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The Sharmat

[Merged] Gods save us another romance thread

For people who are NOT apathetic or opposed to romances in games:  

455 members have voted

  1. 1. Are you willing to sacrifice romances as a feature if it drew significant resources from other story features?

  2. 2. Are you willing to sacrifice romances as a feature if it drew significant resources from gameplay design?

  3. 3. Would you still want romance options in the game even if your hypothetical favorite NPC did not end up being available?



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@dlux

 

I'm curious how you will be able to identify the backers for your Poll. I think only the $100+ tiers will be identified with a forum badge of some sort (which would leave around 41,000 actual backers of from $20 - $80 badgeless?). Or are the devs giving badges to all backers? I think I must be missing something.

 

The 5$ tier offers a "backer" badge, but will people bother to use it is a different story.

Edited by Undecaf

Perkele, tiädäksää tuanoini!

"It's easier to tolerate idiots if you do not consider them as stupid people, but exceptionally gifted monkeys."

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@dlux

 

I'm curious how you will be able to identify the backers for your Poll. I think only the $100+ tiers will be identified with a forum badge of some sort (which would leave around 41,000 actual backers of from $20 - $80 badgeless?). Or are the devs giving badges to all backers? I think I must be missing something.

All backers will get a forum badge (I believe it will be similar to what the mods and devs have). Check the rewards on the kickstarter page. :)

 

I just did and don't see it -- my eyes must be getting old.

 

Thanks, I just saw it on the $5 tier. Didn't look high enough. Thanks!!

Edited by SqueakyCat

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Pledge $5 or more

 

Thank you for your pledge! Everyone at Obsidian loves you! Every backer for this level or more will receive a KICKSTARTER BACKER BADGE on the PROJECT ETERNITY forums. We want to invite you to our forums where you get a place to speculate about the game' date=' offer suggestions, and interact with the development team.

[/quote']

 

Even the lowest pledge gives you a badge.

Edited by Lurky

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Ok here is my 2 cents on this. First and foremost I want a fantasy questing game and not a romance game with fantasy elements. I am not opposed to romantic events in my game but it is not why I am playing. Make it flow as part of the story and I am ok. I just dont want them to be crammed down my throat or worse where everyone is bisexual and hitting on my character (ala dragona age 2).

I feel the same way. Do it right (like in BG2) or don't do it at all. The romances in BG2 were a very small part of that huge game, but they really improved the story imo.

 

And I have no doubt that Obsidian cannot do it though, they are an awesome developer. :)

 

You see, if they confined romances to BG2 levels then I could live with it. I wouldn't much like it, but I could live with it.


sonsofgygax.JPG

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@dlux

 

I'm curious how you will be able to identify the backers for your Poll. I think only the $100+ tiers will be identified with a forum badge of some sort (which would leave around 41,000 actual backers of from $20 - $80 badgeless?). Or are the devs giving badges to all backers? I think I must be missing something.

All backers will get a forum badge (I believe it will be similar to what the mods and devs have). Check the rewards on the kickstarter page. :)

 

I just did and don't see it -- my eyes must be getting old.

 

Thanks, I just saw it on the $5 tier. Didn't look high enough. Thanks!!

You're right, they forgot to add it to the pics of the rewards under $100. Anyway, here. You have to pledge $5 or more:

 

Thank you for your pledge! Everyone at Obsidian loves you! Every backer for this level or more will receive a KICKSTARTER BACKER BADGE on the PROJECT ETERNITY forums. We want to invite you to our forums where you get a place to speculate about the game, offer suggestions, and interact with the development team.

:closed:

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I don't want to play a dating sim either. If there are romances I hope they either require you initiating them in an obvious manner so that I can just ignore them or that companions are killable so I can eliminate them.

MCA mentions in a blog recently about companions should be optional so you aren't forced to bring them along if you don't like them.

 

http://forums.obsidian.net/blog/1/entry-168-project-eternity-and-characterization/

Some good stuff in there.

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No offense to the The Sharmat, but I do feel it is kind of unfortunate that the thread that gets to stay the discussion about romance is the one with this weirdly worded and intentioned poll.

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I'm going to have to chalk that up to personal bias.

 

I think "reading comprehension" would be a better use of your chalk.

 

There you go again. It's not a matter of reading comprehension, but one of assumptions and bias.

 

Avellone himself has, in regards to characterization in Project Eternity, made it clear how romance potentially fits into writing a character. It's all about writing good characters. If it makes sense for a character to potentially fall for the PC, then it's likely going to be an option. Heck, the guy once wrote a list of requirements for a good romantically available character.

 

Requirements many BioWare romances don't pass, for the record. (There are a few "what were they thinking?" type romances in SWTOR, and in BG2 from what I hear.)

Edited by JediMB
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Something stirs within...

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You're right, they forgot to add it to the pics of the rewards under $100. Anyway, here. You have to pledge $5 or more:

 

Thank you for your pledge! Everyone at Obsidian loves you! Every backer for this level or more will receive a KICKSTARTER BACKER BADGE on the PROJECT ETERNITY forums. We want to invite you to our forums where you get a place to speculate about the game, offer suggestions, and interact with the development team.

Yeah but that's different from needing to have donated $25 which is what you mentioned. There also hasn't been mention of any separate forums that only people with badges can post in. Edited by Grimlorn

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I fall in the Independent Party on this issue. If they were along the lines of BG2, I wouldn't mind - they're easily ignored.

 

I would, however, take exception to diaper sex in the tents. If they just let the screen fade to black and let players use their imagination it would be a lot more subtle and appealing (at least to me). But I'm very happily married, so I guess romance in games doesn't hold the same appeal to me as maybe some others.

 

This is just such a contentious issue, and everyone wants representation for their orientation in the game which, I would imagine, makes it a nightmare for the developers. Which groups are represented and how?

 

I don't know, I'll just leave it up to the good folks at Obsidian.

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I would, however, take exception to diaper sex in the tents. If they just let the screen fade to black and let players use their imagination it would be a lot more subtle and appealing (at least to me).

 

I have zero problem with M rated games using nudity and/or sex.

 

But I don't need it. And, overall, I'm an advocate of "fade to black" in almost all cases.

 

Even more to the point, I'm an advocate for most games to not even get to the "fade to black" moment... personal preference.

 

But I'm very happily married, so I guess romance in games doesn't hold the same appeal to me as maybe some others.

 

As am I. Fourteen years now. I have a daughter. I don't think this is really relevant. It's like saying that people only play GTA because they haven't managed to go out and steal a real car yet, or an FPS because they haven't gone to war yet and got to shoot real people yet.

 

Being lonely or in a bad relationship is not necessary to enjoy romance in entertainment media. Just like being a satan worshipper isn't necessary to play Dungeons & Dragons, despite what the media in the 80's told everyone.

 

Soldiers play FPS. Football players play Madden. You don't have to be lacking something in real life to enjoy experiencing simulations of it as well.

 

I don't know, I'll just leave it up to the good folks at Obsidian.

 

I think most of us, regardless of pro or con, agree with this.

The ones who'll be the problem, pro or con, are the ones demanding their way. :getlost:

Edited by Merin
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You're right, they forgot to add it to the pics of the rewards under $100. Anyway, here. You have to pledge $5 or more:

 

Thank you for your pledge! Everyone at Obsidian loves you! Every backer for this level or more will receive a KICKSTARTER BACKER BADGE on the PROJECT ETERNITY forums. We want to invite you to our forums where you get a place to speculate about the game, offer suggestions, and interact with the development team.

Yeah but that's different from needing to have donated $25 which is what you mentioned. There also hasn't been mention of any separate forums that only people with badges can post in.

Correct, $5+ not $25+.

 

I do believe that we will have a seperate section on the forums though. I just don't remember where I read that, I'll have to look again.

Edited by dlux

:closed:

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I would, however, take exception to diaper sex in the tents. If they just let the screen fade to black and let players use their imagination it would be a lot more subtle and appealing (at least to me). But I'm very happily married, so I guess romance in games doesn't hold the same appeal to me as maybe some others.

 

Personally, I'd rather like seeing sex left out entirely. Even implied sex.

 

They could throw in a joke about that they don't know for how long they'll be out on their quest, and that an unwanted pregnancy would get in the way. (Bonus points for somehow making a reference to the inventory baby.)


Something stirs within...

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I apologize. I certainly didn't mean to imply anything inappropriate about those who enjoy the romances. I certainly didn't mean to imply that only those without significant others and/or are in bad relationships are the ones who enjoy the romances. Again, my apologies.

 

 

@Merin

 

I also have a daughter.

Edited by SqueakyCat
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I apologize. I certainly didn't mean to imply anything inappropriate about those who enjoy the romances. I certainly didn't mean to imply that only those without significant others and/or are in bad relationships are the ones who enjoy the romances. Again, my apologies.

 

I also have a daughter.

 

I didn't think you meant it as an insult... it didn't read that way.

 

Don't worry about it.

 

That line of reasoning you alluded to, in simply trying to rationalize your own lack of desire for the inclusion of romance, is often used as a derogatory comment... but you didn't come across that way.

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I like the new tone in this thread. Much nicer. :)

 

Please everybody, write what you think about romances and why you like/dislike them. It would be nice if you also write about your personal experiences with romances in an RPG and how you think that an implementation of this mechanic would work best for you - even if you don't want them in the game at all. :)


:closed:

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I've flogged it to death dlux. I really have. As I've said, we can reach a compromise, I'm sure. BG2 is the least worst template for me.

 

But my biggest fear, as Lurky has so eloquently pointed out, is the hordes of bloody awful CRPG romance fans who will flock here from Bio social as soon as Obz announce romances. If they do I'm outta here.

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I'm going to have to chalk that up to personal bias.

 

I think "reading comprehension" would be a better use of your chalk.

 

Avellone himself has, in regards to characterization in Project Eternity, made it clear how romance potentially fits into writing a character. It's all about writing good characters. If it makes sense for a character to potentially fall for the PC, then it's likely going to be an option. Heck, the guy once wrote a list of requirements for a good romantically available character.

 

Interesting. Do you have a link to the statement and the requirements list?

 

I've flogged it to death dlux. I really have. As I've said, we can reach a compromise, I'm sure. BG2 is the least worst template for me.

 

But my biggest fear, as Lurky has so eloquently pointed out, is the hordes of bloody awful CRPG romance fans who will flock here from Bio social as soon as Obz announce romances. If they do I'm outta here.

 

So now every developer should be afraid of including romances? You're acting like a drama queen. They will stick to their romances topics so you won't have to deal with them.

Edited by Exseed

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Nah, but those weirdos will eventually wander out, I guess that's what he's concerned about.


Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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http://forums.obsidi...aracterization/

 

- The companion needs to ego-stroke the player in a variety of ways. Sometimes this can be romance, sometimes this can be simply reactivity (either brief barks or conversations about the player’s actions), or any of a variety of methods. Ultimately, however, any companion that simply sits around bitching, complaining, and haranguing the player isn’t someone you want to drag into the nearest dungeon to help clear it out… you may simply want to throw them in the dungeon and lock the door.

 

http://psotter.com/n...ternity-part-1/

 

Romances take a lot of effort, and I don’t want to be cagey on romances at all. We don’t want to make them a stretch goal, it’s just a question of if we feel comfortable with the funding. We have to do them right. Some people were giving us flak about, you know, the goal to get to the first companion, class, race, and things like that. They weren’t completely wrong in their criticism, but we don’t have nefarious reasons behind it. If it’s a pretty in depth companion Chris Avellone, who is a pretty quick writer, is looking at 2 or 3 months just for writing it up.
Edited by hideo kuze

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Nah, but those weirdos will eventually wander out, I guess that's what he's concerned about.

 

Weirdos maybe, but still a large group of consumers who will snatch any game, that has word "romances" in the description. If included we want them done good, while they don't particularly care about the quality of said romances.

Edited by Exseed

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Romance junkies don't really "wander out", if they feel they're going to get their fix.

 

I'll be honest, I really don't want the obsessives around. I did some research on the BSN, and I've seen the worst they can offer. The Tali sweat analysis is only the most memorable one, but they can be pretty damn creepy regarding the characters (or their voice actors). I'm not concerned about them influencing the game, but they're still a drag to have around in conversations.

 

As for Chris Avellone's post about romances, it's here.

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