External QA firms

[astr0creep]

Hello,

 

I previously found work in the video games industry by working for an external QA firm.

Basically, the company is hired by a publisher/dev studio to do QA in compatibility, functionality, pre-cert, etc.

Although I've worked there before, this concept of external QA always seemed strange. Why would a pub/dev add the extra costs of external QA, usually at the end of development, for a task they are well suited for internally?

 

Are they viable?

 

I'm asking these questions because I've been approached recently to join one yet again and I'm not sure I should. Seems to me trying harder to get noticed in a real Pub/Dev studio has more future(if I get the job...).

 

Here in the Montreal region I am only aware of 2 such firms: Enzyme and Bugtracker. Any others someone is aware of?

 

I will do a thorough search on the subject but I am starting here.

 

Thank you and have a nice day.

[kirottu]

Why would a pub/dev add the extra costs of external QA, usually at the end of development, for a task they are well suited for internally?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Troika never had internal QA team and Obsidian didn

[astr0creep]

Why would a pub/dev add the extra costs of external QA, usually at the end of development, for a task they are well suited for internally?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Troika never had internal QA team and Obsidian didn

[Hassat Hunter]

Alot of smaller devs do NOT have QA-testing stuff. Either they have the publisher do it (see Vampire, Dungeon Siege2 or Kotor2 to see what that does) or an external then.

 

And QA-testing is probably pretty expensive; as you need several teams to get through all the game and try to break it... just one dozen are not enough, and they have to work almost through all dev-cycle and more *yikes*

 

And at the end of dev cycle you could probably find more "free beta testers" (especially MMORPG's) or just alot of additional temp. testers to do stuff; and why hire them for such a short time and then fire again when you can just hire such a company for that time. Saves you money and effort/time

Edited March 29, 2006 by Hassat Hunter

[kirottu]

Troika I don't know but wasn't K2's QA fully done at LucasArts?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

It

[astr0creep]

Alot of smaller devs do NOT have QA-testing stuff. Either they have the publisher do it (see Vampire, Dungeon Siege2 or Kotor2 to see what that does) or an external then.

 

And QA-testing is probably pretty expensive; as you need several teams to get through all the game and try to break it... just one dozen are not enough, and they have to work almost through all dev-cycle and more *yikes*

 

And at the end of dev cycle you could probably find more "free beta testers" (especially MMORPG's) or just alot of additional temp. testers to do stuff; and why hire them for such a short time and then fire again when you can just hire such a company for that time. Saves you money and effort/time

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

All good points. Thanks

 

We were usually hired at the end of devtime. it was usually difficult to get a hold of a programmer because they were all out on hiatus.

[metadigital]

It's also a question of human resource management; having an external body doing the QA for several developers/publishers allows the hiring of fulltimers, rather than just the short-term contractors required for a single project.

[astr0creep]

Is it considered a decent way to enter the industry? I've made a few contacts but nothing that will allow me to make my carrer grow. I don't think.

[Judge Hades]

Doing QA on games would be my dream job. I love tearing things apart and tell devs what doesn't work.

Edited April 6, 2006 by Judge Hades

[Hassat Hunter]

Who doesn't?

 

Is it considered a decent way to enter the industry? I've made a few contacts but nothing that will allow me to make my carrer grow. I don't think.

 

Instead of just asking here I would suggest a PM to one of the OE-QA-testers that are browsing the forums (Joseph Bullock)... see if you get an answer and if you get one you can be sure it is ALOT more trustworthy that the post of some random person...

[Joseph Bulock]

Doing QA on games would be my dream job.  I love tearing things apart and tell devs what doesn't work. 

 

There's a bit more to it than that...

 

And as far as building a general game industry career out of QA, external QA experience is only useful to get you into an internal QA department, which the gives you access to real industry jobs. The only places to move up at most external testing firms is management, or if at a publisher, production.

 

And since its listed right next to every post I make, it would be awesome if my last name was spelled correctly Hassat.

[Judge Hades]

I am sure it is more to it than that. Or at least I hope there is more to it than that. I w2ould the type of QA person that would go into an area, play it over and over again with different styles and try to find as many things I can "break" then document each "break" and how it was broken by me, and whatever diagnostic code that spews forth if any. Once I get done with that go to the next area and rinse, dry, and repeat, unless there was a more important task that needed to be done.

 

At least that is how I imagine a QA job to be like.

[Hassat Hunter]

:">

 

Didn't care to look it up for my post and just made that from memory, and now it is too late to alter it

 

Once again :">

[Judge Hades]

Well, there are worse ways to mispell a name.

[Hassat Hunter]

I am sure it is more to it than that.  Or at least I hope there is more to it than that.  I w2ould the type of QA person that would go into an area, play it over and over again with different styles and try to find as many things I can "break" then document each "break" and how it was broken by me, and whatever diagnostic code that spews forth if any.  Once I get done with that go to the next area and rinse, dry, and repeat, unless there was a more important task that needed to be done.

 

At least that is how I imagine a QA job to be like.

 

I guess that would be the avarage QA-testers job... Depends on the game if 100 playthroughs through area X is severly sickening (Let's take for example Dungeon Lords) or still loads of good fun (Example: Majesty) though

 

Well, there are worse ways to mispell a name. 

 

Silent... You don't wan't to ruin our changes do you

Also I think it is mainly because I am an "unknown person (noob)" who writes it wrong... Devs can't keep up with all our alt-works...

[Joseph Bulock]

I am sure it is more to it than that.  Or at least I hope there is more to it than that.  I w2ould the type of QA person that would go into an area, play it over and over again with different styles and try to find as many things I can "break" then document each "break" and how it was broken by me, and whatever diagnostic code that spews forth if any.  Once I get done with that go to the next area and rinse, dry, and repeat, unless there was a more important task that needed to be done.

 

At least that is how I imagine a QA job to be like.

 

Thats a decent description for the lucky/newer testers. As one becomes more familiar with a game, one tends to get much more specific tasks.

[Nathaniel Chapman]

Why would a pub/dev add the extra costs of external QA, usually at the end of development, for a task they are well suited for internally?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Why would a developer add the extra costs of internal QA for the first two thirds of a project, when QA isn't really all that useful at that point beyond a couple of dedciated testers?

[kirottu]

Well, there are worse ways to mispell a name. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Are you thinking what I

[Joseph Bulock]

Well, there are worse ways to mispell a name. 

 

Are you thinking what I

[metadigital]

You are decended from the legendary line of asterices?!

[kirottu]

Well, there are worse ways to mispell a name. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Are you thinking what I

[Jack_Wellington]

I am also from Montreal and worked for Enzyme last summer...

 

If you are looking for a QA firm there is also Babel Media in Montreal.

 

I'm also trying to get into the videogame industry and I think a job in a dev studio is probably the best. But then, QA firm is better then nothing...

Edited April 18, 2006 by Jack_Wellignton

[metadigital]

did you spell your name incorrectly?

[Jack_Wellington]

No it is supposed to be Wellington.... can I/you change it?

[astr0creep]

I am also from Montreal and worked for Enzyme last summer...

 

If you are looking for a QA firm there is also  Babel Media in Montreal.

 

I'm also trying to get into the videogame industry and I think a job in a dev studio is probably the best. But then, QA firm is better then nothing...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I actually went for an interview at Babel about 1 month before they opened. I didn't apply for the right job however(localization) and I failed the written test. They asked if I would be willing to do something else for them but I was very hesitant, because of my experience at Enzyme(I was project manager and learned that some of their business ethics were... questionable).

 

Anyway, my reason for asking here is that, in order to get into the video games industry, external QA seemed to me as a dead end. Even internal QA, if you are not already well versed in video game making techniques such as programming, designing, etc AND have a buddy who has the power to promote you to the upper levels, it's a dead end. I've done both by the way.

It's a cool job for school drop outs but can anyone really get into the door of a game dev through external QA? I seriously doubt it.