Armour & weapon designs - a plea (part IV).

[Greensleeve]

I have a question what weapon is the weapon left to the two handed morning star?

 

-snipped picture-

 

I do believe that it is, accompanied by a gigantic mace and a glaive. I'd say that the size of the weapons is intentionally inflated to ensure they're nicely visible on screen. Josh has also said that there will be a quite large diversity of different weapons in the game, many of which are very rarely seen. The inclusion of the estoc is one of the things I'm most excited by, to be honest. 

[Karranthain]

@Karranthian: I believe one of the earliest screenshots involving character models, either the one around the camp fire, or the ones found through the German gaming magazine, had models wielding sabres also. So I think we're good regarding their inclusion. Edit: Also, the hussar's warhammer is lovely. I particularly like the crow's beak on it. 

 

Aye, I remember that one too. It's also visible in this video : http://youtu.be/AUleDEFkUtE?t=2m16s. We should be safe on that front

 

And yes, the warhammers are very cool. The whole hussar attire is quite nice, actually - I like the East meets West aesthetic. 

 

 

Koncerz (the Polish-Lithuanian hussar's variant of an Estoc) also looks rather nice, doesn't it?

Edited September 19, 2013 by Karranthain

[Woldan]

@Woldan: The Messer in the first picture is absolutely gorgeous. I would love to have Messers as part of the sabre weapons class in this game.

I'd say that Messers belong to the two-handed and one handed swords categories. They're not really sabers, they're comparatively heavy swords with curved blades and only one sharp edge. Thats when Europeans realized the curved blades of sabers increase cutting power and implemented that feature in their sword designs, but they still needed a heavy blade against armored foes. That resulted in sword-saber hybrids, like the German Grosse Messer and various falchion designs.

 

I'm not entirely sure how the rules in PE are going to work but the Messers -if there will be any in PE- should get some extra points in armor penetration and damage while being a little slower than lighter straight swords. Like a tiny sub-category.

 

And Messers are awesome, I have a two handed one myself, holding it in my hands feels so much more brutal and effective than my bastard sword. 

[Jarmo]

 

Koncerz (the Polish-Lithuanian hussar's variant of an Estoc) also looks rather nice, doesn't it?

 

 

Whoa! I had seen koncerz in pictures before, but thought it a way smaller!

Like.. the blade is almost twice as long as I'd have expected.

 

Again, total badassery from the hussars,

"we'll take that two handed sword but make the grip such that it can only be used one-handed".

[Karranthain]

 

 

Koncerz (the Polish-Lithuanian hussar's variant of an Estoc) also looks rather nice, doesn't it?

 

 

Whoa! I had seen koncerz in pictures before, but thought it a way smaller!

Like.. the blade is almost twice as long as I'd have expected.

 

Again, total badassery from the hussars,

"we'll take that two handed sword but make the grip such that it can only be used one-handed".

 

 

In later period, it ordinarily measured about 1,6m (some were even longer than that); due to that, however, it was only viable when fighting on horseback. They were used usually as a backup weapon, substituting for lances (hence the one-handed grip).

 

Since we mentioned Estocs :

 

 

 

I love this particular piece.

[Woldan]

 

I love this particular piece.

I agree, the armor and the sword is really nice as well.   

 

With 1,6m length that sword is like a small one handed pike. Pretty cool, I wonder how effective it (Estocs in general) was to defeat armor. Could it penetrate chain mail? Could blocking other swords damage the thin blade?

Edited September 19, 2013 by Woldan

[Karranthain]

 

 

I love this particular piece.

I agree, the armor and the sword is really nice as well.   

 

With 1,6m length that sword is like a small one handed pike. Pretty cool, I wonder how effective it (Estocs in general) was to defeat armor. Could it penetrate chain mail? Could blocking other swords damage the thin blade?

 

 

I have my doubts as well, to be honest. Perhaps someone on these forums has had some experience with this weapon?

 

Koncerz, I imagine, was pretty devastating - it was, after all, (as you mentioned) a small pike, to be used during a charge. When that much kinetic energy is concentrated on such a small area (the blade's very thin) the results must've been gruesome.

[Osvir]

I really like the style of that armor, but what I was going to comment on wasn't what I thought it was... I thought the rod was a Mace and that the end was designed as a Fist *facepalm* regardless.... I still kinda like the idea of a "Fist Mace" or "Fist Hammer".... so I sloppily cut out the concept I saw

 

[Greensleeve]

 

-snipped-

 

I love this particular piece.

I agree, the armor and the sword is really nice as well.   

 

With 1,6m length that sword is like a small one handed pike. Pretty cool, I wonder how effective it (Estocs in general) was to defeat armor. Could it penetrate chain mail? Could blocking other swords damage the thin blade?

 

 

I'd say that estocs were quite effective. With a rhomboid cross section, some weight behind it, the very stiff blade, and all would be quite effective. Intuitively it'd be more effective at penetrating chain than a typical middle age spear for example. When it comes to plate armour, I still think you sort of had to look for the gaps. I also strongly doubt that blocking, or rather parrying, would damage the blade any more than it would any other sword, maybe even less. I mean, you have no edge to worry about blunting, and the cross section is quite broad, so there's a lot of metal for durability. I think an estoc would hold up quite well. 

 

As for the koncerz, while it does look cool, it also looks very unwieldy. As in almost unusable out of the saddle. 

[quest1on]

Combination weapon of pistol and koncerz, with Turk's head pommel.

[Lephys]

GUNBLADE!!!

[quest1on]

Storta, Venetian Renaissance version of falchion. Generally, this blog http://art-of-swords.tumblr.com/ is full of impressive exhibits. I recommend it strongly to anyone interested.

[Archmage Silver]

 

I have a question what weapon is the weapon left to the two handed morning star?

 

-snipped picture-

 

I do believe that it is, accompanied by a gigantic mace and a glaive. I'd say that the size of the weapons is intentionally inflated to ensure they're nicely visible on screen. Josh has also said that there will be a quite large diversity of different weapons in the game, many of which are very rarely seen. The inclusion of the estoc is one of the things I'm most excited by, to be honest. 

Considering the fact that this is a fantasy game, we've also got the larger races (ogres?) to deal with. So some of the weapons in that screenshot might just be decorative, but we could still see them being wielded by a larger enemy combatant.

[Woldan]

One of the origins of the "pointy wizard hat" "the golden hats" (Goldhüte)

 

It is assumed that the Golden Hats served as religious insignia for the deities or priests of a sun cult then widespread in Central Europe. Their use as head-gear is strongly supported by the fact that the three of four examples have a cap-like widening at the bottom of the cone, and that their openings are oval (not round), with diameters and shapes roughly equivalent to those of a human skull. The figural depiction of an object resembling a conical hat on a stone slab of the King's Grave at Kivik, Southern Sweden, strongly supports their association with religion and cult, as does the fact that the known examples appear to have been deposited (buried) carefully.

 

 

 

Thats one hell of a codpiece! 

[Karranthain]

 

 

I have a question what weapon is the weapon left to the two handed morning star?

 

-snipped picture-

 

I do believe that it is, accompanied by a gigantic mace and a glaive. I'd say that the size of the weapons is intentionally inflated to ensure they're nicely visible on screen. Josh has also said that there will be a quite large diversity of different weapons in the game, many of which are very rarely seen. The inclusion of the estoc is one of the things I'm most excited by, to be honest. 

Considering the fact that this is a fantasy game, we've also got the larger races (ogres?) to deal with. So some of the weapons in that screenshot might just be decorative, but we could still see them being wielded by a larger enemy combatant.

 

 

 

 

I have a question what weapon is the weapon left to the two handed morning star?

 

-snipped picture-

 

I do believe that it is, accompanied by a gigantic mace and a glaive. I'd say that the size of the weapons is intentionally inflated to ensure they're nicely visible on screen. Josh has also said that there will be a quite large diversity of different weapons in the game, many of which are very rarely seen. The inclusion of the estoc is one of the things I'm most excited by, to be honest. 

Considering the fact that this is a fantasy game, we've also got the larger races (ogres?) to deal with. So some of the weapons in that screenshot might just be decorative, but we could still see them being wielded by a larger enemy combatant.

 

 

Another thing to consider - it's also probable that the weapons present in this particular scene are just decoration - i.e. not necessarily representative of actual weapon models. 

[centurionofprix]

I really like the style of that armor, but what I was going to comment on wasn't what I thought it was... I thought the rod was a Mace and that the end was designed as a Fist *facepalm* regardless.... I still kinda like the idea of a "Fist Mace" or "Fist Hammer".... so I sloppily cut out the concept I saw

 

 

Edited September 24, 2013 by centurionofprix

[Lephys]

^^^ O_O...

 

Best... weapon... ever. Now I want gauntlets for "Unarmed" type combat that simply have cast-metal fists fitted into them. Or a mace that's just a cast-metal beefy arm with a fist at the end, so it just looks like you're swinging a big muscley arm, made of metal. 8D!

Edited September 24, 2013 by Lephys

[Woldan]

 

 

I read that this fist warhammer holding a spike is a replica of a real one found in Germany, dating back to the late 15th century.  

 

 

Not really a weapon recommendation for PE but I think that tool is so cool it deserves to be posted here: 

 

Edited September 25, 2013 by Woldan

[Osvir]

This very pressing question must be answered: Would "Fist" shaped mace's be considered unarmed weapons?

I can totally see a Monk unleash hell and fury whilst dual-wielding a pair of those.

EDIT: And to further Lephys statement and add a question to it: Will there be knuckles, claws and other "hand-to-hand" enhancing weapons in PE?

I know Baldur's Gate and Icewind Dale are lacking them (IIRC) which I thought was mildly odd, but that's because I'm coming from Final Fantasy (Yang, Sabin, Tifa, Zell, Amarant etc. etc. claws and knuckles are pretty present in those games)

Edited September 25, 2013 by Osvir

[Woldan]

 

This very pressing question must be answered: Would "Fist" shaped mace's be considered unarmed weapons?

 

I can totally see a Monk unleash hell and fury whilst dual-wielding a pair of those.

 

[Karranthain]

Since we know that the cultures in the world of PE will have varying levels of technological advancement, I'd love to see some designs inspired by the Varangian Guard :

 

 

 

[Greensleeve]

Since we know that the cultures in the world of PE will have varying levels of technological advancement, I'd love to see some designs inspired by the Varangian Guard :

 

-snipped pictures-

 

 

I have to object that first one. The Varangian Guard was only called such by the Byzantium court, so he wouldn't have been a Varangian Guard back in Scandinavia. There he would've been a man who had gone native, or civilised, depending on perspective. 

 

For the Varangian Guard, this is one of my favourite pictures. 

 

[centurionofprix]

Found another of the originals:

 

Some pictures from Kelvingrove and Riverside in Glasgow, self-indulgently:

Edited September 25, 2013 by centurionofprix

[Nonek]

 

 

 

In an old campaign of mine there was a league of assassins named the "Black Hand," one can imagine the master of a similar organisation fondling such a sceptre as a rod of office or somesuch.

[Merlkir]

I appreciate the badass poses these armours are mounted in. )