Diablo 3 rumours.

[Jorian Drake]

There is no real 'PC RPG' or 'adventure game'....the spirit of pnp lies between the two...and more in the Adv. game then in 'RPG' 

(BG&E, Syberia, LJ, GK, BS, Shadow of Memories...)

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True enough but I am very focused in what makes a game a worthwhile CRPG or not. Diablo and Diablo 2 are both marketed and by industry standards belong to the CRPG genre, just like Icewind Dale, Baldur's gate, Planescape Torment, Jade Empire, and so forth and so on. So I will judge those game based on that.

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I don't give a d**n s**t about what they are marketed, and no one else should it, there are a LOT of games and movies what aren't what they're marketed like

 

I played both Diablo and Diablo 2 ,but only 2-3 times (I actually like Diablo 1 more), but they have just so many contact with RPG-s that the char is warrior/wizard/rouge...ect.

NOT MORE "

[Diamond]

Blizzard marketed it as a CRPG

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Action/RPG.

[Judge Hades]

Just because it has an Action Prefix doesn't change it from being a CRPG. Jade Empire is an Action CRPG and i still judge it the same way I judge any CRPG. A CRPG is a CRPG, may it be action, traditional, or otherwise. I judge them all the same and equally.

[alanschu]

I don't buy that apple/oranges argument.

 

A CRPG is a CRPG is a CRPG and I judge all CRPGs on the same criteria.

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What if it's evolving "

[Diamond]

Just because it has an Action Prefix doesn't change it from being a CRPG.

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It is not prefix. "Action/RPG". Means a mix of genres.

 

Jade Empire is an Action CRPG and i still judge it the same way I judge any CRPG.

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They are different. Just different. Even non-expert will tell you that.

 

A CRPG is a CRPG, may it be action, traditional, or otherwise.  I judge them all the same and equally.

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You are living in the world of black and white?

(Hint) There are also shades of gray.

[alanschu]

Hey, a game is what the publisher/developer says it is not what the fans say it is. Blizzard marketed it as a CRPG and who is better qualified to know the genre of Diablo than Blizzard?

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Ah, so you're finally admitting that Diablo is a CRPG?

 

Good for you.

[Diamond]

Ah, so you're finally admitting that Diablo is a CRPG?

 

Good for you.

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He makes progress. Watch his xfire for positive changes. :D

[Jorian Drake]

I like these games:

 

strategy

tactical

RPG

adventure

action

FPS

TPS

...

 

 

And becouse I'm not interested in how a game is marketed, I enjoy 'combined type' games too...I would love an RPG/action/adventure/strategy game, and the nearest to this was J. d'Arc , even if it had bugs..lot of that..in it.

 

(like: a noble family tries to make a fortune, build castles, generations evolve as RPG chars, make new citys, and design anything in the game<chars,buildings,city+it's name, coat of arms, the flag of the family, clothes+looks+wepons in RPG style of the guards/soldiers, ect..>)

 

Edited February 15, 2006 by jorian

[Judge Hades]

Yep, Diablo is a CRPG. A piss poor and boring CRPG but a CRPG nonetheless.

 

If the genre evolves, which it has over the last 20 years of CRPGs then all is good, but not all games takes a step forward and sometimes a game hits an evolutionary dead end. For basis of comparison I judge older games by doing a comparison to games that were released in the same timeframe (plus or minus a year or two).

 

I judge CRPG Hybrids as CRPGs, except for Dues Ex. For some odd reason that is the only exception. Can't explain why, but it is.

Edited February 15, 2006 by Judge Hades

[Diogo Ribeiro]

The only thing Diablo has was hordes and hordes of monsters that you kill over and over again.  There was no significant amount of dialog, no insight into the NPCs goals and desires, no strategic combat whatsoever.

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Your argument is spurious on several levels and you know it.

 

You make blanket statements of how Diablo has no depth but do not address the previous point of how its skill trees and item combination worked, and allowed players to develop characters with significantly different builds and strategies for combat. You claim it has no depth but fail to account for all the dozens of character builds possible for each character class which are based on different skill sets and items, thus allowing players to come up with different strategies depending on said builds.

 

That you lack any evidence that supports your claims of how all players have to do to advance in the game is to click on enemies repeatedly until they

[alanschu]

I think it's a testament to just how little he played the game.

[Judge Hades]

I played Diablo 1 and Diablo 2 for about 2 hours each and was bored out of my mind.

 

Character leveling is only half the character development portion of my criteria. With the various combinations it scores pretty highly, but with the next to nil dialog and complete lack character interaction it scores a 5 out of 10. What it has is good, but it is way too incomplete thusly fails.

 

Combat has a different criteria to go through than character development/builds. I go by the intelligence of the enemies, how well I can set up strategic ambushes and other surprises, and how well I can make use of my party/NPCs that I have in my group (either by joining me or by summoning). Diablo fails in this regard as well.

Edited February 15, 2006 by Judge Hades

[Judge Hades]

If Blizzard wants to make a proper CRPG out of Diablo 3 I think they should keep Diablo 2's character building system, give it PS:T style/depth character interaction, which you could have a party up to 4 to 6. Also it would help if the critters use smarter tactics than just swarm your character(s).

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Character leveling is only half the character development portion of my criteria.  With the various combinations it scores pretty highly, but with the next to nil dialog and complete lack character interaction it scores a 5 out of 10.  What it has is good, but it is way too incomplete thusly fails.

 

Your criteria doesn't support your statements. Bluntly put, the series has depth of gameplay wheter it fits your criteria for depth or not. Having less depth than what you enjoy seeing in other games, or having depth in gameplay mechanics which you do not care for does not mean it has no depth at all.

 

Combat has a different criteria to go through than character development/builds.  I go by the intelligence of the enemies, how well I can set up strategic ambushes and other surprises, and how well I can make use of my party/NPCs that I have in my group (either by joining me or by summoning).  Diablo fails in this regard as well.

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Again, that it does not adhere to your strict criteria or that you arbitrarily decide it has elements which differ from those you want to see more pronounced does not mean that it doesn't have your much vaunted depth. Diablo isn't Icewind Dale, therefore don't judge it on gameplay mechanics it doesn't have, and don't suggest certain gameplay options aren't available simply because they are different from one game to the other.

[mr insomniac]

Also it would help if the critters use smarter tactics than just swarm your character(s).

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More that I think about it, it actually kinda makes sense that they do this. Gives the game that "endless hordes of hell who don't care about how many losses they suffer" kinda feel.

[Judge Hades]

I judge all CRPGs the same way, RP. I am not going to change from that stance.

[Pidesco]

Regardless of whether the game is a good RPG or not, I think that Diablo is also a bad hack and slash game. It seems tome that a good hack and slash game requires a player to have good manual dexterity. And Diablo doesn't do that at all. All you have to do is hit the right pixels with the mouse cursor.

[Diogo Ribeiro]

I judge all CRPGs the same way, RP. 

 

You judge CRPGs by criteria based on high expectations and arbitrary guidelines; if you were intent on judging CRPGs in any meaningful degree you wouldn't stoop to accusing a roguelike of not meeting the standards of one party-based dungeon crawler series you happened to enjoy because they're obviously built on different gameplay aspects.

 

I am not going to change from that stance.

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So if that is the case, then stop spamming the forums with the same 'judging' which we all know by heart. We already know how Diablo doesn't conform to your narrow viewpoint, so move on.

[Judge Hades]

High expectations? I consider my expectations to be pretty damn low for the most part. I have one standard for CRPGs. If I change that standard from game to game the only thing that would be the result of that is chaos and inconsistancy. If it is narrow minded to have a singular standard then so be it. I rather be like that than accept swill.

[Jorian Drake]

High expectations?  I consider my expectations to be pretty damn low for the most part.  I have one standard for CRPGs.  If I change that standard from game to game the only thing that would be the result of that is chaos and inconsistancy.  If it is narrow minded to have a singular standard then so be it.  I rather be like that than accept swill.

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I have no expectations...and have myself suprised if a game is good (as I think of it)

[Judge Hades]

I don't have expectations, but I do have stnadards. Diablo 1 and 2 failed to meet them and both were boring games.

[Jorian Drake]

I don't have expectations, but I do have stnadards. Diablo 1 and 2 failed to meet them and both were boring games.

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I don't Judge a game before finishing it, only if I'm ready with it. Some 'bad' games have really suprised me with a good game ending and middle, or 'good' games with a bad ending ( )

[Diogo Ribeiro]

I have one standard for CRPGs.  If I change that standard from game to game the only thing that would be the result of that is chaos and inconsistancy. 

 

You already are chaotic and inconsistent in nearly everything you say, so I can't find any justification for doing otherwise.

 

If it is narrow minded to have a singular standard then so be it.

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Don't put words in my mouth. I didn't said it was narrow minded to have a standard, I said you have a narrow viewpoint because you apply the same standard to all CRPGs and subgenres when subgenres may have considerably different gameplay elements. It is narrow minded to apply universal standards to subgenres because in the process you're clearly judging what amount to different games under the same rules and refuse to accept it has considerable implications to any meaningful attribution of quality to gameplay specifics.

[Judge Hades]

If a game is completely boring I just stop playing. Diablo 1 and 2, along with Dungeon Siege 1 were all boring games.

[Jorian Drake]

If a game is completely boring I just stop playing.  Diablo 1 and 2, along with Dungeon Siege 1 were all boring games.

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Many good games (not refering to Diablos) have a slow, 'sleepy', boring start...I can't count how many of them I would have missed if I stoped playing them

 

Good I never did