Processors

[Hurlshort]

I'm trying to tweak my computer a bit for a minimal cost. I've currently got a Intel P4 2.8ghz processor and I'm wodering if it's possible to upgrade it, or if it's worth it. My mobo only supports Socket 478 processors.

 

Also, what's hyperthreading? My mobo seems to support it, but I'm pretty sure my current processor doesn't have it. I can also support P4 Celeron, but I was under the impression that Celeron is worse than the standard P4 chips.

 

Any suggestions? I've got 1.5 gigs or RAM and a fairly new video card, so I don't really want to upgrade those.

[Gfted1]

Im not sure about this but I consider "hyperthreading" the poor mans muliti-core processor. Also not sure about this but feel comfortable saying all Intel P4 chips have the capability. I know when I purchase from Dell for my company one of the questions they ask is do I want it on or off (hyperthreading) and that you can enable/disable it via the OS. I think default is off so that may be the case with you.

[Hurlshort]

When looking online, I saw chips with and without hyperthreading. I'm palmost positive mine is without. I went under properties and didn't see any options. Although it might be something under the BIOS.

 

http://www.tranmicro.com/product_info.php?...2609c34cad359ce

 

This seems like it might work, although I'm not sure if it's worth the cost compared to my current processor.

[Wistrik]

I'm considering a AMD 64FX quad processor for my next computer. By the time I'm ready to do the upgrade there may be better options, so this isn't set in stone. I'd be getting the FX-74.

[mkreku]

If you have DDR2 memory sticks and a PCI-E socket GPU, then I'd suggest that you get yourself a new motherboard and a Core 2 Duo CPU. I would say the E6600 is the best value for your buck right now. I have one myself and it's easily overclockable to be faster than an X6800 (the fastest Conroe right now) for $800-900. It's a powerhouse.

 

I would not recommend getting a bigger Socket 478 CPU. It's just not worth it.

 

Ps. Yes, Celeron is the value model of the Pentium family.

[angshuman]

Hyperthreading 101

When a program is executing on a processor, several of the processor's resources remain under-utilized. This is caused due to branch misprediction bubbles, long-latency memory accesses, as well as insufficient inherent instruction-level parallelism in the program to saturate the processor's functional units. Designers typically place more compute resources on a processor than the expected average-case application demand, in order to better handle peaky behavior. This leads to underutilization during most periods of time.

 

To improve utilization, Simultaneous Multithreading (which Intel calls Hyperthreading) attempts to inject two program streams into the same processor. The architecture is designed such that the Operating System thinks there are two physical processors on the system, but in reality the processor is mixing-and-matching instructions from the two programs in an attempt to maximize its internal resource utilization.

 

What does this buy us? Throughput. Consider the following crude example: Let us say that the processor has 100 units of a particular resource. Consider two programs that both require, say, 80 resource units throughout their execution. If the entire processor is devoted to a single application (i.e., HT is off), then let us say that each program requires 10 seconds to complete. If we wish to run both programs to completion, then we will use up 20 seconds in all. Now, switch on HT. Assume that resource distribution is even, and each program now gets 50 resource units. This means the execution time of each program will increase to (80 / 50) * 10 = 16 seconds, but they will both finish at the same time. Thus, although each application takes longer to execute (16s vs. 10s), the total execution time of the two apps has reduced (16s vs. 20s).

 

Of course, in reality, things are a whole lot more complicated due to implementation overheads, unpredictable program behavior, etc. Surprisingly, HT does seem to work well on a lot of workloads (esp. if you have multiple processor-intensive applications running simultaneously) . However, most desktop systems usually have a single compute-intensive thread (a game, media decoder, etc.) and multiple OS threads that are mostly I/O bound, so the utility of SMT on such systems is questionable.

[Bokishi]

mkreku's right, conroe or bust.

[WITHTEETH]

478 means you have a AGP Slot. a 3.4 northwood or Prescott are the best processors your mothoboard supports although yours might not be compatible with Prescott, I went with the northwoods anyway, they run cooler and overclock better.

 

I would say save yoru money till you can get a Core 2 Duo(conroe) or Core 2 Quad from intel. That way you wont be bottle necked by your cpu or Graphic card. Of course that means new ram, graphic card, and CPU. But your machine as of right now is pretty fast still.

[Hurlshort]

Yeah, I guess I'll stick with what I have and save up for a full upgrade in a year or so. I should be able to play most games with my current rig, albeit not with all the bells and whistles. It's this dang Vanguard game that got me thinking upgrade, since it doesn'trun well, but I think the issues are more with the game than my computer.

[mkreku]

If it's any consolation, Vanguard didn't run particularly well on my E6600 + X1950XTX either. It's a beta..

[Hurlshort]

If it's any consolation, Vanguard didn't run particularly well on my E6600 + X1950XTX either. It's a beta..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

After further research, namely people with almost my exact setup playing it fine, I've come to the conclusion the game is just not optimized yet. It's a bit concerning that they want to release it in two weeks, but it's nice that the pre-order folks basically get a three day test run before having to pay for the box. I'll be using that to see if it's worth buying.

[Kaftan Barlast]

Ive got an Intel E6600 too.. a ridiculous amount of power for little money. AMD's glory days are over, and thats from a man whove run AMD exclusively since the Thunderbird

[metadigital]

Well, I wouldn't write them off completely; Intel have just completely restructured now to a much smaller research footprint, so their lead in Research Power will be significantly reduced in the future.

[mkreku]

Also, it'll be fun to see what sort of mayhem AMD will cause once they release the K8L in the near future.

 

Not that I have especially high hopes for it, but you never know. It's just not being surrounded by the same positive vibe as Conroe was before it launched..

[angshuman]

Well, I wouldn't write them off completely; Intel have just completely restructured now to a much smaller research footprint, so their lead in Research Power will be significantly reduced in the future.

Sources?

[metadigital]

Hardcover ... about three months ago in PC Format, they were talking about the corporate management of Intel, saying that they were effectively downsizing their R&D (from stupendously ginormous to something twice the GDP of South America