Games out of Europe

[Child of Flame]

I was just sitting here thinking about what a bummer it would be if the majority of PC RPGs over the next couple of years DID in fact come from Europe, and us Yankees would have to wait longer for our games because of it....but then I realized that the games that already come out of Europe (Ubisoft's lineup comes to mind.) are released at the same time here and in Europe....so us having to wait longer for our gaming titles is only wishful thinking on the part of our European friends. The only reason the launch dates are delayed for so long in Europe is because of the several different languages all the games have to support....which is really no problem since English is one of those languages.

[StillLife]

Yeah it seems some of my favorite developers as of late are European. But I guess we all have to deal with localization delays. Europeans have been dealing with them for a long time now.

[mkreku]

Gothic 2 came out in Europe six months before it was released in the US..

[Child of Flame]

Well tie me down and call me kinky. All the games I'd been interested made by Euro teams have been released at the same time. *cough*Ubisoft*cough*

[mkreku]

Soldner: Secret Wars has already been released here. Will be released june 22 in NA.. Unfortunately that game kind of.. sucks, but still. It's a nice trend

[@\NightandtheShape/@]

<_< Can't think of many good games developed in the US anymore actually.... Most games I've enjoied has come from europe of late.

[The Situationist]

Games from Europe are really difficult to track down here, especially CRPGs.

 

[Child of Flame]

Games from Europe are really difficult to track down here, especially CRPGs.

 

Blame Mr. Freedom Fries up in the presidential suite. He don't like them frogs and nazis. <_<

 

 

Funny how he forgets that this pathetic country wouldn't even exist if the French hadn't bailed our asses out of the fire during the Revolutionary war.

[EnderAndrew]

France also forgets we helped them get their independence.

 

And then we bailed out France twice from German invasions. If it wasn't for the sacrifices of hundreds of thousands of troops, they'd be speaking German in France these days.

 

Yeah, France keeps forgetting that when they bad mouth us.

 

And most of the countries that bad-mouthed the US going into the Iraq war were screaming our motives were based upon oil. Yet the countries screaming where teh countries that had oil contracts with Iraq (France, Russia, etc.) And these were also countries that receive money from the U.S.

 

They love taking our money and then turning around bad-mouthing us.

[mkreku]

France also forgets we helped them get their independence.

 

And then we bailed out France twice from German invasions. If it wasn't for the sacrifices of hundreds of thousands of troops, they'd be speaking German in France these days.

 

Yeah, France keeps forgetting that when they bad mouth us.

Uhm.. This is not quite true, although I think this is what all American school books say. The truth is that the russian army faced 70% of Hitler's troops on the east front. 10% of their army was stationed in Italy and only 20% were fighting the "allied" forces. If the US hadn't come to France then the french people would probably be speaking russian today, not german..

 

Anyhow, what bothers most nations in the world is that the US refused to pay money to the UN for decades. They ended up owing the UN billions of dollars, but two weeks after the incident with the twin towers, the US suddenly paid all their debts. Then they asked the UN for help.

 

Oh, and do you know which nation has started the most wars during the 20'th century? US of A.

[Weiser_Cain]

Games from Europe are really difficult to track down here, especially CRPGs.

 

Blame Mr. Freedom Fries up in the presidential suite. He don't like them frogs and nazis. <_<

 

 

Funny how he forgets that this pathetic country wouldn't even exist if the French hadn't bailed our asses out of the fire during the Revolutionary war.

I don't like frogs and nazi's, do you?

You're blaming bush for the crummy distribution of videogames?!?

The french helped in the first war that's all, we would have won our independence eventually. Euorpe may never have become what it is today without the blood of our brothers and fathers, some of which still lay buried in french soil.

[EnderAndrew]

Uhm.. This is not quite true, although I think this is what all American school books say. The truth is that the russian army faced 70% of Hitler's troops on the east front. 10% of their army was stationed in Italy and only 20% were fighting the "allied" forces. If the US hadn't come to France then the french people would probably be speaking russian today, not german..

 

The march into Russia occured after the march west. The allied forces (British and French) were beaten fairly easily. Hitler then got c***y and tried to take over everything at once. He had troops in Africa for crying out loud. Even with only a small amount of troops in Western Europe, he had quite a hold.

 

There were these woods outside Paris (Bellau Wood - spelling?) where the Germans were deeply entrenched for years. There was heavy fog, low visibility and far too many german machine guns. Even the US army got tooled there. It wasn't until a smaller US Marine force got into those woods that the Germans were repelled and France was reclaimed for the Allies.

 

Stalin pulled back into Russia and baited Hitler in. Stalin did build his Eastern block in countries that people didn't seem to care too much about, but that was the tail end of the war. He was bold in staking a claim in half of Germany. But he also built a buffer to protect Russia in those countries. I doubt the world would have idly sat by and let Russia take a hold all the way in Western Europe with countries like France.

 

I think the fact that's glazed over in US history books in the death toll. We always hear about the 6 million Jews, but we rarely hear about the 20 some odd million Russian deaths, 3 million Poles, etc.

 

Anyhow, what bothers most nations in the world is that the US refused to pay money to the UN for decades. They ended up owing the UN billions of dollars, but two weeks after the incident with the twin towers, the US suddenly paid all their debts. Then they asked the UN for help.

 

I've never heard this. And maybe it's because we're too busy handing out money to a bunch of countries around the world. Russia would probably be a victim of civil war if we hadn't been giving them relief packages to afford heating and food. And every time the UN has an issue that needs dealing with, it is the US that spends dollars and lives taking care of it.

 

(In all fairness, Canada has always been right alongside the US in being first to volunteer troops and resources in every conflict, but Canada's resources are so much smaller that most people don't mention them).

 

Oh, and do you know which nation has started the most wars during the 20'th century? US of A.

 

Most conflicts that the United States started have had relatively small death tolls in comparison to the millions killed by Germany in the twentieth century.

 

And let's see. How many wars did the United States start?

 

Vietnam. Started by the French. The US bailed them out.

 

Korea, started by the Koreans. We bailed them out, and then we were stupid and pushed too far North. Korea was an exorcise in stupidity on many levels.

 

Afghanistan - started by the Afghani and Russian people. We helped out.

 

Iraq in '91. - Started by Iraq invading Kuwait. The UN asked the US to step in.

 

There have been small military deployments (Grenada, etc) all the time. But I wouldn't call any of those wars. So you may be hard pressed to find an actual WAR that the US started.

[mkreku]

The march into Russia occured after the march west. The allied forces (British and French) were beaten fairly easily. Hitler then got c***y and tried to take over everything at once. He had troops in Africa for crying out loud. Even with only a small amount of troops in Western Europe, he had quite a hold.

 

There were these woods outside Paris (Bellau Wood - spelling?) where the Germans were deeply entrenched for years. There was heavy fog, low visibility and far too many german machine guns. Even the US army got tooled there. It wasn't until a smaller US Marine force got into those woods that the Germans were repelled and France was reclaimed for the Allies.

 

Stalin pulled back into Russia and baited Hitler in. Stalin did build his Eastern block in countries that people didn't seem to care too much about, but that was the tail end of the war. He was bold in staking a claim in half of Germany. But he also built a buffer to protect Russia in those countries. I doubt the world would have idly sat by and let Russia take a hold all the way in Western Europe with countries like France.

 

I think the fact that's glazed over in US history books in the death toll. We always hear about the 6 million Jews, but we rarely hear about the 20 some odd million Russian deaths, 3 million Poles, etc.

 

Most conflicts that the United States started have had relatively small death tolls in comparison to the millions killed by Germany in the twentieth century.

 

And let's see. How many wars did the United States start?

 

Vietnam. Started by the French. The US bailed them out.

 

Korea, started by the Koreans. We bailed them out, and then we were stupid and pushed too far North. Korea was an exorcise in stupidity on many levels.

 

Afghanistan - started by the Afghani and Russian people. We helped out.

 

Iraq in '91. - Started by Iraq invading Kuwait. The UN asked the US to step in.

 

There have been small military deployments (Grenada, etc) all the time. But I wouldn't call any of those wars. So you may be hard pressed to find an actual WAR that the US started.

It's amazing how facts vary depending on which country you're from. Since I'm from Sweden and Sweden is neutral, I always assume that the news that reach us are somewhat unbiased. And let me tell you, they're entirely different from the way you seem to view the world.

 

The actual second world war was fought on the east front, but numerous movies, documentaries, pure propaganda films have depicted the entire war as being dependant on the US. This was not the case. As you stated yourself, a lot of russian soldiers perished in the war, but a lot of germans were also killed. The elite troops and the newest equipment were spent on the russian front. The soldiers who were entrenched on the western front were often young end unexperienced, mostly because the germans weren't expecting any big offensives from that direction, at least not until late into the war.

 

You claim the US hands out a lot of money to countries around the world. I don't know much about that, but I do know that the US trained the talibans in Afghanistan (with American funds and weapons) to stop the russian invasion. The Iran/Iraq conflict was made possible with American weapons. The Israel/Palestine conflict was started by American interests. How about Latin America? (I hope you can "read between the lines" in this document.)

 

Did you know Fidel Castro has survived 25-30 assassination attempts, all by the US? Have you heard of President Allende? Do you think the US protects democracy? Read this or this and see if it might change your mind a little. (I know it won't, but still.. It's difficult to change something you've been indoctrined with your entire life).

 

Do the US, being a huge country with a war machine that cost billions of dollars, have the right to invade any country they want for whichever reason they want? Do you believe in weapons of mass destruction? I bet you do, but the swedish UN Secretary (and weapons inspector) spent several months in cooperation with the Iraqi government and he filed a report (prior to the war) that there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. President Bush called Hans Blix a liar (not in those words) and decided to attack Iraq anyhow. Did you know that Iraq has been under a trade blockade since 1991? I saw Fox News declaring american soldiers as heroes and supermen as they used their high tech weapons to murder Iraqi soldiers. The truth is the Iraqi people don't have medicine, new technology or any sort of military power. Cuba has been under a similar blockade since forever (1950?).

 

If you still believe Bush's words (which I am sure you do) about America being "the lighthouse of democracy in the world", I suggest you take the time to read this site. It's a great source of facts about democratic incidents around the world. If you think envy is the cause of the widespread US resentment around the world, then this is a good page to read.

 

It is quite fascinating for me to read the choice of words you use when describing the US involvement in several conflicts. "bailed them out".. I hope you someday will realize how much unnecessary violence the US uses for "bailing" us smaller nations out. Most of these conflicts could probably have been solved diplomatically, although that is only speculation since it's already history.

[Sargallath Abraxium]

(In all fairness, Canada has always been right alongside the US in being first to volunteer troops and resources in every conflict, but Canada's resources are so much smaller that most people don't mention them).

...'bout damn time someone mentioned this...I, meself, was volun-told fer one such conflict that had absolutely nuthin' ta do wit' me own Country an had alot ta do wit' US politics...Canadian lads & lasses 'ave been fightin' an' dyin' fer our Friends since Canada became a Country in 1867, yet ne'er askin' fer e'en a simple "Thank You"...glad ta see at least a few still 'member that...

 

 

...WHO LUVS YA, BABY!!...

[Lord Halewyn]

France also forgets we helped them get their independence.

Exactly when did this happen? I'm pretty sure France existed before the US.

 

And as for saving them twice from the Germans, what makes you think Germany would have occupied France after winning WWI? They didn't do so after the previous war they won. And let's not even mention that the US only got involved because the Germans kept sinking American weapon transports.

[EnderAndrew]

It's amazing how facts vary depending on which country you're from. Since I'm from Sweden and Sweden is neutral, I always assume that the news that reach us are somewhat unbiased. And let me tell you, they're entirely different from the way you seem to view the world.

 

I don't trust a whole lot of news sources. Our major networks ABC/NBC/CBS all seem very biased and irresponsible in news reporting. I've seen textboots just flat out lie. I get my news from CNN and BBC, two world-wide respected companies.

 

As far as WWII goes, the war had three major fronts (discounting Africa). I never claimed that the Americans were the key to the entire war, though I probably could try to make that argument. I merely said the US bailed out the French in both World Wars, which I still contend. The United States did play a key role in WWII to pushing back Germany on one front, and Japan on the other. The other major key was Hitler being foolish enough to march into Russia in the winter. He didn't learn from Napoleon's mistakes.

 

You claim the US hands out a lot of money to countries around the world. I don't know much about that, but I do know that the US trained the talibans in Afghanistan (with American funds and weapons) to stop the russian invasion. The Iran/Iraq conflict was made possible with American weapons. The Israel/Palestine conflict was started by American interests. How about Latin America? (I hope you can "read between the lines" in this document.)

 

Iran attacked the US, or to be more correct, terrorist organizations from Iran attacked the US. The government refused to cooperate with our attempts to recover hostages, and to root out terrorism. Yes we gave weapons to Iraq and the Taliban. These were huge mistakes. And the CIA did a bunch of really horrible things in the '80s.

 

I think it's funny that we discuss this now while everyone is paying their respects to Regan. When he was alive people had no problem debating whether he was a great or horrible president. He brought down the Berlin wall, and worked with Gorbechov, but Regan had his flaws. He turned a blind eye to the CIA and gave them free reign.

 

Regardless, the Iraq/Iran conflict existed before the US. We didn't start that war. We didn't start a war in Afghanistan. Russia invaded. We helped protect an existant sovereign nation from invaders. You said the US started more wars than anyone else. You've still yet to mention a single war that the US started. The US may have been involved in more military conflicts than any other nation, but that doesn't mean the US started these conflicts.

 

Isreal/Palestine is a very difficult subject. First off, it was the UN's doing though the US played a large part in it. Perhaps it wasn't a fair compromise. One could argue that the nation should never have been created. I'm not sold one way or the other on that. However, the fact remains that Palestine is a terrorist state whose leadership supports suicide bombings of civilians. It's hard for me to have sympathy for Palestine.

 

Did you know Fidel Castro has survived 25-30 assassination attempts, all by the US? Have you heard of President Allende? Do you think the US protects democracy? Read this or this and see if it might change your mind a little. (I know it won't, but still.. It's difficult to change something you've been indoctrined with your entire life).

 

The CIA was horrible in the '80s. What has our track record been since then? Check the past few years. Check Liberia. During the 9/11 hearings, Democrats in the US have tried to lay the blame on Bush for the 9/11 attacks. Some say that we should have assassinated Osama Bin Laden years ago. However, that is no longer US policy. We do not try to assassinate foreign leaders. We did it with Castro, and it was a mistake.

 

Do the US, being a huge country with a war machine that cost billions of dollars, have the right to invade any country they want for whichever reason they want?

 

No. I would never contend as such. Does Sweden have a police force? Don't most countries have a police force? Why?

 

This is an imperfect world. Violence is deemed necessary to uphold law in most societies as sad as that may be. War is deemed as a necessary evil. Sweden has the luxury of not being a target of terrorism. When people show up on your doorstep and want you dead, let's see how you react.

 

Do you believe in weapons of mass destruction? I bet you do, but the swedish UN Secretary (and weapons inspector) spent several months in cooperation with the Iraqi government and he filed a report (prior to the war) that there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

 

A few things. Saddam Hussein admitted on television to using WMD on his own populace. In 1991, we seized WMD but we believed more were hidden. The UN Security Council UNANIMOUSLY voted over and over again on resolutions in regards to Iraq. These unanimous votes consistently said that Iraq had WMD and was in violation of previous resolutions. That wasn't some lie that we just made up. That's the opinion of the entire security council.

 

Bill Clinton then bombs Iraq and claims to have wiped out a signifigant amount of these weapons. Who knows. Then Bush points his finger at Iraq and says he's comming, but spends two years on diplomacy. During these two years weapons could easily have left the country. When we do get into Iraq, we find training labs, containers and documentation for WMD. And eventually we do find small stashes of WMD.

 

The question is not whether WMD existed in Iraq. They were found, and Hans was mistaken in that regard. The question was how many WMD existed, and have they left? For years Iraq kicked inspectors out of the country. When we told them to comply, they'd say, you can search in Place A at Time B. They didn't cooperate, and Hans Blix said that was just fine.

 

What kind of inspection is that? In Hans Blix did a thorough job of checking the country, how come he missed the weapons we found? Home come the security council unanimously said for 12 years that Iraq was not complying? How was it that anyone could see (except for Hans) that only allowing inspections in certain areas on certain days and kicking inspectors out of the country repeatedly was not cooperation. Yet Hans swore they were cooperating just fine.

 

Perhaps we did not have the agenda. Perhaps Hans had an agenda. Maybe it was one of peace. But covering up for a mass-murdering psychotic dictator in the name of peace is a case of misplaced intentions.

 

President Bush called Hans Blix a liar (not in those words) and decided to attack Iraq anyhow. Did you know that Iraq has been under a trade blockade since 1991? I saw Fox News declaring american soldiers as heroes and supermen as they used their high tech weapons to murder Iraqi soldiers. The truth is the Iraqi people don't have medicine, new technology or any sort of military power. Cuba has been under a similar blockade since forever (1950?).

 

Do you know why the trade blockade was in place? Saddam Hussein had something like 29 huge palaces. Each of these palaces was a full compound, a series of buildings. Each of these had to prepare royal feasts for every meal, regardless of whether or not Saddam showed up. Yet he starved his own people. Police made $20 a month in salary. Running water would be shut off in major cities. Saddam and the elite members of his political party were extremely wealthy while he denied food, water and medicine to his people. The trade blockade wasn't a full blockade. We said you can sell oil, so long as you can show that money is going to buy food for your country. Saddam refused. He sold oil but wouldn't show where the money went.

 

Palestine has been doing the same thing. I love how people scream about how the US is behind Isreal and hates Palestine. They fail to mention how we drop a 400-500 million dollar relief package each year on Palestine. In return, we ask to see how they spend the money, and each year they refuse. Last I heard, Bush was considering not giving them money. I hope he doesn't.

 

I think the Cuba embargo needs to be lifted. Jimmy Carter is very vocal in his agenda of trying to get it lifted. Maybe it will someday.

 

If you still believe Bush's words (which I am sure you do) about America being "the lighthouse of democracy in the world", I suggest you take the time to read this site. It's a great source of facts about democratic incidents around the world. If you think envy is the cause of the widespread US resentment around the world, then this is a good page to read.

 

I don't see the United States as being perfect, nor the outside world as being the enemy. However, as someone who does keep up on the news and remains politically active, I do support our involvement in Iraq. And so does the UN, though their support came after the fact.

 

It is quite fascinating for me to read the choice of words you use when describing the US involvement in several conflicts. "bailed them out".. I hope you someday will realize how much unnecessary violence the US uses for "bailing" us smaller nations out. Most of these conflicts could probably have been solved diplomatically, although that is only speculation since it's already history.

 

Immediately after 9/11, the UN Security Council unanimously passed another resolution in regards to Iraq and several leaders said they would support military action in Iraq. We then pursued two years of diplomacy while sympathy for 9/11 died down. All of a sudden, no one supported military action anymore. One could argue that by our pursuit of diplomacy we gained more of a reputation for being a war-mongering country.

 

I mentioned several conflicts.

 

In WW1, we bailed out France. Diplomacy had well failed there, and the US didn't rush into that war right away. We waited until we saw there was no other option.

 

The same thing in WWII. Europeans usually knock on the US for waiting too long, but we didn't want to go to War.

 

Vietnam was a mistake. France called us in for help and things got out of hand. This is perhaps the one time where diplomacy may have helped out quite a bit.

 

In Korea, China was supplying North Korea. North Korea was hell-bent on conquest and invaded South Korea. I don't think diplomacy was an option there initially. Though I should note that it was diplomacy that ended that war.

 

In Afghanistan, Russia invaded. Russia invaded many small countries in adding to the Soviet Union over the years. Repeatedly they told the world it was none of anyone's business but their own. Once again, diplomacy wasn't key here.

 

Diplomacy has failed in Iraq/Iran and Isreal/Palestine. That doesn't mean we haven't tried.

 

How would you define the US's role in relationship to France in WWI and WWII since that is what spawned this debate?

[mkreku]

There really isn't any idea discussing things like this. You have your beliefs and I have mine. What I would appreciate, though, is if you (like me) could provide some links/documents/texts that support your claims. I'm interested in reading whatever it is you americans read since you seem to be quite content with US politics over the last century.

 

I'm especially interested in hearing where you got the facts that they found WMD's in Iraq? I have heard no such news.

 

"Sweden has the luxury of not being a target of terrorism. When people show up on your doorstep and want you dead, let's see how you react." Did you ever ponder over WHY Sweden isn't a target for "terrorism"? Show up on your doorstep? Violence seldom comes unprovoked.

 

The text below is an open letter to President Bush from one of his own soldiers. You can easily find it on the internet. The highlight was put there by me though.

 

Dr. Robert M. Bowman, a retired Lieutenant Colonel from the USA Air Force, in an open letter to the USA President, George W Bush (2001):

 

"We are not hated because we practice democracy, freedom, and human rights. We are hated because our government denies these things to people in third world countries whose resources are coveted by our multinational corporations. And that hatred we have sown has come back to haunt us in the form of terrorism..."

 

"We are the target of terrorists because we stand for dictatorship, bondage, and human exploitation in the world. We are the target of terrorists because we are hated. And we are hated because our government has done hateful things. In how many countries have we deposed popularly elected leaders and replaced them with puppet military dictators who were willing to sell out their own people to American multinational corporations?"

 

"We did it in Iran when we deposed Mossadegh because he wanted to nationalize the oil industry. We replaced him with the Shah, and trained, armed, and paid his hated Savak national guard, which enslaved and brutalized the people of Iran. All to protect the financial interests of our oil companies. Is it any wonder there are people in Iran who hate us?"

 

"We did it in Chile when we deposed Allende, democratically elected by the people to introduce socialism. We replaced him with the brutal right-wing military dictator, General Pinochet. Chile has still not recovered."

 

"We did it in Vietnam when we thwarted democratic elections in the South which would have united the country under Ho Chi Minh. We replaced him with a series of ineffectual puppet crooks who invited us to come in and slaughter their people, and we did. (I flew 101 combat missions in that war....)"

 

"We did it in Iraq, where we killed a quarter of a million civilians in a failed attempt to topple Saddam Hussein, and where we have killed a million since then with our sanctions. About half of these innocent victims have been children under the age of five."

 

"And, of course, how many times have we done it in Nicaragua and all the other banana republics of Latin America? Time after time we have ousted popular leaders who wanted the riches of the land to be shared by the people who worked it. We replaced them with murderous tyrants who would sell out and control their own people so that the wealth of the land could be taken out by Domino Sugar, the United Fruit Company, Folgers, and Chiquita Banana."

 

"In country after country, our government has thwarted democracy, stifled freedom, and trampled human rights. That's why we are hated around the world. And that's why we are the target of terrorists."

 

"People in Canada enjoy better democracy, more freedom, and greater human rights than we do. So do the people of Norway and Sweden. Have you heard of Canadian embassies being bombed? Or Norwegian embassies? Or Swedish embassies. No. We are not hated because we practice democracy, freedom, and human rights."

 

"Instead of sending our sons and daughters around the world to kill Arabs so the oil companies can sell the oil under their sand, we must send them to rebuild their infrastructure, supply clean water, and feed starving children. Instead of continuing to kill thousands of Iraqi children every day with our sanctions, we must help them rebuild their electric power plants, their water treatment facilities, their hospitals; all the things we destroyed in our war against them and prevented them from rebuilding with our sanctions."

 

"Instead of seeking to be king of the hill, we must become a responsible member of the family of nations. Instead of stationing hundreds of thousands of troops around the world to protect the financial interests of our multinational corporations, we must bring them home and expand the Peace Corps. Instead of training terrorists and death squads in the techniques of torture and assassination, we must close the School of the Americas (no matter what name they use). Instead of supporting military dictatorships, we must support true democracy; the right of the people to choose their own leaders. Instead of supporting insurrection, destabilization, assassination, and terror around the world, we must abolish the CIA and give the money to relief agencies."

 

"In short, we do good instead of evil. We become the good guys, once again."

 

"The threat of terrorism would vanish. That is what the American people need to hear. We are good people. We only need to be told the truth and given the vision. You can do it, Mr. President. Stop the killing. Stop the justifying. Stop the retaliating. Put people first. Tell them the truth."

[EnderAndrew]

As far as a link, you seem distrustful of certain news sources. I just did a quick google search for "WMD FOUND IN IRAQ" and found tons of stories. I'll leave you to your own research.

 

However, you're most likely do discover stories on Sarin gas. In addition to this, months ago we discovered training labs with manuals detailing Iraq's techniques for the use of WMD, small samples and empty containers. You'll have to search a bit more for that however.

 

As far as the letter, I understand completely that man's sentiments. I think the CIA is a horrid organization. I think we made mistakes in past foreign policies. I've never argued that.

 

I merely stand by our current involvement in Iraq. As far as claims that our embargo killed a million people, that wasn't our embargo. That was the UN's embargo. I find it odd how often the UN does things that are unpopular, and the US gets blamed for it. Then people say that the US ignores the UN.

 

I would contend that two major differences seperate Norway, Canada, and Sweeden from the U.S. One is our history. The other is money. We have our past mistakes, and all we can do is try to deal with the consequences as best as we can. However, I do believe that the US is a target because of our ideals and money.

 

Here's an analogy. Take baseball. The New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox have the two highest payrolls in baseball, and in recent years have practiced similiar business practices. However, the Yankees are the king of the hill. Everyone points to them, and hates them. The Red Sox however, are much beloved despite doing the same things that people hate the Yankees for.

 

Thusly, I think to a certain extent some of the animosity towards the United States that does not befall other countries is because we're the king of the hill for the moment being. Why attack Canada when you could attack the US?

 

Read the Quran sometime. While there are non-violent Muslims, the text itself reads as being very militant. It calls for jihad, the destruction of infidels. It calls for blood, and promises a multitude of virgins in heaven for those who die in such pursuits. The problem is, that they need a villian. The US would likely fit that role even if past history weren't a factor.

 

If you doubt any claims I've made, then do some searches. You'll find that I'm an avid news junkie that does his best to base his opinions of facts.

[The Situationist]

Games from Europe are really difficult to track down here, especially CRPGs.

 

Blame Mr. Freedom Fries up in the presidential suite. He don't like them frogs and nazis. <_<

 

 

Funny how he forgets that this pathetic country wouldn't even exist if the French hadn't bailed our asses out of the fire during the Revolutionary war.

I'm not in America.

 

Christ this thread went downhill fast.

[mkreku]

Ok, if you want to read more about USA's actions in Iraq, check out this site:

 

http://www.fpif.org/

 

It's a great source for information about the foreign affairs of the USA.

 

I searched for the WMD's found in Iraq. It seems they found 500 haubitzer shells containing Sarin gas somewhere. I missed that piece of news, sorry. I still don't think that's reason enough to invade a country, kill hundreds of thousands of people and put a trade embargo (which have killed a million children since 1991, "According to Ramsey Clark's book, The Children Are Dying: The Impact of Sanctions on Iraq, the embargo of Iraq instituted by the Clinton administration managed to kill one million Iraqi children

[Child of Flame]

The march into Russia occured after the march west.  The allied forces (British and French) were beaten fairly easily.  Hitler then got c***y and tried to take over everything at once.  He had troops in Africa for crying out loud.  Even with only a small amount of troops in Western Europe, he had quite a hold.

 

There were these woods outside Paris (Bellau Wood - spelling?) where the Germans were deeply entrenched for years.  There was heavy fog, low visibility and far too many german machine guns.  Even the US army got tooled there.  It wasn't until a smaller US Marine force got into those woods that the Germans were repelled and France was reclaimed for the Allies.

 

Stalin pulled back into Russia and baited Hitler in.  Stalin did build his Eastern block in countries that people didn't seem to care too much about, but that was the tail end of the war.  He was bold in staking a claim in half of Germany.  But he also built a buffer to protect Russia in those countries.  I doubt the world would have idly sat by and let Russia take a hold all the way in Western Europe with countries like France.

 

I think the fact that's glazed over in US history books in the death toll.  We always hear about the 6 million Jews, but we rarely hear about the 20 some odd million Russian deaths, 3 million Poles, etc.

 

Most conflicts that the United States started have had relatively small death tolls in comparison to the millions killed by Germany in the twentieth century.

 

And let's see.  How many wars did the United States start?

 

Vietnam.  Started by the French.  The US bailed them out.

 

Korea, started by the Koreans.  We bailed them out, and then we were stupid and pushed too far North.  Korea was an exorcise in stupidity on many levels.

 

Afghanistan - started by the Afghani and Russian people.  We helped out.

 

Iraq in '91.  - Started by Iraq invading Kuwait.  The UN asked the US to step in.

 

There have been small military deployments (Grenada, etc) all the time.  But I wouldn't call any of those wars.  So you may be hard pressed to find an actual WAR that the US started.

It's amazing how facts vary depending on which country you're from. Since I'm from Sweden and Sweden is neutral, I always assume that the news that reach us are somewhat unbiased. And let me tell you, they're entirely different from the way you seem to view the world.

 

The actual second world war was fought on the east front, but numerous movies, documentaries, pure propaganda films have depicted the entire war as being dependant on the US. This was not the case. As you stated yourself, a lot of russian soldiers perished in the war, but a lot of germans were also killed. The elite troops and the newest equipment were spent on the russian front. The soldiers who were entrenched on the western front were often young end unexperienced, mostly because the germans weren't expecting any big offensives from that direction, at least not until late into the war.

 

You claim the US hands out a lot of money to countries around the world. I don't know much about that, but I do know that the US trained the talibans in Afghanistan (with American funds and weapons) to stop the russian invasion. The Iran/Iraq conflict was made possible with American weapons. The Israel/Palestine conflict was started by American interests. How about Latin America? (I hope you can "read between the lines" in this document.)

 

Did you know Fidel Castro has survived 25-30 assassination attempts, all by the US? Have you heard of President Allende? Do you think the US protects democracy? Read this or this and see if it might change your mind a little. (I know it won't, but still.. It's difficult to change something you've been indoctrined with your entire life).

 

Do the US, being a huge country with a war machine that cost billions of dollars, have the right to invade any country they want for whichever reason they want? Do you believe in weapons of mass destruction? I bet you do, but the swedish UN Secretary (and weapons inspector) spent several months in cooperation with the Iraqi government and he filed a report (prior to the war) that there were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. President Bush called Hans Blix a liar (not in those words) and decided to attack Iraq anyhow. Did you know that Iraq has been under a trade blockade since 1991? I saw Fox News declaring american soldiers as heroes and supermen as they used their high tech weapons to murder Iraqi soldiers. The truth is the Iraqi people don't have medicine, new technology or any sort of military power. Cuba has been under a similar blockade since forever (1950?).

 

If you still believe Bush's words (which I am sure you do) about America being "the lighthouse of democracy in the world", I suggest you take the time to read this site. It's a great source of facts about democratic incidents around the world. If you think envy is the cause of the widespread US resentment around the world, then this is a good page to read.

 

It is quite fascinating for me to read the choice of words you use when describing the US involvement in several conflicts. "bailed them out".. I hope you someday will realize how much unnecessary violence the US uses for "bailing" us smaller nations out. Most of these conflicts could probably have been solved diplomatically, although that is only speculation since it's already history.

You know he does have a point. Not ALL Americans believe all the stuff we're spoonfed by the gov'ment. For instance, I'm constantly demeaning the gov'ment pointing out most of the things you've depicted in your short little article there....to the detriment of my dad, who is extremely pro Bush, and would never believe that the gov'ment would do anything to harm anyone.

 

ON WITH THE REVALUCION!!!

 

 

;)

 

 

 

Though even my dad does admit that Bush has been planning his invasion of Iraq since before he was elected so he'd be able to show up his daddy.

 

Has anyone else heard of the recent captured civvies in Arabia by the 'terrorists' saying they're going to treat them the same as we recently treated our civilian 'prisoners of war'. I could've predicted that. I'm becoming more and more of the opinion that these 'terrorists' are much like we were when we rebelled against the British Empire.

[Mr. Teatime]

Whenever I get to thinking things are bad for me, I usually end up concluding, 'well at least I don't live in america'.

[EnderAndrew]

I searched for the WMD's found in Iraq. It seems they found 500 haubitzer shells containing Sarin gas somewhere. I missed that piece of news, sorry. I still don't think that's reason enough to invade a country, kill hundreds of thousands of people and put a trade embargo (which have killed a million children since 1991, "According to Ramsey Clark's book, The Children Are Dying: The Impact of Sanctions on Iraq, the embargo of Iraq instituted by the Clinton administration managed to kill one million Iraqi children

[Weiser_Cain]

....Has anyone else heard of the recent captured civvies in Arabia by the 'terrorists' saying they're going to treat them the same as we recently treated our civilian 'prisoners of war'.  I could've predicted that.  I'm becoming more and more of the opinion that these 'terrorists' are much like we were when we rebelled against the British Empire. 

Next time you're thinking about how bad we are just think about how the world would be without us. If that doesn't work just think about how any other country in the world would act if they were in our place. If by some bizarre quirk you still feel anti-american seek help.

[mkreku]

Next time you're thinking about how bad we are just think about how the world would be without us. If that doesn't work just think about how any other country in the world would act if they were in our place. If by some bizarre quirk you still feel anti-american seek help.

I honestly think this would be a better world to live in if the US wouldn't interfere in other countries businesses. If by some bizarre quirk you still think the US are the good-doers of the world, please read more books. (Or at least read some of the links I've provided above.)

 

The problem is, that they need a villian. The US would likely fit that role even if past history weren't a factor.

Ok, just answer me this then: Name one time in history when a muslim country started a war on the US and called for Jihad? Feel free to provide a link to where you get your facts too! (for the first time in this thread)