I'm Commander Shepard and this is my favorite thread on Obsidian

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Another thing that annoyed me was turning the different ammo types into skills, that was probably the worst thing they could have done with them. The distribution between the classes was pretty random and switching them put all the other abilities on cooldown, which made me just stick with one. Spending skill points on them was pretty much a waste as well, at least as an infiltrator.

 

They really need to think of something different for ME3.

Ammo powers on the fly for soldiers made sense - what else could they have for powers?

 

But I agree, this is something I would have liked as an upgrade. You could level up the different ammo types with ressources, somewhat like you build up weapon damage and upgrades, and you'd have to choose an ammo type before the mission for each squad member. Soldiers would have all of the special ammo as powers (and they would be somewhat more powerful I guess).

Also, please bring back explosive ammo.

[Guest The Architect]

I

[Purkake]

@Will:It seemed like an afterthought added only to pad out the lack of skills and it should have used a different activation mechanic from abilities.

 

The graphics were nice, but there was still the odd low-texture background in some places and there was something wrong with the lighting in some places(like Normandy's mess hall). A big step up from ME1, though.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Purkake

[I want teh kotor 3]

I’ve played a few role playing games before with a good story, good combat and good music but never with graphics that good before, and for that reason I think it’s the best game ever. May not make a difference at all to you old school role players, but it does to me.

 

Plus the setting is excellent (better sci-fi setting than Star Wars I reckon), I love the dialogue wheel and the fact Shepard is voiced and it just plays out as one big epic space movie where you’re the director, but without the right TV and sound system, I can understand if you didn’t like it as much as I did.

 

This, but I liked the first one better... I like my RPGs... well... to be RPGs instead of shooters...

 

 

Edit: Reave is epic. 'Nuff said.

Edited February 15, 2010 by I want teh kotor 3

[Purkake]

Oh, it's you again.

 

Sorry, but the RPG-ness of a game isn't determined by the combat system.

[Gromnir]

ammo powhaz didn't bother Gromnir. two more potential powers woulda' given purkake a chance to ignore ammo powers altogether if he wished, no?

 

...

 

the thing is, without specific weapon skills am betting it was difficult to create six powers for the soldier. probable coulda' been a universal heal skill to improve unity... but instead they used upgrades to do so. fortification maybe? it appears to be a skill that would be appropriate for a soldier... although we would never choose after having played me2.

 

"Sorry, but the RPG-ness of a game isn't determined by the combat system. "

 

perhaps not, but we think it contributes. why is madden football not a rpg, in spite of fact that you functional choose stats and teams 'n such? is maybe due to fact that success or failure is ultimately determined by player skill rather than avatar skills. not matter how great tom brady's numbers is if the guy holding the gamepad has the manual dexterity o' a MS victim. crpg is usually the opposite, no? doesn't matter if the guy with the mouse /gamepad is complete weak and uncoordinated 'cause success or failure in combat is determined by his avatar's dexterity, strength and skills.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited February 15, 2010 by Gromnir

[Purkake]

I'm just saying that they were badly implemented. Having all the different ammo varieties from ME1 would have been great.

 

I'm sure they could have created some more powers for the soldier, they have been making games for a while now.

[I want teh kotor 3]

Oh, it's you again.

 

Sorry, but the RPG-ness of a game isn't determined by the combat system.

 

No, its not. But, when the inventory gets axed, the experience system essentially goes away, and the gameplay approaches CoD's system, it becomes a shooter, not an RPG.

[RPGmasterBoo]

I don't know about you, but I would like ME2 a lot more if members of Cerberus would be rasist space-nazi bastards who would show respect to you only if you would agree with their ways. And if even some of the squad members would really be dangerous and act in ways that makes you wonder would it be better for the mission if you just shot them, before they do something wacky?

[/rant]

 

Anyway, I would say that ME2 is the best game from Bio since BG2. Has some problems that keep it from being a great game instead of "just" a good game, but overall I enjoyed it much more than I expected. Good show Bio! And give my dearest thanks to the person who is responsible for the planet scanning mini-game..

 

It wouldn't be politically correct. That's why all the bad Cerberus guys arent really bad but cool and bad. Comic book style. Besides most true bad guys would just jump ship on the first port, instead of going along with Shepards tomfoolery.

[Purkake]

@IWTK3: Not really and the experience system didn't "go away".

 

I do miss some kind of an inventory, though. Once again Bioware went from one extreme to the other.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Purkake

[I want teh kotor 3]

@IWTK3: Not really and the experience system didn't "go away".

 

I do miss some kind of an inventory, though. Once again Bioware went from one extreme to the other.

 

Exp never really shows up; its just a bullet on a "mission complete" screen. No level ups in gameplay (i.e. within the levels themselves) remove it from the player's perception, and it never really comes back...

[Purkake]

I don't see why it matter when you can level up.

 

The RPG-ness of a game should be determined by the character interaction, choices and consequence, not the inventory or combat systems.

 

If it doesn't "feel" like an RPG to you, too bad.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Purkake

[Orogun01]

Besides most true bad guys would just jump ship on the first port, instead of going along with Shepards tomfoolery.

But Shepard is a natural leader with a great charisma which explains the "you had me at hello" romances and the undying loyalty of every member of the crew after you get better rations.

[Malcador]

Thought it was always player skill untied from character skill.

[jaguars4ever]

SCORE!

 

I'm calling credit for the thread title btw.

[RPGmasterBoo]

Its a mission based shooter with RPG conventions. The only reason its considered an RPG is because Bioware made it and because its branded as such. Why would Deus Ex be a shooter with RPG elements and ME2 an RPG with shooter elements when the difference is negligible. Both are dominantly action

games with alternative ways for story events to play out. Except ME2 has more choices and characters

 

Perhaps the stats, inventories, loot, builds, involved combat etc. dont automatically equate to RPG but if you strip them all off and leave mostly arcade action then you have an action game.

[RPGmasterBoo]

Besides most true bad guys would just jump ship on the first port, instead of going along with Shepards tomfoolery.

But Shepard is a natural leader with a great charisma which explains the "you had me at hello" romances and the undying loyalty of every member of the crew after you get better rations.

 

Perhaps it was my fault, my shep looked more like a convict.

[I want teh kotor 3]

I don't see why it matter when you can level up.

 

Because leveling up has always been an integral component of RPGS?

 

The RPG-ness of a game should be determined by the character interaction,

Fair enough. This is where ME2 excels.

 

choices and consequence

Therein lies my main gripe with the game. None of the choices ever matter, until the end of the game. In the original, every level except Eden Prime, Ilos, and Therum ended with a choice of some consequence; in the sequel, not until

the Joker mission

can you make a decision of any consequence.

 

not the inventory or combat systems.

I'm not complaining about the combat system; it should be as exciting and possible, and in this regard, ME2 is far superior to ME1. The inventory system, however, is another story; much like leveling. inventory has always been of utmost importance to RPGS. In ME2, there really is no inventory system. An RPG without an inventory is like a shooter with no guns, IMO: not one.

Edited February 15, 2010 by I want teh kotor 3

[Purkake]

ME2 and Deus Ex both have enough RPG elements to be considered RPGs, whatever else they are doesn't really play into it.

 

Stalker and Bioshock are hanging somewhere between.

 

Because leveling up has always been an integral component of RPGS?

And the time when you can level up matters because?

 

Therein lies my main gripe with the game. None of the choices ever matter, until the end of the game. In the original, every level except Eden Prime, Ilos, and Therum ended with a choice of some consequence; in the sequel, not until

the Joker mission

can you make a decision of any consequence.

If the choices don't matter you just get a bad RPG, not a shooter.

 

I'm not complaining about the combat system; it should be as exciting and possible, and in this regard, ME2 is far superior to ME1. The inventory system, however, is another story; much like leveling. inventory has always been of utmost importance to RPGS. In ME2, there really is no inventory system. An RPG without an inventory is like an RTS with no resources, IMO: not one.

There are plenty of RTSs with little to no resource management(starting with Ground Control). Yes, a lot of RPGs have an inventory, but why is it vital to the RPG part of the game? It's just something that RPGs usually have, it doesn't make the Roleplaying part any better or worse.

Edited February 15, 2010 by Purkake

[RPGmasterBoo]

Which is basically your opinion that hangs in limbo.

 

Of course the genre isnt exactly defined well... so *shrugs*

[Purkake]

It started off with IWTK3 complaining about it being a shooter, which it clearly isn't.

 

If you can see the differences between ME2 and Stalker, you should be able to see my point. Stalker is focused on the combat while Mass Effect 2 is focused on character interaction.

[I want teh kotor 3]

@Purkake: For me, the leveling and the loot have always been the reward, just as much as the story is. I grew up on my brother's Final Fantasy and DnD, so yeah, I love me some leveling. Therefore, since two out of my top three criteria for RPG-dom are missing, I really can't classify ME2 as a pure RPG.

 

I don't think Bio, or rather, EA, ever meant it to be an "RPG" in the vein of Kotor or the other Bio games. They wanted to bring in the shooter audience; as a business decision it makes sense, and certainly they made no secret about it. But to appease the trigger-happy CoD fanboys, they needed to remove some of the RPG elements, and that's exactly what they did.

[Pop]

[Purkake]

I never said it was a pure RPG, I don't think they make those anymore.

 

It's just not "a shooter" and EA's intentions or marketing don't play into it either. Mass Effect 2 is what it is and that's not a shooter.

 

EDIT: If you didn't like ME2, just say that and your reasons. This way we can avoid page-long discussions over definitions

Edited February 15, 2010 by Purkake

[I want teh kotor 3]

EDIT: If you didn't like ME2, just say that and your reasons. This way we can avoid page-long discussions over definitions

 

Oh, I bloody well love ME2. I just think that the original was superior, and that ME2 doesn't fit the categorization for RPG that well.