Limerick edit thread

[k1rage]

Why dont we just remove all the combat because killing people offends pacifists?

[Lasci]

 

No. YOU'RE misreading it.

 

Thanks for proving my point that it is entirely up to your own twisted and subjective mind to be offended about...

 

 

What part of my post was wrong? Can you show me where alcohol was mentioned in the limerick? Because you're telling me that I'm misreading the poem by inserting transphobia and homophobia while simultaneously asserting that there was alcohol involved. I just want you to show me where the poem mentions alochol.

[Darji]

 

Because even many transsexual people thought this is ridiculous.  And I am sorry but there are far fewer nut jobs out there than moderate ones. And these moderate ones are now fighting against censorship.  And thank you for insulting me.

 

Did they really? Which ones? How many?

 

First of all you should show me how many people were against this joke and that it was not a minority. Then I will show you that. Deal? Oh wait you can not. And I am sorry I am done talking to you since I do not want to talk to people who insult me.

 

So have a good day. 

[Fenrir007]

 

 

 

How is it logical to respond to the supposed notion that Obsidian is giving into angry mob demands by making angry mob demands of your own? Isn't that just as, if not worse than what the "SJW" people are doing? "I'm going to undermine everything Obsidian does financially." Really? That's what you are going to do? 

 

As a gay man myself, I had no issue with the joke in question, or any of the others I have seen. I'm not easily offended and I really don't care what some gamer nerd thinks about my lifestyle. 

 

Even if they did "give in" to the "demands," how exactly does that spell out the end of Obsidian (and from what some of you are suggesting, THE WORLD ITSELF?) Seriously, with all these new threads popping up, you guys are making more of an issue out of it than the idiots who took issue in the first place. Responding to a minority of "Having a female/gay/black character that isn't 100% against the stereotype is pure evil" touters by insulting the entire LGBT community (seriously, even when it's a feminist or racial issue, you guys always point to LGBT :/ ) any different?

 

I agree with you wholeheartedly. I found the limerick amusing. I just find the overall reaction to the situation hilariously bigoted and some of the comments here are not only irrational, but dangerously hateful and outright hurtful.

 

That makes Obisidians decision even more stupid. It was a very very small minority who was offended by it and they gave in. Now they get the backlash much much bigger since a lot of people apparently do not like censorship. Go figure.

 

 

Small minority? Says who? For all you know, you bigots could be the loud minority and there can be a silent majority. "Small minority" is your limited perception of the situation.

 

 

Did you check the official forums here? Or twitter?

[Volourn]

"But here's the thing: if the creators of the game decide that something is in poor taste and want to remove it from their work, that isn't censorship. It's only censorship if they felt forced to do something they wouldn't otherwise have done."
 

They were bullied into it. It wouldn't be in the game if it bothered them. PERIOD. But, the evil nazis made them do it.

 

Of course, the peoms where the wive murders the husband because she caught him cheating is a-ok. LMAO

[k1rage]

 

not my legal right per say buy my in practicality you can say much less than you used to, again its not necessarily the government doing it but you can nolonger say what you feel

 

You can say whatever you like.  You just can't do so without people disagreeing and calling it offensive if that's their opinion; that sort of robust disagreement seems like a positive thing to me.

 

Oh how I agree with you thats the beauty of free speech I can say something and you can disagree, but these days if I say something thats politically incorrect I can be fired from my job or even evicted from my living quarters. How is that free speech

[TEODEX]

 

 

 

 

;^)

 

 

Oh here we go again... Methinks that they are already sharpening their pitchforks and readying their torches. 

Let me be clear about this [Obsidian] those people there do NOT have the well being of your company in mind. I sure do hope that when you made the change you did so solely because it didn't live up to your standards. If you changed it because of these people then you will most probably not be hearing the end of it before you remove it completely. Do not try to appease people whom don't care about you or your products. 

 

 

I really hope so. Let them screw Obsidian a bit more so they learn their lesson. 

 

Let Magran burn them a bit for being this naive.

[sparklecat]

 

 

 

The only people allowed to decide what gender they are are those people themselves. Anyone else's opinion what it ought to be does not enter into it.

 

 

Not at all.  The only person allowed to decide a persons opinion's is themselves.  Anyone else's opinion what it ought to be does not enter into it.

 

A transperson can have the opinion that they are a woman.  What anyone else thinks is not required to have that opinion.  But if another person has the opinion that they are a man then that is also ok.  What anyone else thinks is not required to have that opinion.

 

Both those individuals are free to have whatever opinion they want.  Neither one is somehow infringing on the rights of the other by having that opinion.

 

You can identify yourself however you want to but no one is obligated to agree with you.

 

 

You're not obligated to refer to a person by their preferred gender, no.  You're just kind of a jerk if you don't.

 

[Luj1]

[Atheosis]

 

The outrage over this is beyond ridiculous from my perspective.  The joke is clearly offensive to homosexuals and transgenders.  Would the people who are supporting it and saying it shouldn't have been changed have the same attitude if it was a racist joke?

 

Except it isn't - You've purposely misread it to fit your need to find it offensive.

 

Man gets drunk - gets into bed with "woman". It isn't "woman" - He panics and hops off an edge, which kills him. In what way does this degrade homosexuality or transgendered people? That's right - it doesn't. Not wanting to sleep with someone is not a crime against gender or sexual orientation.

 

 

I have no need to find it offensive.  I find very few things offensive personally, and the joke doesn't move me one way or the other really.  That said, I have this novel ability to put myself in other peoples' shoes and get a sense for what they might be feeling.  It's called empathy.  Imagine being a member of a marginalized and abused group who has heard crap like this your whole life and has faced a lack of acceptance at every turn.  Imagine sitting down to play a computer game that has within it a joke that basically suggests a guy killed himself because he had sex with someone like you.  Given that you have dealt with this kind of crap all your life, how do you not get offended when seeing this?  If the joke was that he accidentally slept with a black girl and then killed himself in shame would that be okay too?  Just think about that for a second.

[Mungri]

 

 

 

I love how you think anyone will take you guys professed motives seriously when your posts lecture about how misgendering is ok.

 

Like, credibility went all the way out the window there.

Do you even know what "misgendering" means? Would you care to point me to what posts "misgender" somebody? I've been reading the replies here and I haven't seen anybody misgender anybody else. I might have glided over those parts you see so clearly, or you might just be making up words and definitions, like that twitter person and their "transmisogyny".

 

Here are some definitions:

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/misgender

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/misgender

 

Calling a trans woman "he" or "it" when their preferred pronouns are "she/her" is called misgendering. Transmisogyny is basically the intersection of transphobia and misogyny: misogyny that trans women face primarily because of their trans status. This isn't very difficult to understand. 

 

"Calling a trans woman "he" or "it" when their preferred pronouns are "she/her" is called misgendering."

Absolutelly, yes. Where's the trans woman, though? What trans woman are you talking about?

 

"Transmisogyny is basically the intersection of transphobia and misogyny: misogyny that trans women face primarily because of their trans status."

There's a word for this: transphobia. It's a word that can be used when talking about both trans women and trans men. It already exists and it's already seen as an awful thing, like homophobia. This isn't very difficult to understand.

 

 

I'll call it an 'it' if I want to call it an 'it' ... what it gonna do? Cry?

[wotdlois]

Just letting you know that I couldn't care less about these politics, nor about the actual joke. The only thing that matters to me is that Obsidian has proven today to be a company with NO INTEGRITY. This characteristic is very important to me and to every customer who cares about what happens with his money. I've been buying every Obsidian's game ever since it was created (yes, even DS3) because of your incredible potential and passion for games. Hell, I've been rooting for a lot of you guys ever since Fallout and Planescape and Arcanum. But unfortunately talent means nothing without integrity. If you had it you wouldn't have pressured the backer into changing his 500$ worth input into the game.

 

It was a fun ride guys but I will not give my money to a company with no integrity, a company who is more interested in the opinion of a bully than their loyal customer. It is simply a matter of principle. And because of this principle PoE was the last Obsidian's product I have ever bought.

 

Good Luck to you all.

I can assure you a PR agency instructed them to remove it, in order to mitigate any fallout moving forward, despite any protestations the may have had.  Integrity aside, it is a business that needs to operate in the public sector, so unfortunately has to bend when faced with this type of issue.  We don't have to agree with it however.     

[Longknife]

 

The entire GamerGate stance...

 

Last I checked there was no "#gamergate" prescence or interest at all in this until the SJW's (as usual I might add) decided to name their opposition "obvious GG supporters" because it's convenient to do so.

 

I don't see how a movement that attempts to fight corruption in games journalism relates to censorship in a product - Sure there are some similarities in having a small minority dictate the order of business, but this is clearly not a "GamerGate versus SJW" issue.

 

 

At the very least, it's still relevant to GamerGate symbolically. This is the exact same tone of conflict that GamerGate's been about from the start.

 

If you didn't know, it relates because while it is about corruption, the shield that has been used by the journalists is that it's actually about gamers being sexist, misogynist, transphobic, homophobic etc, to the point where those cards get played very, VERY often. Thus, this entire discussion parallels GamerGate vs. SJW perfectly. To deny that would either be dishonest or naive, in my opinion.

[Mansen]

What part of my post was wrong? Can you show me where alcohol was mentioned in the limerick? Because you're telling me that I'm misreading the poem by inserting transphobia and homophobia while simultaneously asserting that there was alcohol involved. I just want you to show me where the poem mentions alochol.

 

 

The part where you imply that the limerick was written with the sole intent and purpose to repress the homosexuals and transgendered people, when it is clearly entirely up to personal and subjective reason. Also - to quote the typical television or motion picture. [No Transgendered people were harmed during filming], which is entirely on point since the only one to get hurt here is the poor bloke who ended up in bed with something he didn't expect or wish and fell to his death.

[Volourn]

HAHAHAHA! They called the backer a 'crybaby'. HAHAHAHAHA!

[Nosey and Opinionated]

"But here's the thing: if the creators of the game decide that something is in poor taste and want to remove it from their work, that isn't censorship. It's only censorship if they felt forced to do something they wouldn't otherwise have done."

 

They were bullied into it. It wouldn't be in the game if it bothered them. PERIOD. But, the evil nazis made them do it.

 

Of course, the peoms where the wive murders the husband because she caught him cheating is a-ok. LMAO

Proof? You're assuming the side you want to believe. Their claim is to the contrary.

[Bayzent]

Inb4 this

 

Now, I do support trans people same as I did with Gay Marriage in my country, this actually has nothing to do with trans people, it has to do with people who get off by forbidding other people's things and having their own views over ruled by force into things.

 

I have issues with Fundamentalists.

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

 

 

The only people allowed to decide what gender they are are those people themselves. Anyone else's opinion what it ought to be does not enter into it.

 

 

Not at all.  The only person allowed to decide a persons opinion's is themselves.  Anyone else's opinion what it ought to be does not enter into it.

 

A transperson can have the opinion that they are a woman.  What anyone else thinks is not required to have that opinion.  But if another person (referred by me as Person B - aluminiumtrioxid) has the opinion that they are a man then that is also ok.  What anyone else thinks is not required to have that opinion.

 

Both those individuals are free to have whatever opinion they want.  Neither one is somehow infringing on the rights of the other by having that opinion.

 

You can identify yourself however you want to but no one is obligated to agree with you.

 

 

That said, others are also free to have the opinion that Person B in this scenario has incredibly poor manners.

 

Edit: curses! Ninja'd.

Edited April 4, 2015 by aluminiumtrioxid

[ComradeGoby]

 

And don't use terrorist in this context.

He can use terrorist in any context he wants. What are you, ****ing President of the English Language?

 

 

You can't use languague that some people don't arbitraily approve of because otherwise it's "problematic" or "toxic" or "hate speech (defined by them of course)" or "sexist" etc etc

 

I for one love that language is something to be controlled by interest groups instead of being free because otherwise my filthy man brain might use it wrong

[Rance]

The fire rises...

[Nosey and Opinionated]

 

"But here's the thing: if the creators of the game decide that something is in poor taste and want to remove it from their work, that isn't censorship. It's only censorship if they felt forced to do something they wouldn't otherwise have done."

 

They were bullied into it. It wouldn't be in the game if it bothered them. PERIOD. But, the evil nazis made them do it.

 

Of course, the peoms where the wive murders the husband because she caught him cheating is a-ok. LMAO

Proof? You're assuming the side you want to believe. Their claim is to the contrary.

 

Or were you just trolling me?

[Fenrir007]

Okay, so, this was released before and was completely okay to them.

 

Then, a misandrist on twitter decides to summon her hatemob to start a jihad against some content that affects her personal sensibilities - an assumption based on a flawed interpretation of the text (one that Obsidian agrees with, considering they let the reworded text outright state the hatemob didn't get the joke).

 

Only THEN, Obsidian removes it.

 

They ignore any sort of discussion with backers to do it. They don't tell us HOW that was offensive. They try to stealthly pass it without mentioning on the patch notes (only making up a backer response AFTER they saw it wouldn't blow over). They choose not to allow the players to either toggle it or sticky the player-made mod to remove the offending text from those who felt triggered by it.

 

And they remain gagged on the issue. No interactions at all, even with the very people that made this game financially viable in the first place.

 

Do you really think it's that much of a stretch to consider they totally caved in?

 

 

People are very quick to turn this into a censorship vs. bigotry issue. But here's the thing: if the creators of the game decide that something is in poor taste and want to remove it from their work, that isn't censorship. It's only censorship if they felt forced to do something they wouldn't otherwise have done.

 

The flawed assumption here is that Obsidian is caving in to pressure somehow. I think it's more likely that they were alerted to content that they didn't care for and wouldn't have chosen to include in the first place had they caught it. The latest update from them suggests as much.

[k1rage]

 

Just letting you know that I couldn't care less about these politics, nor about the actual joke. The only thing that matters to me is that Obsidian has proven today to be a company with NO INTEGRITY. This characteristic is very important to me and to every customer who cares about what happens with his money. I've been buying every Obsidian's game ever since it was created (yes, even DS3) because of your incredible potential and passion for games. Hell, I've been rooting for a lot of you guys ever since Fallout and Planescape and Arcanum. But unfortunately talent means nothing without integrity. If you had it you wouldn't have pressured the backer into changing his 500$ worth input into the game.

 

It was a fun ride guys but I will not give my money to a company with no integrity, a company who is more interested in the opinion of a bully than their loyal customer. It is simply a matter of principle. And because of this principle PoE was the last Obsidian's product I have ever bought.

 

Good Luck to you all.

I can assure you a PR agency instructed them to remove it, in order to mitigate any fallout moving forward, despite any protestations the may have had.  Integrity aside, it is a business that needs to operate in the public sector, so unfortunately has to bend when faced with this type of issue.  We don't have to agree with it however.     

 

but fallout was released years ago...

[Lasci]

 

What part of my post was wrong? Can you show me where alcohol was mentioned in the limerick? Because you're telling me that I'm misreading the poem by inserting transphobia and homophobia while simultaneously asserting that there was alcohol involved. I just want you to show me where the poem mentions alochol.

 

 

The part where you imply that the limerick was written with the sole intent and purpose to repress the homosexuals and transgendered people, when it is clearly entirely up to personal and subjective reason. Also - to quote the typical television or motion picture. [No Transgendered people were harmed during filming], which is entirely on point since the only one to get hurt here is the poor bloke who ended up in bed with something he didn't expect or wish and fell to his death.

 

 

"Fell" to his death. Instead of killing himself because he was ashamed that he slept with someone who was 1) presenting themself as a woman and, 2) was, in fact, a male. 

 

If there's anyone who is painting the poem in a certain light in order to serve his agenda, it's the flagrant bigots flooding this thread.

[YourFaceIsTriggeringMe]

I'll call it an 'it' if I want to call it an 'it' ... what it gonna do? Cry?

I don't know, man. I suppose they'll be angry at you. Why are you quoting me, anyway?