Does Obsidian make anything for non-window systems?

[Walsingham]

Question: if you have a Mac, and like gaming, are you not likely to already own a console?

 

If you already own a console, will you buy the game for Mac on a port, or stick to your console?

[Solo]

Fair question. Let me answer truthfully.

 

I have the Famicom, Super Famicom, Nentindo 64, and PS2 console. The hardware for computers I have 3 Macs. Two PPC and one Intel chip type.

 

I have for games for the Mac such as Pool of Radiance (Darkness) OS 9, BG with all expanisons OS 9, BG2 with all expansions OS X, NWN1 and 2 OS X.

Other AD&D titles I still have are Pool of Radiance, Curse of the Azure Bonds, Hillsfar, and Secrets of the Silver Blades that are for the Commodore computer. I also have Eye of the Beholder for the Super Famicom.

 

So what does all this mean? It means that if I like the title I will buy it to play on what platforms that I have and can play them on. As long as the price is not too expensive, yes I will buy the same titles for different platforms so I can enjoy that game no matter where I go or am at.

 

That's just me of course but if I like what I see, yeah I'll buy multi copies for the different systems because they all play a little differently and can be fun to see what's so different.

Yes, I'm strange. But does that somewhat answer your question of curiousty?

 

I don't have AD&D games for my PS2 because my Japanese reading sucks. I'm crawling just to play on the Super Famicom as it is. But if I can find an English version for AD&D PS2 games that'll work legally on my Japanese PS2 you're darn straight I'll buy.

I refuse to buy an English PS2 console because software makers can make DVD games with language options on them.

Edited December 17, 2008 by Solo

[Solo]

I'd take it that the Mod Walsingham hasn't seen this thread since the last posting or my answer is not understood?

 

I would buy for any system I own if the software title is what I want to play is good.

 

Looking forward in knowing what you Walsingham would do on the very same question you asked me?

 

Solo

[Humodour]

Wals was being Wals.

 

Kind of odd to assume Mac owners all own consoles, though, and thus can be ignored.

[Humodour]

Want more game sales? Support Linux and Mac.

 

The stats he uses have changed since he last checked (basically non-Windows market share has doubled), but the basic logic is simple and elegant: Linux and Mac users are far more likely to buy computer games, but possibly more importantly, they are extremely strong word of mouth advertisers and faithful fans.

 

90% of users might use Windows, but if only 5% of them buy computer games, let alone your computer games, what're you left with? But just suppose your Windows market share is 5% - while a quarter of Mac and Linux users also buy your games, that's 50% more sales than if you had of supported Windows alone (just ignoring the word of mouth benefits).

 

It's certainly not obvious why game companies don't support Max and Linux in today's environment, and you need only look at the graph linked to above to see why this argument will simply get stronger in future.

[Morgoth]

Gamers who play on Mac and Linux systems can't be taken serious.

[Spider]

Also, what is the additional costs to port, promote and distribute to other platforms? Just because Mac gamers are more likely to buy a game, it doesn't mean enough of them will to justify those costs.

 

(but maybe they will, I have no idea)

[Solo]

And why can't Mac and Linux users be taken seriously there, Morgoth? No traps, no flame bait, or antics here. Just would like to know why you think so? Again this is useful info for the obsidian team to know the pro and con of this subject.

 

As far cost, I have no idea but they would need the license for starters. Then get a team that could handle or know the ropes of the Mac to start the coding of the game. So yes as with all systems, cost is a factor. But if one does a half-hearted effort on their product then not many targets are you going to get.

[Morgoth]

And why can't Mac and Linux users be taken seriously there, Morgoth? No traps, no flame bait, or antics here. Just would like to know why you think so? Again this is useful info for the obsidian team to know the pro and con of this subject.

 

As far cost, I have no idea but they would need the license for starters. Then get a team that could handle or know the ropes of the Mac to start the coding of the game. So yes as with all systems, cost is a factor. But if one does a half-hearted effort on their product then not many targets are you going to get.

What Spider said.

 

In addition, creating game engines for modern games (i.e. AAA games) is incredibly complex, and as such, you need a lot support from the platform holder and hardware developers to get your tech up and running with all the driver interfaces that communicate with a PC.

Now I heard that things got a bit more easier since Mac's also use Intel CPUs, but there's still the issue with the graphics API. If I'm correct, Linux and Macs still require openGL to use that, and unless you haven't build you render engine from ground up using OpenGL (like John Carmack still does, Rage will be released on Mac as well), I don't see why you should take the extra effort/team to make an emulator that works on Macs as well.

Again, if you're serious about gaming, you probably want to do it on consoles or Windows-based PCs.

[Humodour]

And why can't Mac and Linux users be taken seriously there, Morgoth? No traps, no flame bait, or antics here. Just would like to know why you think so? Again this is useful info for the obsidian team to know the pro and con of this subject.

 

He's just being a troll. He does that sometimes (often).

 

As far cost, I have no idea but they would need the license for starters.

 

lol. You don't need a license to develop programmes (including games) for the Mac.

 

Spider: Compared to porting it to 2 or 3 different consoles? Far less.

 

I don't know the figures of porting costs, so let me just give you an incomplete list of games that have Mac and Linux versions instead?

 

Mac (mainly big names, RPGs, and games I like):

KOTOR 1

IWD 1

NOLF 2

Freedom Force 1

Jade Empire

World of Warcraft

Spore

EVE Online

Age of Empires 1, 2, and 3

AvP 1 and 2

Baldur's Gate 1, 2, and ToB

Battlefield 1942

Black & White

Call of Duty 1, 2, and 4

Civilisation 2, 3, and 4

Command & Conquer 1 and 2

Descent 1

Deus Ex 1

Diablo 1, 2, and 3 (Yes, Diablo 3)

Doom 1, 2, and 3

Dungeon Siege 1

Fallout 1 and 2

Giants: Citizen Kabuto

Halo 1

HoMM 3, 4, and 5

Hexen 1 and 2

Jazz Jackrabbit 2

Max Payne

Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 (but not MotB or SoZ? Smart, Obsidian. A hacker showed that the Windows version of MotB works fine with some slight fiddling, so it was clearly laziness on Obsidian's part )

Prey

Quake 1, 2, 3, 4, and Wars

Return to Castle Wolfenstein

All the Sims

Starcraft

The Jedi Knight series

System Shock 1

Total Annihilation

All Unreal Tournaments

The Warcraft Series

Worms Armageddon

 

Linux games (as for Mac, an incomplete list, though definitely smaller):

Doom 3

Quake 1, 2, 3, 4, and Wars

Return to Castle Wolfenstein

The Unreal Tournament series

EVE Online

 

Come on, Obsidian. What's the go?

Edited January 6, 2009 by Krezack

[Tigranes]

Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 (but not MotB or SoZ? Smart, Obsidian. A hacker showed that the Windows version of MotB works fine with some slight fiddling, so it was clearly laziness on Obsidian's part )

 

Or maybe it sold like crap.

 

That's the widely held belief, anyway, but has anyone bothered tog et some hard numbers on this? Hard numbers being incredibly rare in the public world of video games, but still. With Macs coming back into the fore and attracting more and more users, doesn't it make sense that the Mac games market is ready to be developed as well? Who knows without some figures?

[Walsingham]

Sorry. Family things to worry about etc. I forgot I'd asked the question.

 

If I had a console copy and a console, there's no way I'd buy another copy for another platform. Way too expensive for my tastes.

 

I'm not dissing mac owners. I'm just saying that given the current state of things, if you want to play games and own a mac you are going to have to buy games for something else. Most likely a console. Therefore (and depending on the expense of porting to Mac) it is unlikely to pay off building a game for the mac. I'm not saying you have to like it; I'm just trying to understand the mechanics.

[Moatilliatta]

Isn't the most likely reason that so many Mac users bought Lugaru, that enthusiast gamers are more likely than the average gamer to own a Mac? I know that internet forums will usually inflate the perception of how many people are Mac users, so most likely a smaller game like Lugaru would too.

 

Generally, I don't think those numbers are directly usefull for Obsidian.

 

Was Mass Effect ported to the mac?

[Pidesco]

Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 (but not MotB or SoZ? Smart, Obsidian. A hacker showed that the Windows version of MotB works fine with some slight fiddling, so it was clearly laziness on Obsidian's part )

 

Or maybe it sold like crap.

 

That's the widely held belief, anyway, but has anyone bothered tog et some hard numbers on this? Hard numbers being incredibly rare in the public world of video games, but still. With Macs coming back into the fore and attracting more and more users, doesn't it make sense that the Mac games market is ready to be developed as well? Who knows without some figures?

 

 

Also, Atari is more than likely the decisor here, not Obsidian. If Atari wanted Mac (and Linux) ports of the expansions, they would have been released.

[Walsingham]

Thinking about this some more there are other expenses than just coding. The publisher has to print, and ship mac versions. The stores have to give up shelf space to those versions. Just look at how squeezed the PC section of shops like GAME has got .

[Morgoth]

Talking about shelf space, are PC games in the US still produced as these mini-boxes? You know, DVD format, but at least twice as thick. They could double shelf space if they'd change to DVD cases instead.

[Moatilliatta]

You hate manuals, don't you!

 

Edit: Wait a second, are the boxes different in Austria-land?

Edited January 8, 2009 by Moatilliatta

[Morgoth]

You hate manuals, don't you!

 

Edit: Wait a second, are the boxes different in Austria-land?

First, I don't need printed manuals to play a game. Those times when they were needed to play a F16 simulator are over. Also, think of the trees.

 

Second, PC games get released in slim DVD cases (you know, like 360 games) across Europe, not only in the mighty Austrian Empire. Weheeee!

[Moatilliatta]

Like zis?

 

Because that is what I refer to as a normal DVD case. That is coincidentially also what we get in Denmark.

[Morgoth]

Oh man didn't you read what I wrote? This was pertaining to the US. I think they still use those thicker paper boxes, not sure however. Stores there would save alot shelf space if they'd change them to the DVD cases, like in Europe.

[Moatilliatta]

You're such a gentle soul Morgoth.

 

I've never known larger DVD boxes than those, link to a picture?

[Morgoth]

You're such a gentle soul Morgoth.

 

I've never known larger DVD boxes than those, link to a picture?

Here.

[Hell Kitty]

In Australia PC games still comes in a variety of boxes. Fallout 3, for example, comes in a standard DVD case, while Far Cry 2 comes in a double thickness DVD case. There is space for a number of discs even though there is only one, and the manual and map easily fit into a standard case. What a waste.

[Solo]

True the size of the product does play havoc on the shelf space. Thus yes, in America they still have the really big boxes that holds the thin case that holds the DVD.

 

But again, if the shops are not willing to let the other platform games be displayed then what is the point? Let me shine the light this way. How many rows do they have for the PC that are double copies? Then when and if a Mac section is there, you normally see only one of a certain type of app. But when consumers see the rows of software, it does look massive for the PC side while the Mac really looks small. Again, shops are setting up the displays to not draw attention to the Macs. Most of the stores still put the Macs in the back. I think I have said this before and if so, sorry to repeat it. But that's my take. But yes I am aware that PC titles are still more than the Mac at this point. But it is also not as small as the setup the shops have.

Maybe it's to do with their supplier and or area of shipment. But clearly some may understand what I am trying to say. No this is not a consperacy notion just a quick take on how I feel about the layout of some stores.

Edited January 9, 2009 by Solo

[wesley2]

Yeah, those big boxes really piss me off. You're definitely right about shelf space too, mine is rapidly disappearing and now I'm just staking things on the floor. Now I have these towers of old games stacked up.