Skill breaking points

[Desmodeus]

Anyone made any tests about what are breaking point for which active and passive skill. For example how much survival is needed to succeed in survival all checks or how many mechanics is overkill for most of locks(that one door in forgotten sunctum is exception)?

[Kaylon]

Someone made a spreadsheet with everything you need to know about that:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VOXnwhAVZ2bqGJgw-cgJlG0TIqt9j3zJJbRx1epH3ho/edit#gid=0

[Noqn]

Wow, that was not a comprehensive post in hindsight.

 

22 minutes ago, Kaylon said:

Someone made a spreadsheet with everything you need to know about that:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VOXnwhAVZ2bqGJgw-cgJlG0TIqt9j3zJJbRx1epH3ho/edit#gid=0

I may be wrong but this link seems to be pre-DLCs?

[omgFIREBALLS]

The hell do you need 20 Streetwise for?

[Boeroer]

Talking people into a shell game?

[Griffonheart]

1 hour ago, omgFIREBALLS said:

The hell do you need 20 Streetwise for?

Something along this line: 

 

[omgFIREBALLS]

So... do you actually know where this check is? Streetwise has long felt like the safest passive to ignore for me

[thelee]

Problem with that spreadsheet is that it doesn't appear to really highlight when the breakpoints are important. (Reminding me of the joke about the statistician who drowned while trying to cross a river that was on average only 3 feet/1 meter deep.)

I only have an intuitive sense based on experience:

• Intimidate is extremely important for one armor (extra deflection) and you need like 20+ for a non-violent resolution to pre-porokoa SSS.
  • You also need high metaphysics (and possibly arcana?) to solve the three beings the most "correctly." Metaphysics is also useful for several items.
• Religion is somewhat important depending on items (off the top of my head, a great sword, a bow, xoti's sickle, the fire flail) but is otherwise mostly flavor.
• History is very important if you want to maximize the cloak that gives you +all non-deflection defenses, but is very weak flavor everywhere else
• Survival is important for many world map encounters, but I don't think you need more than 10 or so.
• IIRC Survival/Alchemy on the scale of 10-15 is needed to have a peaceful resolution with the fungi in FS.
• Athletics is notably useful for that island with the bridge crossing, though honestly sometimes I create a sacrifical character.
• Diplomacy is useful, but if you have ~10 that solves most of the places where you can use it help with quest resolution. (I don't know what the 17 check is in that spreadsheet, sorry.)
• I'm not sure the high Bluff checks actually help with quest resolution. This is sort of the problem - sometimes there's no alternate outcomes or a redundant alternative outcome so you just get some extremely difficult-to-hit fluff.
  • At least in Fallout: New Vegas you'd get experience for succeeding at difficult but irrelevant checks.

Insight, Streetwise have little to no value to me. 

 

edit: i did some research for SSS and FS breakpoints as part of my ultimate run planning but I honestly can't find them anywhere. If I was more motivated I'd dig through the ultimate thread or go through my videos, but eh...

Edited February 18, 2021 by thelee

[Boeroer]

Survival influences the height of the autohit-AoE debuff of Ngati's Tusk. With Survival 20 it will reduce all defenses in 2.5m base radius by 10 (iirc) without any hit roll or immunity. 

[omgFIREBALLS]

1 hour ago, thelee said:

If I was more motivated

[Not So Clever Hound]

On 2/18/2021 at 6:30 PM, thelee said:

IIRC Survival/Alchemy on the scale of 10-15 is needed to have a peaceful resolution with the fungi in FS.

There is also the option of a Diplomacy check but it's high, in the 20's. You can also get lower checks in this discussion if you accept the symbiote (at the condition that it will respect your boundaries ) which has zero impact on anything else in the game as far as I know. Possibly in this case you get a "simple" Survival 15 check or even a RES check of 12 if I recall correctly. Bottom line is, there are multiple options to solve this peacefully if you've visited the enclosures first and/or if you have found and read the annals of Llengrath up to this point.

Edited February 22, 2021 by Not So Clever Hound

[Jayd]

I didn't even know you could do the fungus part peacefully. I take that miserable fight every time. It checks my patience.

[Not So Clever Hound]

38 minutes ago, Jayd said:

I didn't even know you could do the fungus part peacefully. I take that miserable fight every time. It checks my patience.

Yeah, the peaceful resolution is nice because after that all the shrooms in FS and their infested pals will be peaceful. Usually when I'm at this point of the game, trash mob fights are getting a bit old, so I welcome the opportunity to bypass those fights and get to the end of FS a little faster!

[Noqn]

Alchemy	17	LAX03_02_si_fungus_table	Through a cautious application of alchemical procedures, you purge the toxins from the beaker, replacing it with a potent admixture of growth enhancers.
Arcana	20	LAX03_03_cv_enchanted_armor	[Break the enchantment.]
Athletics	22	LAX03_02_si_false_wall	You throw the whole of your weight and strength against the wall and it collapses under you in a rush of dust and rubble.
Bluff	20	28_cv_Kinnuq	"I came to pledge my loyalty to Nemnok."
Diplomacy	23	LAX03_03_cv_spore_hive_mind	"This is wrong. You're clearly more than some parasite."
Explosives	20	LAX03_02_si_false_wall	You take cover as the expertly-placed implosion charge detonates. With a keening shriek, it tears down the wall, consigning the rubble to the void and leaving the path open to you.
History	18	LAX03_02_cv_vithrack_leader	"To be binding, this contract should've been ratified by the Huana monarch or their advisor. It was not."
Insight	20	lax03_03_cv_book_pedestal_archive_01	Gears click and whir beneath the device's skin. After a few moments listening, a faint tap tap sounds on the inside. Tap, tap. Tap, tap, tap. It stops.
Intimidate	22	LAX01_00_cv_whehami	"You've seen me fight! I'm the Champion of the Hunt!"
Mechanics	26	LAX03_03_si_archives_vault_door	After an hour of sweaty, difficult work, a peal of clanging contraptions announces... something.
Metaphysics	20	LAX03_04_cv_starmetal	You open a metaphysical bridge between your soul and the entities inhabiting the mineral.
Religion	16	LAX02_01_cv_hafjorn_confront	"Rymrgand did not intend for his child to live forever."
Sleight Of Hand	18	LAX03_04_cv_fungus	[Harvest the pustules.]
Stealth	18	LAX01_00_SI_Old_Bones	As you make your way silently through the undergrowth, you overhear a group of kith nearby. You see them moving quietly among the trees, draped in hides and armed for the hunt.
Streetwise	20	re_si_supply_wagon_trap	"How about I pay you a toll, and we all walk away. This road need not be anyone else's grave."
Survival	19	26_si_witch_guardians	You trudge onward. Deep pits of water and sucking mud cover the ground everywhere you look, but you manage to avoid them through caution and attentive footing.

Edited February 23, 2021 by Noqn

[Noqn]

On 2/15/2021 at 6:31 AM, omgFIREBALLS said:

The hell do you need 20 Streetwise for?

Ok wtf, the Streetwise 20 check is in the scripted interaction with the traveling Dawnstars near Port Maje.

Apparently there's variant of the encounter baked into the same convo file, where you find an abandoned wagon and some bandits instead... has anyone ever gotten this encounter?

[Boeroer]

[Not So Clever Hound]

Maybe if you never ever help them and come back in late game you get this interaction - which would explain why no one usually gets this variant? Or it could be cut content? Funny how random things still get uncovered in the game at this point  .

On a similar but unrelated note,  I've noticed that the Amira's Blessing buff that you can get during the Arsonist event in Neketaka is not really referenced in builds/posts playing No-Rest, but it's a sweet +2 DEX that you can receive only if you get in the house, investigate but don't pursue the arsonists. I guess most players (like me most of the time) get in and rush to get the arsonists and the flame blights in the back. Maybe it's common knowledge, but I only discovered that it's more beneficial to not pursue them and debrief with the neighbors instead randomly.

[thelee]

ugh seems to justify my hate on insight/streetwise. the latter is content no one has ever seen, the former is definitely fluff afaict.

[Jayd]

I take pretty high insight all the time and there's definintely fluff but I feel it helps decently often. Off the top of my head, like that lady who turned herself into a construct, and reaching into that weird machine in FS and uh...the fella with the boars...?

Why do I take insight?

I think it started because I used to pick the philosopher background for flavour and that gives two insight (even though the actual instances of 'insight' in the game have absolutely nothing to do with philosophical insight- it's more like emotional intelligence, which philosophers are actually extremely bad at). Think I should maybe change things up a bit going forward. It's so habitual now that when I see a failed insight check I actually feel like I've failed myself, though.