Companion's Builds, ouch.

[AgentTBC]

There are some other changes.  I started a new game so I will check the companions as I pick them up.  But Aloth moved 4 pts from Perception to Dexterity.  So he loses a bit of deflection and gains action speed which I think is a good change.  He's still a control mage and not a damage dealer but that's obviously the way Obsidian wants it and is not a bad thing necessarily: 

 

So Aloth went from:

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res
• 12   10   11   16   16   13

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res
• 12   10   15   12   16   13

[gandalfrockman]

Some folks are saying their Aloth and Eder's stats are diferent on a new playthrough so looks like there's more after all.

  

Hmmm... Anyone want to do a quick "collect all the characters as fast as possible" run?    

Sounds like the stat fixes didn't apply retroactively as intended.  

If they are still fubar'd I'll probably slap a mod together to fix this saturday, I think I've got a working method to pull apart and put back together the asset files without fussin about with the materials nonsense.    

 

Would like to see suggested stat blocks for each from more experienced players; I know my way around unity and modding/file manipulation, but I have less than 10 hours in PoE right now.  (Not for lack of trying, just haven't had the free time yet).  

Guidelines should be as follows to avoid min/maxiness:  

-No more than one 18+ score before race bonuses.  (This does not mean everyone should have an 18)

-No score over 20 after race bonuses 

-No scores lower than 10  

-No change in total attribute scores.  

-Ideally it shouldn't be a set of scores that shoehorns them into a specific build  

  

This should give us viable characters without min/maxing.

Edited April 3, 2015 by gandalfrockman

[limaxophobiacq]

Aloth with higher Dex and less Per seems good. Int (16 isn't honeslty that bad) + Dex is better for wizard than Int + Might if you're going purely for status effects over damage, and he's still has +5 accuracy bonus from being a wood elf. As long as you have other characters who can put out DPS I think he'd be fine.

Edited April 3, 2015 by limaxophobiacq

[DragonDai]

I don't think I'm really qualified to give you scores, but you might reconsider the "No scores lower than 10" thing. A 9 or an 8 isn't really "min/maxing" but can add flavor to the character (so and so is slightly less intelligent than average or slightly less hardy, etc).

[AgentTBC]

Eder:

 

from -

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 16 - 16 - 11 - 10 - 13 - 12

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 16 - 16 - 11 - 12 - 10 - 13

So he loses a bit of INT and gains a bit of PER and RES which is an excellent change for a fighter.

 

It looks like they made good but modest changes which is probably the way it should be.

[Covi]

Too bad this isn't retro-active.... :-/

I think I will just continue with the old companions..

[gandalfrockman]

I don't think I'm really qualified to give you scores, but you might reconsider the "No scores lower than 10" thing. A 9 or an 8 isn't really "min/maxing" but can add flavor to the character (so and so is slightly less intelligent than average or slightly less hardy, etc).

 

Point taken, what do you feel would be a good minimum?

 

 

Eder:

 

from -

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 16 - 16 - 11 - 10 - 13 - 12

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 16 - 16 - 11 - 12 - 10 - 13

So he loses a bit of INT and gains a bit of PER and RES which is an excellent change for a fighter.

 

It looks like they made good but modest changes which is probably the way it should be.

 

Hey if the consensus is that they have satisfactorily resolved the problem; thats great, but I don't think Eder was one of the worst offenders. I'm withholding judgement until we see the rest of the cast.

[HozzM]

Too bad this isn't retro-active.... :-/

I think I will just continue with the old companions..

 

Yeah...I guess there was some kind of problem making it retroactive.  I assumed it would be.

[Luckmann]

 

Some folks are saying their Aloth and Eder's stats are diferent on a new playthrough so looks like there's more after all.

 

Durance too.

 

They were pretty mild with it though. Aloth lost some Per and gained some Dex but still has a whopping 12 Mig

 

Eder just got -3 int which went into Per/Res

 

Durance got a couple points moved from Con into Int, still has 19 Res

 

 

Talents don't seem to've changed.

 

 

From the look of it none of them are PotD worthy for me, unfortunately.

 

 

Wow, so they did the complete opposite of what they should've done. Instead of fixing the Attributes, they decided to screw around with the character/thematic-based Attributes the CNPC:s had.

 

That's just... ****ing sad to see. I was really hoping for better from Obsidian.

[AgentTBC]

I'll update with the other dudes in a new playthrough as I pick them up.   I'm going for Durance now.

[gandalfrockman]

I'll update with the other dudes in a new playthrough as I pick them up.   I'm going for Durance now.

  

Awesome!  

Honestly, I'd like all of them to be at least viable for PotD even if they aren't optimal.  

[Luckmann]

Eder:

 

from -

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 16 - 16 - 11 - 10 - 13 - 12

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 16 - 16 - 11 - 12 - 10 - 13

So he loses a bit of INT and gains a bit of PER and RES which is an excellent change for a fighter.

 

It looks like they made good but modest changes which is probably the way it should be.

 

Not only is it terrible to see them change the Companions rather than fixing the Attribute issues (and thus screwing with the character concepts) but this is pretty far from a "excellent change for a fighter". Fighters actually benefit greatly from Intellect (...who doesn't?). If Edér is intended as a Tank (and face it, he is; it's the only reason he's a Fighter and not a Rogue) he would have been better served to lose Might or Constitution.

 

So not only do they not fix the Attributes, and not only do they instead opt to change the characters' character, but the changes aren't even good. It's like compound incompetence, with interest. Seriously, what the hell?

 

Edit: Why is Intellect good for Fighters, you ask? Duration. That's why. Duration of Knockdowns and virtually all Fighter abilities.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Luckmann

[Odd Hermit]

I've already got Durance

 

Durance

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 15 -- 9 -- 9 - 13 - 19

to

 

Durance

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 13 -- 9 -- 9 - 15 - 19

It's better but it's still not great.

 

I also got Kana, but he has no change(which is fine, he was one of the better ones already).

 

I was considering burning through to grab them all but I started on PoD and I have a few things to do today so I don't think I'll go after the rest.

[Veevoir]

How about Frau Terrible Sagani?

Anybody grabbed her yet? I really want to learn the story, but the inner munchkin in me cries bloody tears everytime I see her..

[Luckmann]

I've already got Durance

 

Durance

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 15 -- 9 -- 9 - 13 - 19

to

 

Durance

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 13 -- 9 -- 9 - 15 - 19

It's better but it's still not great.

 

I also got Kana, but he has no change(which is fine, he was one of the better ones already).

 

I was considering burning through to grab them all but I started on PoD and I have a few things to do today so I don't think I'll go after the rest.

 

Hahahahaha, Intellectual Durance, oh wow. This is just so sad to see. This is just.. wow. I don't have words. I simply have no words for what this is. Not in Swedish, Danish, German, nor English, I can think of words to describe how asinine this is.

[AgentTBC]

I agree that if Eder was to be a pure tank he would have been better off losing Might or Con.  But it's obvious that Obsidian intended the companions to be jack of all trades types, maybe with a focus on one area but not exclusively.  Which is what they did with Eder.  He's a bit better as a tank than he was by gaining some deflection but he still has the might to do a bit of damage if you prefer.  I don't think losing a couple tenths of a second on knockdowns is a big change.   And I think Aloth's change was quite good.

[Veevoir]

Well, he is smart, just blinded by his misplaced faith which is represented by resolve.

I'd say minor tweaks are welcome.

[AgentTBC]

edit:  This is to Luckmann

 

You're all over the place;  Eder losing a couple points of intellect because a couple of his fighter abilities lose duration is breaking the character and a travesty but Durance gaining a couple points of intellect which increases the duration of basically every spell he has is breaking the character and a travesty.  I'm not sure you're looking at this fairly.

Edited April 3, 2015 by AgentTBC

[AgentTBC]

I know somebody else posted Durance but since I'm posting them all as I pick them up, I will confirm.

 

Durance -

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 15 -- 9 -- 9 - 13 - 19

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 13 -- 9 -- 9 - 15 - 19

[Veevoir]

edit:  This is to Luckmann

 

You're all over the place;  Eder losing a couple points of intellect because a couple of his fighter abilities lose duration is breaking the character and a travesty but Durance gaining a couple points of intellect which increases the duration of basically every spell he has is breaking the character and a travesty.  I'm not sure you're looking at this fairly.

You're not reading his point right. Moving any stat points from character RP vision to satisfy their mechanical needs (Eder more tanky. Durance more aoe-y) is travesty against the RP.

 

Not said that I agree with it though, as for me the attribute distribution of companions is more of a testament to the fact their stats were set before attribute changes of post-v435, not because of RP only. So they do need minor tweaking. But some stuff should not be touched (eg. being Durance's 19 resolve which crucially ties to the way his character behaves).

From RP point I don't mind Eder losing some Int, he has his wisdom but in the end he is a bit of a half-wit farmboy.. Nor do I grieve after Durance losing some PER, not really what determined him as a person, being perceptive.

Edited April 3, 2015 by Veevoir

[Peaceful Anarchy]

Did a run to collect the companions on easy

 

Sagani

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 13 - 14 - 11 - 18 - 11 - 10

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 15 - 12 - 15 - 13 - 13 - 10

 

Pallegina

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 12 - 13 - 11 - 15 - 13 - 14

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 12 - 13 - 11 - 14 - 13 - 15

 

Hiravias

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 15 - 14 - 13 - 11 - 10

to

• Mig- Con- Dex- Per- Int- Res

• 14 - 13 - 12 - 13 - 15 - 10

 

 

Grieving Mother no change

[falchen]

Eder already wasn't terible but a few extra defense points help, as does Int for Durance, he's a buffer/debuffer so what else would he need?

 

Sagani, Grieving Mother and Hiravias needed changes the most so I'm crossing my fingers for what they got.

[gandalfrockman]

 

Grieving Mother no change

 

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAGAGAGAGAGAHGAHAH!!!! 

FLLBBBLLBLT!!! 

RASSASFRASSASSONUVA FRGAGAMARAGHM AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!

WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!

YARAARGAGRGAGGGHA! 

HAHAHAHAHAH HAH AHAH HAHA HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! 

HNNNNNNNNNNNNNGGGGH!  

  

EDIT:Spelling corrections.

Edited April 3, 2015 by gandalfrockman

[AgentTBC]

Those changes look good.  Hiravias gains some more duration on his spells which is great and Sagani gets a bit more damage, duration, and interrupt.   Pellegrino's change makes no difference whatsoever but makes sense from an RP perspective.  If Grieving Mother really didn't change at all then she's still crap.  Maybe she's supposed to be crap RP-wise?  I didn't play enough to find out before the patch since I was waiting for the bug fixes and kept starting over to try different classes.

 

I think all of the changes are good and welcome with the possible exception of Grieving Mother's lack of non-crapitude.  But since I settled on my first playthrough being a cipher that's okay.

[falchen]

Yea, expect for Grieving mother the stats are fine now I'd say. Only talents left to fix.

Edited April 3, 2015 by falchen