RPGWatch: Pillars of Eternity Review

[HiddenX]

Corwin's PoE review can be found here.

[CynicalP]

Thank you for sharing the review.  Nice folks who actual enjoy RPGs.

[Ohioastro]

There are some interesting points there.  In particular, I think that they hit upon something in terms of design - the early and midgame is usually the most compelling section of the lot, and to be honest that was true for me in PoE too.  (And in others - as far as I'm concerned, the high point of BG2 was definitely the lovely city that you hit immediately after escaping from Irenicus.)  It's a bit of a shame that Twin Oaks wasn't more developed - there are some truly clever ideas there.  (I'm referring mostly to the side quests, that basically fell off drastically after Act II - the main quest was fine by my book.)

[Marceror]

Needs more bile. How's it supposed to compete with other reviews?

[HiddenX]

Needs more bile. How's it supposed to compete with other reviews?

 

No - PoE has some design flaws IMHO, but at the end of the day Obsidian has managed to create a game that many fans really like.

 

For example: It is the most liked game on the RPGWatch Steam curation list.

 

I made a CRPG element-checklist for PoE with the CRPG Analyzer as well.

 

I personally hope PoE2 will be an enhancement to PoE1 like BG2 was to BG1.

And I really hope that PoE2 will feature turn-based combat, more world interactivity, more major C&C and NPC-schedules.

[Marceror]

 

Needs more bile. How's it supposed to compete with other reviews?

 

No - PoE has some design flaws IMHO, but at the end of the day Obsidian has managed to create a game that many fans really like.

 

For example: It is the most liked game on the RPGWatch Steam curation list.

 

I made a CRPG element-checklist for PoE with the CRPG Analyzer as well.

 

I personally hope PoE2 will be an enhancement to PoE1 like BG2 was to BG1.

And I really hope that PoE2 will feature turn-based combat, more world interactivity, more major C&C and NPC-schedules.

 

For what it's worth, my comment was oozing with sarcasm.

[Nakia]

Over all I think it a fair review.  I do like the enchanting and crafting and do as much as I can.  I do think OE was a bit parsimonious in providing some essential ingredients but still enjoy it.  I also found the inability to do even a little healing after battle frustrating.  If one person is low in health everyone has to rest.  Even on easy or normal you have to watch out for that and make sure you have potions and use them quickly.  The Endless paths aren't  a problem for me because I do them in parts which I think is what the devs intended.  I also think the XP for fighting monsters and other non-quest related things could be improved.

 

I love this game but nothing in this world is perfect not even in fantasy.

[Wintersong]

Needs more bile. How's it supposed to compete with other reviews?

Is there a metacritic of sorts for reviews now? 

[jools1980]

 

At least they gave me an opportunity to go and get myself a drink, or take a Bio break.

 

So this guy went and played Dragon Age: Inquisition every time a loading screen came up?

[Luckmann]

 

Needs more bile. How's it supposed to compete with other reviews?

 

No - PoE has some design flaws IMHO, but at the end of the day Obsidian has managed to create a game that many fans really like.

 

For example: It is the most liked game on the RPGWatch Steam curation list.

 

I made a CRPG element-checklist for PoE with the CRPG Analyzer as well.

 

I personally hope PoE2 will be an enhancement to PoE1 like BG2 was to BG1.

And I really hope that PoE2 will feature turn-based combat, more world interactivity, more major C&C and NPC-schedules.

 

 

... "Low-Fantasy"?

 

 

You literally punch gods to death and meet actual gods.

 

[Varana]

You don't.

 

They're not actual gods, depending on the definition of "god".

 

 

What exactly constitutes "Low" and "High" Fantasy and how much of element X can be in there (or not) before it crosses the line is probably a topic for another 30 pages of forum thread.

[Luckmann]

You don't.

 

They're not actual gods, depending on the definition of "god".

 

 

What exactly constitutes "Low" and "High" Fantasy and how much of element X can be in there (or not) before it crosses the line is probably a topic for another 30 pages of forum thread.

 

That really, really, really, really, really depends on your definition of "god". For all intents and purposes, they are literal gods. Arguing otherwise is meaningless semantics at best and theological retardation at worst. Also, I meant to say punch dragons to death, and meet literal gods.

 

 

And while it's debatable what exactly constitutes "low-" vs. "high-" fantasy, I don't think anyone can argue that Pillars of Eternity is low-fantasy with a straight face, with the aforementioned in mind. PoE flies somewhere north of Middle-Earth.

[HiddenX]

Low fantasy: Wikipedia

 

 

For their own purposes role-playing games sometimes use a different definition of low fantasy. GURPS Fantasy defines the genre as "closer to realistic fiction than to myth. Low Fantasy stories focus on people's daily lives and practical goals ... A Low Fantasy campaign asks what it's like to live in a world of monsters, magic, and demigods."^[13]

 

PoE would be a high fantasy game if you could walk on different planes of existence, like Mask of the Betrayer for example or Planescape Torment.

IMHO PoE is a classic party adventure in a gameworld that is very similar to medieval earth with some magic thrown in.

Edited April 25, 2015 by HiddenX

[redneckdevil]

Great review

[Luckmann]

Low fantasy: Wikipedia

 

For their own purposes role-playing games sometimes use a different definition of low fantasy. GURPS Fantasy defines the genre as "closer to realistic fiction than to myth. Low Fantasy stories focus on people's daily lives and practical goals ... A Low Fantasy campaign asks what it's like to live in a world of monsters, magic, and demigods."^%5B13%5D

 

PoE would be a high fantasy game if you could walk on different planes of existence, like Mask of the Betrayer for example or Planescape Torment.

IMHO PoE is a classic party adventure in a gameworld that is very similar to medieval earth with some magic thrown in.

 

 

So you decided to cherry-pick an excerpt from the middle of the article. That's.. remarkably dishonest, considering that the articles themselves state right there in the beginning:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_fantasy

Low fantasy is a subgenre of fantasy fiction involving "nonrational happenings that are without causality or rationality because they occur in the rational world where such things are not supposed to occur."^%5B1%5D Low fantasy stories are set either in the real world or a fictional but rational world, and are contrasted with high fantasy stories which take place in a completely fictional fantasy world setting with its own set of rules and physical laws.

Does PoE take place in it's own completely fictional fantasy world setting with it's own set of rules and physical laws? Without spoiling anything, yeah, you're goddamn right it does.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_fantasy

High fantasy is defined as fantasy fiction set in an alternative, fictional ("secondary") world, rather than the real, or "primary" world. The secondary world is usually internally consistent, but its rules differ from those of the primary world. By contrast, low fantasy is characterized by being set in the primary, or "real" world, or a rational and familiar fictional world, with the inclusion of magical elements.^{%5B2%5D%5B3%5D%5B4%5D%5B5%5D}

[Namutree]

 

I personally hope PoE2 will be an enhancement to PoE1 like BG2 was to BG1.

And I really hope that PoE2 will feature turn-based combat, 

 

So you don't want it to be an enhancement. You want to just be different. That's fine, but why be so quick to contradict yourself?

[HiddenX]

Turn based combat just works better in party based CRPGs IMHO. Look at Blackguards, Divinity: OS or Telepath Tactics as recent examples.

And while BG1 & BG2 brought back D&D to the PC - I still prefer Pool of Radiance (Goldbox series) turn based combat.

 

Good RTwP or RT combat in party CRPGs is possible, but I knew only a few that are really challenging & fun: Rage of Mages 1 & 2 comes to my mind.

Edited April 25, 2015 by HiddenX

[View619]

Turn based combat just works better in party based CRPGs IMHO. Look at Blackguards, Divinity: OS or Telepath Tactics as recent examples.

And while BG1 & BG2 brought back D&D to the PC - I still prefer Pool of Radiance (Goldbox series) turn based combat.

 

Good RTwP or RT combat in party CRPGs is possible, but I knew only a few that are really challenging & fun: Rage of Mages 1 & 2 comes to my mind.

 

Telepath Tactics isn't a CRPG, it's an SRPG in the same vein as Fire Emblem. There's no true exploration or anything that would categorize it as a CRPG imo.

 

If you design for RTwP then it can work as well as any TB solution. There's no point in the team going to turn-based after designing for and developing a system for RTwP, that's just scrapping work that's already been done. They need to improve their RTwP implementation for the future and worry about TB for their next title.

Edited April 25, 2015 by View619

[Ohioastro]

You can do something fun and creative within a lot of different structures.  I'm not a big fan of action gaming, for instance, but I really liked the Bioshock series - and even though I'm no longer young, with quicker reflexes, the Witcher series worked for me.

[HiddenX]

As long as you control only one character action gaming is no problem. It works well in Gothic, Witcher, Skyrim etc.. But in party based games, with lots of skills, spells and use of inventory items RTwP can become a chore with a lot of hectic micromanagement. But this is just my experience. Maybe they can improve on RTwP - something like 7,62 High Calibre - maybe the best RTwP game ever made.

Edited April 25, 2015 by HiddenX