Bioshock: Here there be spoilers

[Pop]

Also, the 3-word twist was pretty amazing. I'd like to see the RPG Codex would say about it, what with all their concern about not having choice in games and then having it sprung on them that their lack of choice was completely and totally intentional and integral to the plot of Bioshock. Pretty ingenious, really.

 

Andrew Ryan's death sequence was one for the ages.

[Zero]

The twist caught me off guard... and it was a nice little critique of the FPS genre -in regards of how we are constantly in motion . And it was definitely needed considering how cliche the game seemed up to that point- with Ryan being the main evil and Apollo's family being killed (I'm curious who/what exactly was in that bathysphere).

 

I'm not sure if you did this or not, but after you leave the Little Sister Hideout; after replacing the wheel to open the door. I accidently replayed the tape by Suchong on mind control (because you had to hold down A to turn the wheel); it was amazing moment climbing the ramp while hearing the little boy not want to kill the puppy.

 

And I already heard what Tennebaum(sp?) and Fontaine had to say, so that recording went un-interrupted.

 

The Boss fight was pretty easy. And the ending I saw was ok , not great... I saved all the Little Sisters so it was the "good" ending- not sure if there is a bad one. But I really wasn't expecting much from it, since I didn't think the story was all that great... the atmosphere and settings were.. but I didn't find the story particularly strong. That said it basically boils down to

 

Suchong= Sicko Psychopath

Ryan= Immoral Idealist and a Psychopath

Fontaine= Manipulative Sociopath

 

correct? or no?

 

 

Also I really wish there were more chances to talk to the people of rapture and that the bosses weren't just mainly amped splicers. I believe the Ryan scene would have been a tad more effective if they had made him look more realistic... but I agree for the most part his death is a great sequence.

 

To be honest I'm kinda sad we didn't also get to see more of the people we heard the tape recordings of. Especially the Australian fellow; even though we know exactly where he ended up(not just a basic idea like Diane McClintok,etc.); I was hoping for something a bit more since he seemed like the most moral of the bunch.

Edited August 25, 2007 by Zero

[Tale]

Bioshock after game plot analysis: what I saw coming, didn't, and why

 

 

You are Andrew Ryan's son

- Saw it coming. There's an audio recording in Neptune's Bounty that tells you how Rapture's security system is keyed to the genetic ballpark. Sisters or cousins could come in. Obviously you're related to someone. Later in the theatre/Cohen level (forget the name), you encounter a ghost and find another recording.

The ghost leads to the backroom of a night club. Outside the door you can overhear a girl arguing with Ryan. Ryan kills her. It's all ghost noise, of course. You find an audio recording where the girl reveals she conspired with Suchong and Fontaine to secretly have Ryan's child which was given to Fontaine.

 

 

 

Atlas is Fontaine

- Saw it coming.

The war is attributed to him starting, but he acts so innocent. People and posters speak of him almost as if he's myth and not real. Ryan practically ignores his existence until the end. Which means that few have actually seen him. Fontaine plays too much of an important figure in Rapture's history to not be involved. And one man in particular accuses you of doing Fontaine's bidding while working for Atlas.

 

 

 

Mind control and "Would you kindly"

- Did not see it coming. Don't know if I should have, but there are some clues. Plenty of recordings over mind control experiments.

But it's kind of easy to believe you're doing all of it of your own free will to look for a way out.

 

[Azarkon]

I thought the last twist you mentioned there was particularly cunning, as it plays off of the condition that we're all too used to in gaming.

I actually had someone mention - and was in agreement with him at the time - that it made no sense that you would just blindly follow Atlas's instructions given that you had no real grudge against Ryan and no way to know whether Atlas was really interested in getting you out (this became especially apparent after a particular point in the game). Turns out the developers thought so, too, and what I had brushed off as standard FPS railroading became one of the most clever twists put in games

[Zero]

Just for clarification

Diane McClintock was the one in the submarine, that exploded supposedly with Atlas's family, correct?

 

From the audiotapes she got injured in the Atlas revolts, and than remodeled by Steinman. Afterwards she fell in with Atlas in his group; and you can hear a tape of Fontaine talking about the guise and then you hear her voice.

 

[Zero]

I thought the last twist you mentioned there was particularly cunning, as it plays off of the condition that we're all too used to in gaming.

I actually had someone mention - and was in agreement with him at the time - that it made no sense that you would just blindly follow Atlas's instructions given that you had no real grudge against Ryan and no way to know whether Atlas was really interested in getting you out (this became especially apparent after a particular point in the game). Turns out the developers thought so, too, and what I had brushed off as standard FPS railroading became one of the most clever twists put in games

 

 

Atlas was pulling all these strings with the secuirity systems. I was expecting him to come down and help (in person) to put an end to Ryan, himself -when he didn't, something seemed seriously off.

 

That added with the good looks and how he wanted you to harvest the little sister. I wasn't expecting him to be Fontaine. I thought Fontaine would show up at some point due to all the tapes. But I was beginning to think he might be the last boss. To tell you the truth I was thinking it was more along the lines that you got placed in scenario that made Ryan look like a bad guy; like in the midst of a battle (which you were), and Atlas was just feeding you lies. But Ryan really was still a bad guy, just not the main bad guy.

 

I was thinking we were going to fight Atlas outside (for a change of pace) on the top of the tower/entrance of Rapture that we see at the intro. But that was before the Fontaine reveal.

 

[Tale]

Just for clarification

Diane McClintock was the one in the submarine, that exploded supposedly with Atlas's family, correct?

 

From the audiotapes she got injured in the Atlas revolts, and than remodeled by Steinman. Afterwards she fell in with Atlas in his group; and you can hear a tape of Fontaine talking about the guise and then you hear her voice.

I doubt

anyone was in the sub.

 

[Zero]

Just for clarification

Diane McClintock was the one in the submarine, that exploded supposedly with Atlas's family, correct?

 

From the audiotapes she got injured in the Atlas revolts, and than remodeled by Steinman. Afterwards she fell in with Atlas in his group; and you can hear a tape of Fontaine talking about the guise and then you hear her voice.

I doubt

anyone was in the sub.

 

 

In the beginning though

you can hear Atlas conversing with a woman. And he tells her "We have Company".

 

 

 

 

Also

if no-one was in the sub, and Ryan didn't destroy it. Odds were he was going to. But say he didn't. Would Atlas have to come clean with the protagonist?

 

I suspect it was McClintok and maybe a lone surviving child that were equally fooled by the Atlas persona (as all the rebels were). There is another tape where she says "She thought that Ryan was perfect, but now she has seen what he really is and that Atlas is actually the perfect man" suggesting a romance of sorts.

 

[Bokishi]

I pretty much expected

Atlas to end up being the bad guy

 

 

I mean I totally saw it coming

[Tale]

Just for clarification

Diane McClintock was the one in the submarine, that exploded supposedly with Atlas's family, correct?

 

From the audiotapes she got injured in the Atlas revolts, and than remodeled by Steinman. Afterwards she fell in with Atlas in his group; and you can hear a tape of Fontaine talking about the guise and then you hear her voice.

I doubt

anyone was in the sub.

 

 

In the beginning though

you can hear Atlas conversing with a woman. And he tells her "We have Company".

 

 

 

 

Also

if no-one was in the sub, and Ryan didn't destroy it. Odds were he was going to. But say he didn't. Would Atlas have to come clean with the protagonist?

 

I suspect it was McClintok and maybe a lone surviving child that were equally fooled by the Atlas persona (as all the rebels were). There is another tape where she says "She thought that Ryan was perfect, but now she has seen what he really is and that Atlas is actually the perfect man" suggesting a romance of sorts.

 

 

Considering the tricks he was playing

Atlas

could have done it himself and blamed it on

Ryan.

He never would have had to come clean.

Would you kindly?

 

Edited August 28, 2007 by Tale

[Zero]

Just for clarification

Diane McClintock was the one in the submarine, that exploded supposedly with Atlas's family, correct?

 

From the audiotapes she got injured in the Atlas revolts, and than remodeled by Steinman. Afterwards she fell in with Atlas in his group; and you can hear a tape of Fontaine talking about the guise and then you hear her voice.

I doubt

anyone was in the sub.

 

 

In the beginning though

you can hear Atlas conversing with a woman. And he tells her "We have Company".

 

 

 

 

Also

if no-one was in the sub, and Ryan didn't destroy it. Odds were he was going to. But say he didn't. Would Atlas have to come clean with the protagonist?

 

I suspect it was McClintok and maybe a lone surviving child that were equally fooled by the Atlas persona (as all the rebels were). There is another tape where she says "She thought that Ryan was perfect, but now she has seen what he really is and that Atlas is actually the perfect man" suggesting a romance of sorts.

 

 

Considering the tricks he was playing

Atlas

could have done it himself and blamed it on

Ryan.

He never would have had to come clean.

Would you kindly?

 

 

Yeah but there is the whole

Ryan transmitting a message to you and warning you not to press the button. Then telling you of the consequences for aiding a parasite(or something along those lines) afterwards.

 

If you get the chance , replay the intro (as you're going up in the bathysphere, you can hear Atlas talk to a woman before he talks to you)

 

And with the hangings in Apollo Square, Ryan doesn't seem to have any qualms with killing rebels. Which McClintock became.

 

 

 

I pretty much expected

Atlas to end up being the bad guy

 

 

I mean I totally saw it coming

 

 

But did you know it was

going to be Fontaine? The all perfect facade was suspicious and I thought I was going to end up fighting him, but I didn't think it was Fontaine.... Fontaine seemed too thuggish to pull it off.. to me at least.

 

I really thought Fontaine was going end up as one of the splicer bosses toward the end, but not the main guy.

 

 

 

Edited August 28, 2007 by Zero

[Pop]

The person Atlas speaks to at the beginning of the game is Johnny, the guy who gets gutted by the spider splicer at the very beginning. And since Diane McClintock's last diary was on a dead body, I assumed it was hers. Same with the bodies that had the last diaries of the conspirators against Ryan in Hephaestus. A shame, too. McDonough (sp?) was my favorite character.

[Musopticon?]

Right, I saw a certain thing about bathysphere biocoding, counted two plus two and decided to leave this thread.

[Morgoth]

I think all 3 endings (2, actually) pretty much leave out the possibility to play the same character in a sequal again. And the Endboss was some homage to Freedom Force, or what? Anyway, it's the best FPS I've played since Deus Ex, and for that I'm very grateful.

[Tale]

3?

[Morgoth]

3?

Yeah, just look around in the folders.

 

If you harvest all LS, you get the "bad" ending.

If you mix harvest/rescue, you get the same bad ending, but with a slightly different audio layer.

If you rescue all LS, you get the "good" ending.

[Tale]

Ahh, different audio. Wery interesting.

[Morgoth]

It's cool that Frau Tennenbaum is voiced by the same actor as Delacroix from SS2. I recognized her immediately. Ryan sounds familiar too, maybe the same guy who did Korenchkin? Does anyone have a list of all Bioshock Voice actors?

[Volourn]

So... how is the role-playing to everyone for this game?

[Tale]

There is no roleplaying.

[Volourn]

Hmph.. Then why was there bragging about how awesome this game would be in shaming actual RPG companies? I remember BIOshock fans laughing at how BIOshock would have more actual rping than BIO, Betehsda, and Obsidian games combined? L0LLERZ

 

Seriosuly, the game still sounds like it cna be fun. The atmosphere looks cool anyways. Are the controls reasonable?

[Morgoth]

Hmph.. Then why was there bragging about how awesome this game would be in shaming actual RPG companies? I remember BIOshock fans laughing at how BIOshock would have more actual rping than BIO, Betehsda, and Obsidian games combined? L0LLERZ

 

Seriosuly, the game still sounds like it cna be fun. The atmosphere looks cool anyways. Are the controls reasonable?

Huh? Who said that? Even the developers always claimed it's a FPS.

 

Anyways, it got depth, an incredibly well realized world and story, interesting gameplay, and still tons of possibilities to improve your character via tonics and plasmids, and is definitely worth picking up, even if the tools used to tell the story is completely unlike Bioware games.

 

It's simlilarly strucured to System Shock 2, although the core experience is improved, and some things are worse (like the lack of an inventory).

[Volourn]

"Huh? Who said that? Even the developers always claimed it's a FPS."

 

Pletny of people. And, as for the devs, yeah I know BS was always a FPS; but I also remember bragging about its 'RPG elements'.

 

No biggy anyways. I'm sure, and can see it has other good qualities.

 

I'll likely pick it up next week along with Madden 2008, and reservation of my NWN2:MOB copy.

[Morgoth]

You won't regret it, this game is truly a masterpiece, and a milestone in the FPS genre!

[Pop]

There's only one real choice in the game as well. As soon as you harvest your first little sister you close yourself off from the "good" ending.