[435] Loot list / container issues

[Sensuki]

Loot container in Lle A Rhemen southernmost hallway loot can be of random value between 50cp (one gem) to ~300cp+ (two gems and a fine suit of armor) - this is incredibly wonky to me, and even worse than Icewind Dale with it's save-scum promoting loot.

 

I haven't properly tested other containers in the beta, but I think I will now, after encountering this issue.

I will save scum my save in this corridor to produce the optimal loot.

 

Attempt #1

 

Brigandine (60cp) and two Velunes (2x65cp) = 190cp

Attempt #2

 

 

1 Velune (65cp) = 65cp

Edited March 1, 2015 by Sensuki

[PIP-Clownboy]

Don't savescum, problem solved. 

[Litany]

Lucky I tested for it tbh, this would have sucked on release. Props to ushas for finding a worst case scenario.

Yes thank goodness you're on the job. Could you imagine the damage to Obsidian's rep if this had gone unadressed??

 

This won't change and I actually prefer some randomization to purely static drops. The super-duper unique items will still show up where they show up and the junk loot (and all of this loot is junk for a party that's proper level when they get to Dyrford; the beta party is undergeared by design) will roll off of a table. If you have brain problems and sit there rerolling at each chest until you get the "optimal" drop then I must extend my thanks to Obsidian for keeping you indoors and away from the public where you might be a threat.

[bonarbill]

Same scumming loot needs to go, but otherwise I don't have a problem with the rest.  I like a mixture of normal and random loot.

Edited March 2, 2015 by bonarbill

[Sensuki]

For what it's worth, after spending 10-20 minutes re-rolling a few chests,

 

Actually it takes about one minute, or less to quicksave/quickload and test a chest 6 times.

 

For what it's worth yeah more hand placed loot would be good but there are very few chests that drop magical items (i.e., an item that isn't just a [quality] weapon or armor) and most of them have a fairly limited loot table, with an range of 1-4 or so items (see: that Skaen temple chest that almost always drops the boots or bracers).

 

This is a problem IMO if it's the only location where you can get the item. If you don't get the Gauntlets of Ogre Might on your playthrough, you just save scum the chest a few times until you do. Clarification on how this works is needed from the devs. This was one of the stupid things about Icewind Dale, as there was usually an item or two in the pool of items you could get from a chest that were better than others (simply because those are the proficiencies you had), and it sucked if you didn't get them.

 

Keep in mind the characters in the backer beta are deliberately "under geared". "Fine" loot is actually supposed to be "junk" loot by the time we hit this content, which is why you can sometimes find it in "junk" chests.

 

Doesn't really matter, it's about consistency, and I wouldn't put it past them to have used the loot lists as a time saving feature, and also would not be surprised if such imbalanced loot lists were encountered earlier in the game as well, where it does matter. I don't care whether the junk loot is random, but it's terribly inconsistent.

 

I also do not like randomized hidden container loot - that is really unrewarding IMO. The one I found in Lle A Rhemen should be hand-placed.

Edited March 2, 2015 by Sensuki

[Gfted1]

I will punch a retarded kitten in the face if boss / quest loot is randomized. Just had to get that off my chest.

[aeonsim]

I will punch a retarded kitten in the face if boss / quest loot is randomized. Just had to get that off my chest.

 

It's not as far as we can tell, it seems to be something like this:

 

Quest/boss rewards - Fixed

Quest/boss related containers - Fixed

NPC items - Fixed

Hidden Items/Locations - Some fixed, some Random

Basic Containers - Random

[Gfted1]

Thanks! Although Im still eying that "hidden item / location" with suspicion. Thinking back to the Twisted Rune in BG2 (Staff of the Magi), I wonder if that would fall into the hidden item / location or quest / boss?

[Sensuki]

A Something Awful poster linked the thread there. Josh on the loot list topic:

 

 

 

Gauntlets of Ogre Might aren't unique items and they're on a list with Bracers of Spiritual Power. I.e., there is a 50/50 chance each time Hands_7 list comes up that you will get one or the other. This is no way "Icewind Dale style" since the defining (and greatly disliked) characteristic of the IWD loot lists was randomized unique items.

 

 

 

The more containers there are that use a randomized list, the more normalized the output will become over time. QA's reports on total cp at the end of the game are fairly consistent or, more importantly, they are not significantly inconsistent.

 

 

 

I didn't generate the original loot lists, so I've been going through them and making adjustments lately. The currency drop lists seem like their ranges are fairly tight unless they are being used oddly in specific locations. Some of the generic weapon and armor lists do have some un-fun entries on them like a chance to get a normal on a list that is dominantly Fine with the possibility of Exceptional.

 

 

 

Adam just implemented the seed for loot a couples of weeks ago.

 

I or ushas still need to post the locations (screens of location on map would be handy) of the containers with the exceptional loot - as that's probs not supposed to be there. But at least a few of the issues are/have been fixed.

[Sensuki]

Also this

 

 

 

Jorge and I will still be doing more tuning on the loot lists in the near future.

[ushas]

Thanks for info.
Ok, as they are still working on it, better to leave it for the next Beta, if needed? However, we can only try things a few times, no real statistical tests...

Edited March 3, 2015 by ushas