Area looting confirmed

[Qbert]

I like this feature in the EE's and assuming it is implemented well here, i applaud the decision.

[Ohioastro]

There is a development cost associated with toggles, and this looks to be a poor use of them. I understand objections to autoloot. But I really am paying attention to the people complaining about this, because it tells me that they're all about aping mechanics of older games unthinkingly. And this was a terrible, tedioustedious affair in BG that really put me off the game. Good riddance to a bad idea in my book.

[Gairnulf]

 

Were there scrolls?  If no,

Oh, another aspect lost in transition, by the way. I liked to see what was in the loot bag more or less before looting. Icons for scrolls, weapons and armor - all of that gone and replaced with 1 generic loot bag.

 

 The sneaking away of varied loot items didn't go unnoticed for me, but I gave it a rather low priority. I agree with you.

 

 

Playing games is troublesome now.

I have a Josh-style fix. Why don't we improve area looting with auto-looting, and then whenever you find items that are superior to your equipment, they are automatically equipped, and inferior items are automatically converted into gold. That'd solve a lot of the looting problems. Also, let's make looting not require clicking even once, it's done automatically by the game after the fight is finished. And fights should be resolved automatically, at least make an option for that for god's sake, cause all the clicking, ugh...

 

 You should make that suggestion at the Bioware boards. They'll love you for it.

 

 

 

 

tons of fun!

If that's your argument, then it's pretty weak:

• It's still more fun than navigating a loot interface with two rows of items and a scroller. I hope you haven't forgotten how the loot interface looks:

   

  

• In a situation as the one in your screenshot (which is a fairly rare case), I would simply skip many of those containers because I wouldn't feel like going through all of them. Someone else wouldn't. It's up to the player's choice.
• Call me whatever you want, but I feel rewarded to open containers after a battle and pick up the loot left by enemies, or no longer guarded by them. And so do many players. When I'm unpacking 5 presents I prefer to undo 5 wrappings. Yes, I know it's impractical but it feels good, and feels fun for me, and ultimately that's one of the most common reasons to play a game. The "rational thing to do" is to have area loot. And the even more rational thing to do is not to play games on your computer, isn't it, but we don't go that far.

Pretty sure that's what I said, Sensuki...

Do we really need to explain that overlapping containers' contents being shown in the same loot window and area loot are different things? If yes, I'll leave it to Sensuki

 

At least this nonsense can be modded out it seems.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Gairnulf

[Bester]

 

tons of fun!

 

Tons of skipping. By looking at this screenshot, I know immediately there's nothing of value on the ground.

[GreyFox]

If this was done like the EE games with a little toggle button then fine, but if it's the ONLY way to loot its bad and just wasted time that should have been spent on sound/volume options.  

 

 

 

 

 

[CaptainMace]

I understand that some people don't like the fact it's not optional. But the jokes about the game playing itself as a "josh-style fix" are totally undeserved. They added that feature because people were asking for it. Quit b*tching already.

 

Tons of skipping. By looking at this screenshot, I know immediately there's nothing of value on the ground.

 

 

 No ability to drop items or leave them inside a container in the world once you've taken them.

The stash - welcome to your limitless inventory. Such fun.

 

 

No ability to make room in your inventory or stock things in a limitless one.
Limitless inventory.

Come on mate, at some point you have to pick one thing to hate, disliking both doesn't make that much sense.

Edited March 13, 2015 by CaptainMace

[Shiroco]

 

Going through all the features that Obisdian has introduced into PoE, or that were present in the IE games and have been removed, I can hardly name any improvements:

1. Engagement - I agreed with it being buggy and hoped it would be fixed. Exploits are still possible.
2. All-Party stealth
3. No projectiles for ranged weapons - also, I am one of the people who ask "Why is firearms' damage based on Might?" Please, come tell me to "STFU". Thanks for the balance there.
4. No ability to drop items or leave them inside a container in the world once you've taken them.
5. The stash - welcome to your limitless inventory. Such fun.
6. Characters running by default, no way to switch to walking - actually PS:T had this too. I don't think it was an improvement there either, but that's just me.
7. HUD interface, combat log - a mess, no configuration possible through options
8. Sounds sliders...
9. Pickpocketing - cut
10. Now this - clicking a container to loot its contents is too much common sense, let's unite the containers which are close by.

None of these is the end of the world, but taken together they make me think Obsidian should have stuck to replicating the IE games more, and spent less time and efforts in trying to improve them.

 

New things I can think of, that I think are positive, and even very positive:

1. Scripted interactions
2. The in-dialogue descriptions of characters' expressions and body language
3. The long/short-term health
4. ... help me out here. If there is anything else, I'm having a hard time trying to remember it.

 

 

@10) Everyone is entitled to their opinion and i guess it is ok to dislike the feature even if I myself can't comprehend the reasoning. I will admit that it is true that I myself was anxious to see what the leader of a group carried but (at least for me) the difference between "let's see what the leader had" and "let's see what that encounter had" is pretty small. I defeated the group and I'll get my reward. Clicking every corpse may be closer to PnP rules but I think that this convenience feature won't take much (if any) from the experience away. It would be nice if a toggle is added later but I'm sure that it won't hurt the game if not.

 

I can understand the complaints about the unlimited stash and that it takes choice away (what to keep, what to not take with you) but I myself almost always took everything with me even if it meant coming back.

 

Of course I agree about several things (no ammo, no pickpocketing, maybe the engagement thing) but those are things that may get included in an expansionpack or a sequel. I'm going to play PoE without a checklist comparing it to the ie games and based upon that rate the game. I'm just going to play it and rate the game based on the "fun" I had with it.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Shiroco

[Sensuki]

Pretty sure that's what I said, Sensuki...

You were calling it area loot when it isn't. Although, you may just be here trolling again.

[Stun]

 

tons of fun!

^Throne of Bhaal, Sendai's Enclave, slave tunnels.

 

Not a meaningful example of anything because:

 

1)There is exactly nothing worthwhile to be looted on those corpses. And no, those dozens of +1 axes, and +2 halberds are NOT meaningful to pick up in ToB, even if 'vender trash accumulation' is the motivator (and if you're having money problems in ToB, you're playing it wrong already. A 3 meter loot range won't save you.)

2) A 3M radius looting mechanic wouldn't make much of a difference here...since there are many, many packs of enemies and you'll still have to click on 20-30 corpses before you're done with that one passageway.

 

 

In any case, I'm not necessarily against this mechanic in PoE, considering the nature of the loot in the game. If 90% of all enemies drop nothing but crafting supplies and generic gear, then sure, a mechanic that speeds up the gathering process would be welcome, I suppose.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Stun

[Bester]

A 3M radius looting mechanic wouldn't make much of a difference here

 

 

Heh, actually, you'd have pretty hard time guessing which loot bag you took a look into and which you didn't with a 3m radius mechanic. Another example of why this mechanic is bad.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Bester

[Gfted1]

Wooo Hooo! Love it.

 

 

Heh, actually, you'd have pretty hard time guessing which loot bag you took a look into and which you didn't with a 3m radius mechanic. Another example of why this mechanic is bad.

I cant remember but doesn't the loot you just looted disappear? So, the loot that is left is the loot you didn't loot yet?

[Tartantyco]

 

Pretty sure that's what I said, Sensuki...

You were calling it area loot when it isn't. Although, you may just be here trolling again.

 

 

No, area loot is precisely what it is. It's just a very small radius. If it wasn't area loot, you'd be clicking on the body that's on top in that area, that loot bag would disappear and reveal the loot bag of the next, that you would then have to click. This is exactly what people in this thread are complaining about, not being able to loot individual bodies.

 

PoE's radius is 3m. BG was about 1m? 1/2m? Something like that. On this forum, that is apparently the difference between genius and literally being Hitler.

[Stun]

but it needed refinements.

It didn't, really. And the proof is on the backer beta feedback forum.

 

Browse it... page by page. Show me a single thread, since the backer beta was released last august, where anyone complained that individual corpse looting was something that needed to go. You'll find none. Because people were ok with it.

 

It's noteworthy that one can find a few threads where backers are complaining about that glow over the corpses. Of course, the Area looting feature they just put in does not change this.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Stun

[Valmy]

I like this feature in the EE's and assuming it is implemented well here, i applaud the decision.

 

If you EE players like it, I will probably be fine with it. How big is the radius?  I guess we do not know this yet.

[Stun]

the radius is 3 meters....or about as big as the standard wizard AOE spell in this game

[Gairnulf]

 

No ability to drop items or leave them inside a container in the world once you've taken them.

The stash - welcome to your limitless inventory. Such fun.

 

No ability to make room in your inventory or stock things in a limitless one.

Limitless inventory.

 

Come on mate, at some point you have to pick one thing to hate, disliking both doesn't make that much sense.

 

This is either a very sorry attempt at trolling, or you don't understand what I've written. I call the stash "limitless inventory". I want to be able to put things back in containers if I don't want to keep the things. What part of this didn't you understand?  

 

@10) Everyone is entitled to their opinion and i guess it is ok to dislike the feature even if I myself can't comprehend the reasoning. I will admit that it is true that I myself was anxious to see what the leader of a group carried but (at least for me) the difference between "let's see what the leader had" and "let's see what that encounter had" is pretty small. I defeated the group and I'll get my reward. Clicking every corpse may be closer to PnP rules but I think that this convenience feature won't take much (if any) from the experience away. It would be nice if a toggle is added later but I'm sure that it won't hurt the game if not.

I can understand the complaints about the unlimited stash and that it takes choice away (what to keep, what to not take with you) but I myself almost always took everything with me even if it meant coming back.

Great, that's something CaptainMace can't understand.

 

Of course I agree about several things (no ammo, no pickpocketing, maybe the engagement thing) but those are things that may get included in an expansionpack or a sequel. I'm going to play PoE without a checklist comparing it to the ie games and based upon that rate the game. I'm just going to play it and rate the game based on the "fun" I had with it.

Generally everything I write is an opinion, unless it's obviously a fact (like a "the Earth revolves around the Sun" statement). Just in case though, I usually explicitly state that I'm just giving opinions. Regretfully there are many people on the forum who haven't played the beta much or at all, feel very hyped up, and jump at people's opinions if they are critical of the game. There's a word for such people of course, and I couldn't care less about their opinions. I'm just giving my feedback to the devs. That's what I come for on the forum.

 

If anything, I'm happy we are down to criticizing minor details and features, because I think these are such. If people were criticizing major issues, this would have meant something different about the game as a whole, and probably I would see no point in criticizing anything anyway. From what I see, it's obvious they will release a great game. And part of what makes the difference between a great game and a classic are these minor features that people here spend the time and effort to criticize. My opinion anyway.

[Valmy]

the radius is 3 meters....or about as big as the standard wizard AOE spell in this game

 

That small?  Hardly a big deal.  The infinite inventory thing is far bigger of a departure.

[Stun]

PoE's radius is 3m. BG was about 1m? 1/2m? Something like that.

Nothing like that.

 

In order to share the same loot window, 2 corpses in the IE games must overlap. They must share the same x and y coordinates. And those are measured in pixels, not... meters, or half meters.

[Kal Adan]

Browse it... page by page. Show me a single thread, since the backer beta was released last august, where anyone complained that individual corpse looting was something that needed to go. You'll find none. Because people were ok with it.

Perhaps it didn't require change, but it does not mean it couldn't use one.

[Luckmann]

It is quite interesting to see the divide between people who a really enamored with the old-style roleplaying game that they can't fathom any change to be good. It is a shame that it isn't optional, but to herald the advent of area-loot as the antichrist is somewhat ridiculous, and extreme. I've recently played through Baldur's Gate 1 and 2, and in the progress of playing through IWD, and none of you can convince me you actually like that type of looting, and if you do, I will assume you've only bothered with looting specific enemies and never the trash mobs. 

 

The system is outdated, hasn't aged well, nor badly, but it needed refinements. I am pretty sure Pillars of Eternity will still have the nonsensical encounter balance that the old IE games have, at times. *

 

That said, I am all for optional mechanics.

Well even if ignore the fact that your post is more or less a complete strawman, I want to make it clear that I don't actually mind the idea of "area-loot" that much, provided it works largely like in Wasteland 2, where you still end up looting every individual enemy.

 

However, the overall issue is that this is symptomatic of changes that many of us dislike, and when taking into consideration together with many other changes (infinite inventory, magical stash teleportation, infinigold merchants, etc) it greatly cheapens the game in areas that we'd rather see uncheapened.

 

Again, the logical conclusion of this really is ARPG-like murderhobo assignment of gold coins, because if there is really no point in ever not looting something, and if all that chaff loot is just going to get vendored straight away to the nearest merchant anyway, and if I don't even have to trot over there to pick the stuff up, I really don't even see any point in why I should have to go to the merchant to sell these things, this nameless, faceless loot that is nothing but meat for the gold-grinder.

 

It is not "the antichrist" as you so hyperbolic and strawman-y describe it in an effort to smear those that question the design decisions; it is merely yet another chip off off something great.

[...]

 

On this forum, that is apparently the difference between genius and literally being Hitler.

That's like.. the worst analogy ever. Because.. Hitler.

 

 

 

 

tons of fun!

WHY WOULD YOU PICK THAT UP?

 

Like Bester said, just by looking at the corpses, anyone can tell (by that point in the game) that there is nothing worth picking up. Because that - what is worth doing and what isn't - was a call you could make in the IE games. It was a meaningful choice on your part, however small, because you were restricted in inventory space, in how much you could carry, and in time; what are these corpses worth to you?

 

The answer to any reasonable person would be; nothing. Nothing at all.

 

In the game, not only would it not serve you to pick that up, you wouldn't even be able to haul it to a store. It just underlines the entire issue; that the looting system has been incredibly cheapened, robbed of verisimilitude, and by extension of your argument, you'd probably be one of those better served by having an automatic +$$$ gently tick upwards as you murderhobo your way through a game.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Luckmann

[Valmy]

The IE games had infinite gold for merchants.  I don't recall anybody having a problem with that.

[Luckmann]

The IE games had infinite gold for merchants.  I don't recall anybody having a problem with that.

That is beside the point, but what is on the point of your point, is that the IE games also didn't feature an infinite teleport-a-stash that could be accessed from everywhere at any time.

[Quetzalcoatl]

 

The IE games had infinite gold for merchants.  I don't recall anybody having a problem with that.

That is beside the point, but what is on the point of your point, is that the IE games also didn't feature an infinite teleport-a-stash that could be accessed from everywhere at any time.

 

How is it suddenly beside the point when you brought it up yourself just now? Acknowledge that you were wrong, at the very least.

Edited March 13, 2015 by Quetzalcoatl

[CaptainMace]

 

 

No ability to drop items or leave them inside a container in the world once you've taken them.

The stash - welcome to your limitless inventory. Such fun.

 

No ability to make room in your inventory or stock things in a limitless one.

Limitless inventory.

 

Come on mate, at some point you have to pick one thing to hate, disliking both doesn't make that much sense.

 

This is either a very sorry attempt at trolling, or you don't understand what I've written. I call the stash "limitless inventory". I want to be able to put things back in containers if I don't want to keep the things. What part of this didn't you understand?  

 

My point was that deciding what to take with you, what to store in containers and what to leave behind is still present in PoE. The only difference is that all the containers presents in safe zones (or wherever) in Baldur's Gate are represented by the stash. Beregost is arguably the party's stash in Baldur's Gate. Kuldahar is the same in IceWind Dale.

What I meant is, there's no need to complain about the stash on one side, and the fact you can't drop and store stuff in random barrels on the other, because they're the same problem. Or it's just about making your list appear bigger.

[Valmy]

 

The IE games had infinite gold for merchants.  I don't recall anybody having a problem with that.

That is beside the point, but what is on the point of your point, is that the IE games also didn't feature an infinite teleport-a-stash that could be accessed from everywhere at any time.

 

 

You said it was a change.  I was saying it was not a change.  Sorry if that was confusing.

 

Yes the infinite inventory is annoying.  I am not looking forward to it filling with junk and me having problems finding things.