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George W. Bush Justifies Off-The-Cuff Bigotry


Rhomal

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When I brought this up some people questioned if he said what I stated, to show I was not pulling this out of thin air...

 

http://www.religioustolerance.org/wic_pres.htm

 

http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/bushwicca.htm

 

As a pagan witch I am needless to say angry this shrill of a man has the audacity to question my faith when he can't even recite one quote from the bible he claims to read every week.

 

Edit: links fixed and I can use shrill any way I choose :p

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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When I brought this up some people questioned if he said what I stated, to show I was not pulling this out of thin air...

 

http://www.religioustolerance.org/wic_pres.htm&e=9735

 

http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/bushwicca.htm&e=9735

 

As a pagan witch I am needless to say angry this shrill of a man has the audacity to question my faith when he can't even recite one quote from the bible he claims to read every week.

of course, you still don't know the difference between tolerance and acceptance so your whining should be taken with a grain of salt. you don't accept his religion, why should he accept yours?

 

taks

comrade taks... just because.

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When I brought this up some people questioned if he said what I stated, to show I was not pulling this out of thin air...

 

http://www.religioustolerance.org/wic_pres.htm&e=9735

 

http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/bushwicca.htm&e=9735

 

As a pagan witch I am needless to say angry this shrill of a man has the audacity to question my faith when he can't even recite one quote from the bible he claims to read every week.

of course, you still don't know the difference between tolerance and acceptance so your whining should be taken with a grain of salt. you don't accept his religion, why should he accept yours?

 

taks

 

When did I EVER say his religion is not such or invalid? Please quote me.

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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When did I EVER say his religion is not such or invalid? Please quote me.

never directly... you continually balk at the fact that he's christian and doesn't accept paganism as a valid religion. you continually confuse the meaning of the terms "tolerance" and "acceptance." you don't accept his religion yet you want him to accept yours... i can't be any more obvious.

taks

comrade taks... just because.

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When did I EVER say his religion is not such or invalid? Please quote me.

never directly... you continually balk at the fact that he's christian and doesn't accept paganism as a valid religion. you continually confuse the meaning of the terms "tolerance" and "acceptance." you don't accept his religion yet you want him to accept yours... i can't be any more obvious.

taks

 

You dont have to beleive/follow in a religion to accept it is a religion. Why does he not state he wants to military to stop supporting ALL religions except his own then? By your logic he should.

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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I think its ridiculus nowadays that a complete governement is based on a religion. Religion has lost its use, and people start using it as an excuse to harm other people.

 

oh, and btw: I swear, the next time I hear that hypocrit (sp?) G.W. say "God bless America" , I'm gonna puke.

How can you bless the richest nation in the world when people are starving in Africa, people get shot or blow themselves up out of desperation in the middle-east???

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That's right heathen, now prepare to be converted!

 

 

Well, I think that depends if he lives in the bible belt or not. :)"

 

LOL.. Live in Boston, Mass just a stone throw away from witch capitol salem, mass. So I am pretty safe here. But I have heard MANY stroies of pagans in the bible belt being harrased and persecuted due to their religion.

 

A few documentated cases involve local church members erecting a cross in their front yard, being fired from their job and their house broken into and their altar vandilized/desacrated.

 

Those bush loving bible belt christians are such a loving and tolorent bunch.. heh

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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As a pagan witch I am needless to say angry this shrill of a man has the audacity to question my faith

he doesn't question your faith. he just doesn't believe it constitutes a religion.

 

there's a difference.

 

If i said such a think about say... Judaism... I'd be an instant anti-semite by default.

RS_Silvestri_01.jpg

 

"I'm a programmer at a games company... REET GOOD!" - Me

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If i said such a think about say... Judaism... I'd be an instant anti-semite by default.

no doubt you'd be criticized if you said such a thing about any of the widely-recognized religions. the point is that wicca isn't one of those religions.

dumber than a bag of hammers

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If i said such a think about say... Judaism... I'd be an instant anti-semite by default.

no doubt you'd be criticized if you said such a thing about any of the widely-recognized religions. the point is that wicca isn't one of those religions.

 

So if a religion isnt as large as christianity it does not count as a religion then?

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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So if a religion isnt as large as christianity it does not count as a religion then?

did i say that? i said that wicca wasn't a widely-recognised religion, not that it wasn't a religion.

 

It isn't? Its reconized by the US Military (has its own section in the chaplins handbook) and there are several large pagan churches that are reconized as such on state/federal level. Go to Borders or B&N and a entire section is devoted to paganism. There are many collages and high schools have support pagan groups. Heck, its even gone main streem. The popularity of charmed and buffy come to mind. (While they certainly take a mostly fictional or dramatized look at wicca the point stands)

 

I cant quite understand how you say this isnt a 'widely-recognised religion'. I have yet to meet someone who looks at me confused when the topic of religion comes up and I say 'pagan' or 'wiccan'. That aside, theres around half a million of us in the U.S. alone. Not bad for a religion that went fully public in the 70s. Estimated many millions world wide.

 

With all that said, You stated:

 

>no doubt you'd be criticized if you said such a thing about any of the widely-recognized religions. the point is that wicca isn't one of those religions.

 

So your advocating a doubble standard then?

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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It isn't?

no. most people in western countries haven't heard of it.

 

Its reconized by the US Military (has its own section in the chaplins handbook) and there are several large pagan churches that are reconized as such on state/federal level.Go to Borders or B&N and a entire section is devoted to paganism. There are many collages and high schools have support pagan groups. Heck, its even gone main streem. The popularity of charmed and buffy come to mind. (While they certainly take a mostly fictional or dramatized look at wicca the point stands)

so your evidence that wicca is a widely-recognized religion is (1) a chapter in the US chaplain's handbook; (2) recognition for tax purposes; (3) borders has a paganism section; (4) the existence of student groups; and (5) references to wicca in a couple of genre shows.

 

LOL. whatever buddy.

 

I cant quite understand how you say this isnt a 'widely-recognised religion'.

that's okay, you don't strike me as terribly objective on the matter.

 

I have yet to meet someone who looks at me confused when the topic of religion comes up and I say 'pagan' or 'wiccan'.

hmm, empirical stuff...

 

That aside, theres around half a million of us in the U.S. alone. Not bad for a religion that went fully public in the 70s. Estimated many millions world wide.

so what? sikhism and jainism have millions of followers, but i doubt most people in western countries could tell you what the fcuk a jain is.

 

With all that said, You stated:

 

>no doubt you'd be criticized if you said such a thing about any of the widely-recognized religions. the point is that wicca isn't one of those religions.

 

So your advocating a doubble standard then?

how am i advocating anything? i'm merely stating sociological fact. most people in western countries don't recognize paganism or wicca as a religion.

 

if you want to get huffy, fine. makes no difference to me.

dumber than a bag of hammers

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It isn't?

no. most people in western countries haven't heard of it.

 

Its reconized by the US Military (has its own section in the chaplins handbook) and there are several large pagan churches that are reconized as such on state/federal level.Go to Borders or B&N and a entire section is devoted to paganism. There are many collages and high schools have support pagan groups. Heck, its even gone main streem. The popularity of charmed and buffy come to mind. (While they certainly take a mostly fictional or dramatized look at wicca the point stands)

so your evidence that wicca is a widely-recognized religion is (1) a chapter in the US chaplain's handbook; (2) recognition for tax purposes; (3) borders has a paganism section; (4) the existence of student groups; and (5) references to wicca in a couple of genre shows.

 

LOL. whatever buddy.

 

I cant quite understand how you say this isnt a 'widely-recognised religion'.

that's okay, you don't strike me as terribly objective on the matter.

 

I have yet to meet someone who looks at me confused when the topic of religion comes up and I say 'pagan' or 'wiccan'.

hmm, empirical stuff...

 

That aside, theres around half a million of us in the U.S. alone. Not bad for a religion that went fully public in the 70s. Estimated many millions world wide.

so what? sikhism and jainism have millions of followers, but i doubt most people in western countries could tell you what the fcuk a jain is.

 

With all that said, You stated:

 

>no doubt you'd be criticized if you said such a thing about any of the widely-recognized religions. the point is that wicca isn't one of those religions.

 

So your advocating a doubble standard then?

how am i advocating anything? i'm merely stating sociological fact. most people in western countries don't recognize paganism or wicca as a religion.

 

if you want to get huffy, fine. makes no difference to me.

 

 

I dont think I was the one getting huffy.. *chuckle* But that aside I was just trying to understand your statement.

 

It seemed to me your of the stance if a religion is not considered a 'major' one it ok's to demean or/and not consider it a valid religion.

 

As least thats what I took away from it. I have been offering you many chances to clarify.

Admin of World of Darkness Online News

News/Community site for the WoD MMORPG

http://www.wodonlinenews.net

---

Jericho sassed me so I broke into his house and stabbed him to death in his sleep. Problem solved. - J.E. Sawyer

---

"I cannot profess to be a theologian; but it seems to me that Christians who believe in a super human Satan have got themselves into a logical impasse with regard to their own religion. For either God can not prevent the mischief of Satan, in which case he is not omnipotent; or else He could do so if he wished, but will not, in which case He is not benevolent. Fortunately, being a pagan witch, I am not called upon to solve this problem."

- Doreen Valiente

---

Expecting "innovation" from Bioware is like expecting "normality" from Valve -Moatilliatta

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The US Military recognizes Wicca as no less a religion as those practiced still by many Native Americans, for example. The Chaplain Corps, though predominantly served by Christian Ministers and Catholic Priests does employ many ministers of other faiths. I don't think Wicca is represented, but during my time training recruits, I never met a Wiccan who wanted to stay on past the first week or so. I had around 7 confirmed, legit Wiccans begin training under me, and all 7 asked to leave for a variety of reasons, but one common reason was conflict of duty with religious beliefs. We usually ended up sending them home, no hurt feelings.

 

As for the comments by Bush, it really sounds to me more like he just does not accept the religion as a valid one. He didn't make any statements that he would ban it or anything, he even said he wished the military would "do something about it". As the Commander in Chief of the US Military, he has all the power he needs to outlaw Wicca and other pagan religions if he really wants to. The stroke of a pen and that would be done. So, how I see all this is that he doesn't like the religion(s), but he isn't going to ban it (them) either.

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It seemed to me your of the stance if a religion is not considered a 'major' one it ok's to demean or/and not consider it a valid religion.

where did i say that? i simply noted that wicca is not widely-recognised as a religion. arguing that people shouldn't demean other religions is fine, but - as a moral standpoint - people at least have to agree that such-and-such is a religion before that rule can take effect.

 

whether bush's ignorance is excusable, is another matter. bush is ignorant of a lot of things so the fact that, as commander-in-chief, he doesn't seem to be aware of US military guidelines on paganism doesn't exactly surprise me.

dumber than a bag of hammers

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Doesn't this argument depend on what you mean by "widely-recognized"? It's not like that phrase has any objective meaning.

 

And of course Bush doesn't know what he's talking about when he talks about Wicca. I'd have been stunned if he did, given his cultural background.

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