savage attack + Vulnerable attack worth?

[helmino]

As the title say is it worth to take with that talent with a pike or estoc, a dual wield character with sabre or stiletto, or a bow user? They stack? The base classes for this are cipher or rogue, thanks in advance

Edited April 8, 2015 by helmino

[helmino]

No input guys?

[gkathellar]

IIRC, you can't use both at the same time.

[mrmonocle]

savage+vulnerable stack and are both bump up your fighter dps counter significantly

Edited April 9, 2015 by mrmonocle

[helmino]

Discordant voice xD have you tried?

[Kelstrom]

All offensive talents (modals) stack, but you can only use 1 defensive. You also cannot use 1 offensive and 1 defensive at the same time.

[helmino]

All offensive talents (modals) stack, but you can only use 1 defensive. You also cannot use 1 offensive and 1 defensive at the same time.

 

A rogue with reckless + savage is going to be immense xD

[gkathellar]

All offensive talents (modals) stack, but you can only use 1 defensive. You also cannot use 1 offensive and 1 defensive at the same time.

 

Ah.

 

That's ... really irritating.

[Odd Hermit]

Generally, if you're using a higher damage weapon, I think the attack speed loss will reduce your damage output more than the DR penetration increases it.

 

I don't believe either of them apply to bows(I've never thought to test it), but there's penetrating shot for that which is, like vulnerable attack, better for weaker damage but faster ranged weapons - or the blunderbuss.

[Odd Hermit]

dammit comcast

Edited April 9, 2015 by Odd Hermit

[Yosharian]

Savage Attack and Vulnerable Attack can be used together.  They're both very good.  Vulnerable Attack is excellent early on, and the attack speed loss is negligible.  Savage Attack becomes better once you are hitting harder, but it sacrifices accuracy which is sometimes not a good thing.

[Greensleeve]

They are fantastic and can indeed be used together. I use both on my Moon Godlike rogue. He crits for 60-80 depending on the target with dual sabres at level 6-7. This is using Resolution though, so numbers are slightly skewed when criting. Highly recommended on any character who dual wields. 

[durbal]

It's pointless for Vulnerable Attack.  Rogue damage becomes so high that DR mods hardly matter.  Why slow down attack speed when you're doing 50+ dmg/hit?  Why add 10% (actually less when you consider crits) damage for a 20% slowdown in attack speed?

Edited April 9, 2015 by durbal

[cavemandiary]

For some builds, it is very good. If you already have a high accuracy, -5 isn´t that big of a deal, whereas 20% extra damage is rather significant. Also, any char that is going to dualwield fast weapons (especially stilettos, since -DR works especially well when stacked) should take vulnerable attack. And yes, they stack.

[helmino]

With slow 2 hander is better go for vulnerable attack only so?

[dunehunter]

I wonder why the rule allows all Offensive Modals to be stackable, but Defensive Modals are not, anyone can explain to me the reason of this inconsistence? Why the developers set it in this way?

Edited April 9, 2015 by dunehunter

[Kanasuke]

I wonder why the rule allows all Offensive Modals to be stackable, but Defensive Modals are not, anyone can explain to me the reason of this inconsistence? Why the developers set it in this way?

Oversight imo

[MoxyWoo]

Personally think at the lower levels, its all about accuracy so Weapon Focus: Whatever goes into 2nd lvl.

 

Then you start to add in a class specific one usually.  YMMV, but most classes get a freebie or nice something at 4th.  Otherwise, Vulnerable attack is much better due to the flat bonus nature here.

 

Then its the quality of life talent like Two handed, or Two weapon for a dps.  No penalties, etc, at 6th.

 

Finally at 8+ I'd take Savage attack.  By this time, I have better weapons with accuracy so don't care.

[Climhazzard]

Vulnerable attack is very good if you're dual wielding fast weapons like monk fists.  But because of the way the grazes, hits, and crits are resolved, savage attack hardly seems worth it, you'll be losing as much damage from minus accuracy as you'll be gaining from +damage.

Edited May 3, 2015 by Climhazzard

[peddroelm]

Vulnerable attack is very good if you're dual wielding fast weapons like monk fists.  But because of the way the grazes, hits, and crits are resolved, savage attack hardly seems worth it, you'll be losing as much damage from minus accuracy as you'll be gaining from +damage.

fight where its clear cut win move to use savage attack are the "easy" fights where you can hit/crit foes easily anyway .. The hard fights when you struggle to land grazes - savage attack doesn't help ..  

 

Theoretically it should work nice vs low deflection high DR targets (low level animats ?)  ..

 

Definately not an early game pick - but a late game one .. Earlier on rogue because of reckless attack - but even on rogue - not an always on option like reckless attack ..

 

Consumables & accuracy buffs can also make savage attack  more worthwhile..

Edited May 3, 2015 by peddroelm

[Luckmann]

IIRC, you can't use both at the same time.

 

You can. And it's actually really good for some builds. My rapier duelist is getting some really good mileage out of it.