearing in mind that Durance alone has more than 100 concentration, is picking Interrupt useful at all? 

 

Also, due to enemies high DR i find ranger really difficult in penetrating their defenses although having high rate of fire and ACC. Should ranger get the Penetrating Shot? If not mistaken that's a modal and level 13 we have twin arrows? How do you normally bypass enemies high DR with a Ranger?

 

Should i really just go with WF for more ACC? Also for Chanter.. normally you go for summon Ogre or Revive?

Edited by Archaven

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Interrupt is calculated like so: interrupt value + d100 > concentration = interrupt occurs.

 

So if you have an interrupt value of 48 you will interrupt Durance with nearly every second attack.

 

In my opinion Interrupting Blows is not worth it unless you have a very special build - (in my case it would be a special Barbarian, Druid or Wizard).

 

With a ranger you can bypass enemies' DR via Persistance (wounding = raw damage), with Stormcaller (-6 shock DR on hit) and/or Penetrating Shot and/or Ryona's Vambraces.

If you don't have Stormcaller yet Persistance is the way to go. You animal companion can punch through DR easily if you give him some talents like Predator's Sense, Merciless + Vicious Companion and Brutal Takedown. Penetrating Shot is quite cool with Twinned Arrows because it's +10 damage per shot instead of "only" +5 against targets that have DR5 or more. With Starcaller Penetrating Shot is only effective if the enemy has more than 10 shock DR (or ist immune to shock).

 

With the chanter I would use the Ogres as blockers. Do you have a priest?


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@Boeroer

 

"So if you have an interrupt value of 48 you will interrupt Durance with nearly every second attack."

 

Why would you say it will interrupt nearly every second attack? Are they cumulative? If i have 48 interrupt and Durance concentration of 103, it means i must roll 55 and above.  Considering taking average of d100 it's not likely that 2nd hit will interrupt. The issue i have with interrupt is that on POTD there are so many mobs that taking interrupt is not a good skill pick. WF would be a better choice as +6ACC will increase the probability of crits which the build is all about.

 

As for Brutal takedown, with only 2/encounter investing it in isn't a top skill pick as well. Unless if they make brutal takedown as a passive and works without the takedown then it would have been much better. Bear in mind 20 crush damage is really mediocre comparing with said Dragon Thrashed. Yeah i have a priest. In all my PT, i must have Durance, Aloth and Hiravias. For me these 3 are really "key" companions :). I did pick Ogres for my chanter though. Really many thanks Boeroer!. I can't believe you are still around and still playing with over 4K hours of playtime. Do you play other games? XD

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Because the chance is nearly 50% (roughly speaking) to cause an interrupt against Durance.

Whatever - I said that Interrupting Blows would not be my favorite pick, too - also because of the reasons you mentioned. I would def. prefer Weapon Focus.

 

Brutal Takedown is good in a full party and if you planned to use Takedown anyways (because more CC is always good). As I said before, its crush damage only has to overcome 1/4th of DR and can help to one- or two-shot enemies which is nice. The weird DR thing makes the 20 base damage a lot more useful. Also don't forget that 20 base damage is not bad per se. If you crit it's already 30 crush and it gets added on top of your takedown attack wich already does great damage - so no time loss for this additional crush damage. It's like adding a crushing lash to your takedown attack like FoD does.

 

Of course it's less damage than Dragon Thrashed (what is not? ;)) - but in this case the damage is applied instantly and comes in a spike (if you pile Predator's Sense and so on with Brutal Takedown) - and if it doesn't kill the enemy immediately it sends him prone. And all that while your ranger can still fire arrows. In this last playthrough I was impressed by Brutal Takedown which I never picked before I have to admit (got 100+ damage crits with Itumaak at lvl 10):  recent Brutal Takedown thread

 

I didn't play a lot of games for quite a while (except "Faster than Light") until I started PoE. Mostly because there weren't a lot of CRPGs that I liked. I don't play that much PoE recently - but I wanted to do one last playthrough with a priest of Eothas before Deadfire beta comes out. Actually I'm spending a lot more time on these forums than playing the game. Has become sort of a hobby and helps me to not completely forget my english lessons. ;)

Edited by Boeroer

Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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started on the stormcaller build and was wondering at what level I should try to go for the twin sting? looks like it is something that can only be gotten when the game is almost over. atm just got the stormcaller bow not even completed defiance city yet. but about jalfway through the questline in the city. just wondering if the story/game carriesover and I ould use the twin sting on next playthrough. for now going to use the bow and enjoy the game. go go lightning gadjet lol

Edited by myfur1958

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