[Class Build] Ranged Rogue PC Discussion (min/max)

[Psychevore]

Str: 18

Con: 3

Dex: 18

Per: 5 (Hearth Orlan minimum, I think)

Int: 18

Res: 15 (or whatever's left, usually 15)

 

Though for a rogue, I'd drop the Int to 3, push resolve to max and put everything left over in Perception. You really don't need the int.

[the streaker]

Pretty sure you don't make up for the +5 accuracy, +1 dex and + 1 strength of elves with the +10% hit-to-crit of orlan.

 

Also a few posts up there's 70-90 dps with ranged weapons? Holy crap that would be insane if true! Unfortunately nothing does anywhere near that much, I think too many people have been dicking around with that big spreadsheet and it's no good anymore.

Edited May 5, 2015 by the streaker

[MoxyWoo]

@MoxyWoo: By my calculations, due to enchantment restrictions, there isn't enough anvils for a secondary damage enchantment. Upgrading Good Friend to Exceptional and adding a +25% elemental lash damage might be more potent assuming accuracy isn't as valuable as a damage. So the question is this: is +4 accuracy or 10% more damage better?

 

Accuracy to me, rogue has enough damage modifiers on its own + hit to crit conversion, etc.  The only time they don't produce a crazy crit later on is when they miss or graze.. accuracy gets you past that.  I forget what the number were exactly, but it was like... well if you get +50% dmg from critting, and you get a +4 accuracy increase on that, along with the other categories being bumped up, it was like... more accuracy = more damage = the modifier didn't matter as much.

[MoxyWoo]

Pretty sure you don't make up for the +5 accuracy, +1 dex and + 1 strength of elves with the +10% hit-to-crit of orlan.

 

Also a few posts up there's 70-90 dps with ranged weapons? Holy crap that would be insane if true! Unfortunately nothing does anywhere near that much, I think too many people have been dicking around with that big spreadsheet and it's no good anymore.

 

Yeah, I used to pull reasonable numbers off my wizard and had like 35 dps at the top end which seemed about right in play.  Now that I think of it, that Arquebus line seems terribly high when melee attacks with the same modifiers and no reload should be whacking for much higher dps.

 

So I think its broken, sad... it does seem to give the ratios right but the actual dps seems crazy high.

[Crucis]

 

Resolve is good for all characters because interrupts are annoying.

 

Even just moving and getting interrupted was pretty maddening to me when a tank gatherer was suddenly stopped from positioning or similar.

 

On ranged rogue with warbow.. I'm always conflicted for them. I don't wanna micro them like some people do as I view them as a low maintenance class, yet like the chunky number they produce with the within 2 seconds sneak attack from the heavy hitting, heavy reload weapons.

to clarify.  my view of rogue is to have a good alpha and kill or severely hurt a monster.

 

i also view them as a class that doesn't need micro as much.

 

warbow hinders the 1st thing.

 

guns quickswitch helps but is just 1 more character to switch too.

 

crossbow offers the practical middle ground as enchants are easy and crit mod is not hurt either.  plus it reloads at half the time.

 

ps ty for the civil comments.. hope that clarified.

 

pps  on tab.  hope it reads ok.

 

edit:  Kilrach looks really good too...  i'm not sure what to comment on tho.  If you mean dps i use the attack speed spreadsheet.

 

 

I'm not so sure that ranged rogues don't require that much micro.  Seems to me that if you want to maximize the value of their sneak attack ability, you have to micro your party to produce some of the various effects that create sneak attack opportunities.  Of course, if you're not going to worry about them, and just let them fire away, more power to you.

 

I agree that Crossbows do offer an interesting middle ground between warbows and higher alpha arbalests, arquebusses, and pistols.

 

In my last party, I had my custom ranged rogue carry a high alpha weapon and a warbow.  She'd open battles with the high alpha weapon but switch to the warbow after firing that first sneak attack shot.  And while she was about half a level behind my PC throughout the game, until the PC and the companions had hit the level cap, my ranged rogue still was second in the party for damage through out (behind my PC monk).

 

 

It's a shame that there aren't more unique crossbows and arbalests, though.  Only 2 each. 

 

[Kilrach]

Accuracy to me, rogue has enough damage modifiers on its own + hit to crit conversion, etc.  The only time they don't produce a crazy crit later on is when they miss or graze.. accuracy gets you past that.  I forget what the number were exactly, but it was like... well if you get +50% dmg from critting, and you get a +4 accuracy increase on that, along with the other categories being bumped up, it was like... more accuracy = more damage = the modifier didn't matter as much.

 

 

Lol I'm just a tad obsessed with getting the biggest number ever. That being said, my current xbow if upgraded with Kith-slaying could be an alternative (total 1.8x damage, 13 accuracy) when dealing with harder Kith encounters and you need all the damage you can get (priest buffs supplying a ton of accuracy). Enchanted Good Friend would be use most of the time though (total 1.7x damage, 16 accuracy).

 

It'd be like a Witcher-type situation where you have two types of the same weapons with you lol - it's just a thought (:

Edited May 5, 2015 by Kilrach

[Kilrach]

 

I'm not so sure that ranged rogues don't require that much micro.  Seems to me that if you want to maximize the value of their sneak attack ability, you have to micro your party to produce some of the various effects that create sneak attack opportunities.  Of course, if you're not going to worry about them, and just let them fire away, more power to you.

 

I agree that Crossbows do offer an interesting middle ground between warbows and higher alpha arbalests, arquebusses, and pistols.

 

In my last party, I had my custom ranged rogue carry a high alpha weapon and a warbow.  She'd open battles with the high alpha weapon but switch to the warbow after firing that first sneak attack shot.  And while she was about half a level behind my PC throughout the game, until the PC and the companions had hit the level cap, my ranged rogue still was second in the party for damage through out (behind my PC monk).

 

 

It's a shame that there aren't more unique crossbows and arbalests, though.  Only 2 each. 

 

 

 

You just have to see for yourself how fast the reloading is stacking Gunner with Kana's chant.

I still micro a lot in the sense that I require a Marking weapon user (Kana for me) to aim the same targets and make sure Pallegina's close by for her buff.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Kilrach

[Crucis]

 

 

I'm not so sure that ranged rogues don't require that much micro.  Seems to me that if you want to maximize the value of their sneak attack ability, you have to micro your party to produce some of the various effects that create sneak attack opportunities.  Of course, if you're not going to worry about them, and just let them fire away, more power to you.

 

I agree that Crossbows do offer an interesting middle ground between warbows and higher alpha arbalests, arquebusses, and pistols.

 

In my last party, I had my custom ranged rogue carry a high alpha weapon and a warbow.  She'd open battles with the high alpha weapon but switch to the warbow after firing that first sneak attack shot.  And while she was about half a level behind my PC throughout the game, until the PC and the companions had hit the level cap, my ranged rogue still was second in the party for damage through out (behind my PC monk).

 

 

It's a shame that there aren't more unique crossbows and arbalests, though.  Only 2 each. 

 

 

 

You just have to see for yourself how fast the reloading is stacking Gunner with Kana's chant.

I still micro a lot in the sense that I require a Marking weapon user (Kana for me) to aim the same targets and make sure Pallegina's close by for her buff.

 

 

What are the underlying details of Marking?  How long does the effect endure?  Is there a requirement as to how close you have to be to the marked target for the effect to affect your ranged weapon user?  And so on.

 

Regardless, I have to admit that long reloading weapons don't hold much appeal to me aside from Durance who gets a +10 acc bonus from his Magran talent, and as an encounter opening weapon for my frontliners (who then switch to melee weapons, so reload isn't really an issue for them).  It's probably just a bias of mine, but I like faster reload weapons because they let me switch targets and respond to emerging threats and opportunities much quicker.  Also, I don't worry much about power-gamey things like DPS.  I just semi-role play the game and enjoy it in that way.

 

And I don't particularly like Chanters in this game, so I only keep Kana around long enough to finish his quest and then replace him with a Companion who is more to my liking and play style. I have mildly considered trying a Chanter PC who I could mold into more of a ranged sniper chanter than Kana seems to be.  Kana just seems too beefy to play the back row sniper, in the way a ranger or a rogue might (not comparing their relative abilities to produce damage so much as just a general impression).  Kana just seems built to be more of an off-tank than a sniper.  BTW, I have noticed that Chanters get a +1 in Mechanics as a class, so it seems like they'd be a decent alternative to a rogue as a dedicated trap and locksmith (particularly if you built the character with a background that gave them another +1 to Mechanics).

 

 

[Kilrach]

IIRC Marking has a 5m range and it only affects the closest ally (so just put him next to the rogue). As long as they are attacking the same target, the buff is in effect. You get the St. Garam's Spark fairly early into the game and Pliambo per Casitàs later on, so there's no problem having a ranged Marker.

 

Pallegina's my offtank (think she's better than Kana having ranged Deflection bonus) so just put her in front of the rogue. I guess Kana's replaceable in a way, but his chant affects not just my rogue as Durance and Pallegina uses reloading weapons too (if Eder is holding all the aggro on his own).

[Crucis]

IIRC Marking has a 5m range and it only affects the closest ally (so just put him next to the rogue). As long as they are attacking the same target, the buff is in effect. You get the St. Garam's Spark fairly early into the game and Pliambo per Casitàs later on, so there's no problem having a ranged Marker.

 

Pallegina's my offtank (think she's better than Kana having ranged Deflection bonus) so just put her in front of the rogue. I guess Kana's replaceable in a way, but his chant affects not just my rogue as Durance and Pallegina uses reloading weapons too (if Eder is holding all the aggro on his own).

 

This really seems to make "Marking" a LOT weaker and less valuable than one might think from reading its in-game description.

[Tigranes]

Sorry we weren't around for that, guys. Rather unpleasant. All the brains and guts on the floor have now been cleaned up!

[Kilrach]

This really seems to make "Marking" a LOT weaker and less valuable than one might think from reading its in-game description.

 

 

How so? It's pretty easy to set a formation to ensure that the Marker is always besides the rogue. The other members would be in front or to the OTHER side of the rogue. The Marking buff is always given to my rogue with this formation.

[Crucis]

 

This really seems to make "Marking" a LOT weaker and less valuable than one might think from reading its in-game description.

 

 

How so? It's pretty easy to set a formation to ensure that the Marker is always besides the rogue. The other members would be in front or to the OTHER side of the rogue. The Marking buff is always given to my rogue with this formation.

 

 

How so?  You really have to ask?  It's patently obvious.  The in-game description says nothing about having to be close to the Marker.  It implies that any and all of your allies will benefit from the marking without any requirement to be near the marker.  That by itself represents a significant degradation of the power of Marking.

 

[Kilrach]

It says "+10 Accuracy granted to an ally attacking the same target": where does it imply 'any and all alies' when it clearly states an ally? Then, it can be inferred that you probably have to be close or else how would it pick the ally to give the buff to?

 

If you want to complain about a flexible (and perpetual if done right) +10 accuracy buff (that's worth around two accuracy talents), I don't know what would satisfy you.

Edited May 5, 2015 by Kilrach

[Crucis]

It says "+10 Accuracy granted to an ally attacking the same target": where does it imply 'any and all alies' when it clearly states an ally? Then, it can be inferred that you probably have to be close or else how would it pick the ally to give the buff to?

 

If you want to complain about a flexible (and perpetual if done right) +10 accuracy buff (that's worth around two accuracy talents), I don't know what would satisfy you.

 

Where?  Every other member of your party is an ally.  I could have all 6 members of the party attacking the same target, but if only one is close to the Marker, only that one could get the bonus, if I understand you properly.

 

 

[Kilrach]

I don't get what's so confusing? It's not the only ability description that mentions "an ally". Look at Priest buffs and Paladin spells etc. - if it's a friendly single target spell, it would say "an ally". AoE buffs would be "allies" with the word in plural. It's consistent like that throughout the game - why would you think anything different?

[Crucis]

I don't get what's so confusing? It's not the only ability description that mentions "an ally". Look at Priest buffs and Paladin spells etc. - if it's a friendly single target spell, it would say "an ally". AoE buffs would be "allies" with the word in plural. It's consistent like that throughout the game - why would you think anything different?

 

Because I parse those sentences differently from you.

[peddroelm]

 

I don't get what's so confusing? It's not the only ability description that mentions "an ally". Look at Priest buffs and Paladin spells etc. - if it's a friendly single target spell, it would say "an ally". AoE buffs would be "allies" with the word in plural. It's consistent like that throughout the game - why would you think anything different?

 

Because I parse those sentences differently from you.

 

check the item description again  an is bolded

Edited May 5, 2015 by peddroelm

[Kilrach]

Just thought I'd post my stats after just completing the game