Almost infinite damage loop with Deltro's and Strand of favour

[Waski]

yeah, it looks like i messed  up somehow testing with gipon, effect clears

[Raven Darkholme]

If it wasn't for stuff like BDD or even Ogre belt it would still be insanely op, but I feel like its just not needed, you either have a class with bdd or you're gonna use ogre belt...

[Not So Clever Hound]

You guys probably know this by heart already but an Assassin/Cipher with Thunderous Report can really milk the Infinite Deltro Lash to one-shot essentially every non-boss opponent in an AoE.

On the screenshot below I only had a 115% Deltro lash. In this case, Thunderous Report can reach ACC=183 and PEN=33 on Crit and of course ridiculous DMG, which is nice for the Deltro lash. Then you have the Everything and Anything lash from Kitchen Stove and the Biting Whip lash. Your one-shot automatically triggers invisibility from Slippers of the Assassin. Of course it's not an Ultimate-friendly build, but it's fun!

 

[Not So Clever Hound]

Hey there,

I wanted to possibly get your thoughts on 2 points:

1) I'm not sure if it's been mentioned already (most probably) but the upgraded Amra no-drawbacks frenzy proc is great with the Strand of Favor trick for any non-Barb build in the game. Even maybe to barbs. Permanent +25% Action Speed, +5 MIG, +5 CON.

2) I feel like the Strand of Favor + Deltro's Cage Helm + everything else you can think of that is worth extending duration on is somewhat ruining my gameplay now as it is so powerful... so my question is: how do you guys maintain the interest and maybe the discipline to play once you know that Strand of Favor + Deltro's and other strong effects that can be extended are so transformational to the game balance? Do you manage to avoid them, or only use for Ultimate run prep?

[Boeroer]

I simply don't use it. For the same reason I don't use Deltro's Cage Helmet much and also not Salvation of Time, Barring Death's Door, Wall of Draining, Brilliant in general, Thunderous Report, scrolls and Streetfighter with blunderbusses. It's fun to find out about it and use it for a short while - but boring af in the long run. 

I never even once used the Strand of Favor trick in an actual playthrough. 

[Not So Clever Hound]

Thanks @Boeroer. But then, if I may, where do you draw the line between boring OP-ness vs. genuine, wholesome POE2 fun?

To me for instance the line of scrolls replicating/stealing class-defining abilities is clear. It sucks and it shouldn't happen. I like your idea that scrolls should have different effects altogether BTW.

But then, would you use Whispers of the Wind with Blunderbuss, although clearly WotW is meant to be a melee trick especially knowing that Blunderbusses are by definition one-shot weapons? How is that different from Deltro's Helmet + Extend Duration?

It's totally fine if you tell me "because I like it so " I'm just trying to understand how other players manage this aspect.

Edited March 19, 2021 by Not So Clever Hound

[Boeroer]

1 hour ago, Not So Clever Hound said:

Thanks @Boeroer. But then, if I may, where do you draw the line between boring OP-ness vs. genuine, wholesome POE2 fun?

In this case it's simply based on my enjoyment. Therefore I first need to try it (in most cases).

Of course it's not much fun to play an underperforming character in CRPGs (while it can be fun in TTRPGs) as well. But the opposite - like playing a character who has a win-button build in - is also no fun. It's a tightrope walk - but the rope is rel. thick I think.

I can have fun with a lot of characters. One key is some interesting, effective mechanics but not too much repetitive micro (like using 123 buffs every time combat starts), another that I personally discovered some nice things about my character build and also that I can somehow connect to the character. That includes a somewhat believable appearance, motivation and backstory - even if it's just a rudimentary thing in the back of my head. So playing a Huana Debonaire in Patinated Plate with Fair Favor, rapier + flail and using the drunk pose... not for me.

Anyway: some stuff just feels too strong for me to enjoy it. I don't say other players shouldn't enjoy them - just play how you like it of course. It's just my personal preference and it's complicated.    

There are even exceptions: I consider SC Monk with dual mortars pretty OP in a party setup for most fights - yet it was so much fun to play.    

Edited March 19, 2021 by Boeroer

[Not So Clever Hound]

@Boeroer Thanks for indulging me, as always your points are crystal-clear and anyone can tell from your posts that you value creativity and fun playstyle over plain OP-ness.  I'm not sure that the rope is as "thick" or clearly defined as you state though. My problem is that once I've found a foolproof, superior solution to a challenge, it's very hard to ignore it and go on about my business, back to sub-par solutions in the name of balance or fun. The superior yet cheezy/loophole-ish solution will always lurk in the back of my head .

Let me illustrate a bit more:  as a solo Sorcerer in Infinity Engine games I always loved the Chain Contingency - Abi Dalzim trick because it's insanely powerful... It is in the game even if a little too OP, everyone had decades to correct it but didn't, and it is a very fun combo to use. Now I try to avoid using Sunfire + Invisibility in vanilla because even if it's allowed in the game (Sunfire doesn't break basic invisibility in vanilla), it's too powerful. But still, sometimes I do indulge in it because it is there! It's not like I'm breaking the game and using the console. I'm just playing the game within its parameters.

So in a game like PoE2, where after many versions of the game and all the telemetry/nerf-batting there could be, you have a Strand of Favor and Deltro's Helm effect combo that can quadruple your damage output forever just like that. How do you not just use it all the time. You have a strong soul  but I struggle!

[Boeroer]

18 minutes ago, Not So Clever Hound said:

My problem is that once I've found a foolproof, superior solution to a challenge, it's very hard to ignore it and go on about my business, back to sub-par solutions in the name of balance or fun. The superior yet cheezy/loophole-ish solution will always lurk in the back of my head .

I used to be that way, too. Also in TTRPG sessions. Age somehow cured this.

 

 

[Not So Clever Hound]

6 minutes ago, Boeroer said:

Age somehow cured this.

I see. you might want to put a bit of white hair on your trademark Boeroer icon then... or are you in denial?  

Thanks for your thoughts, I'll try to tame my search for powa! in favor of style and fun. Or ideally, all 3.

[Not So Clever Hound]

So I've been tinkering around this nice damage loop with Deltro's Cage Helm + Strand of Favor. Ping-ponging between two Assassins, one using Chain Lightning scrolls and the other one using a Mythic Kitchen Stove with Thunderous Report to pass on the lash to get fast to crazy high damage numbers.

In just 3 ping-pong I got to this lash. Sorry, the picture quality sucks, I can get a better one or simply state that the lash was +26566%.

 

And then, it did this, i.e  over 90k of damage.

Is it interesting? I don't know. Is it useful? I don't know either. Does it exist? Yes it does!  

Edited April 18, 2021 by Not So Clever Hound

[dgray62]

I guess there's no limit to the crazy damage you can inflict with this exploit. Enough to one shot even the megabosses, I'm sure.

[Not So Clever Hound]

27 minutes ago, dgray62 said:

Enough to one shot even the megabosses, I'm sure

With 90k DMG per hit you can probably one shot Eothas before he wreaks havoc on Caed Nua . Then you can just relax and go to Brackenbury have a beer with the Doemenels.

[dgray62]

1 hour ago, Not So Clever Hound said:

With 90k DMG per hit you can probably one shot Eothas before he wreaks havoc on Caed Nua . Then you can just relax and go to Brackenbury have a beer with the Doemenels.

Too bad you have to go to Deadfire to get the Strand of Favor.

[Raven Darkholme]

A damn shame this doesn't work solo.

[Kaylon]

On 3/19/2021 at 7:09 PM, Not So Clever Hound said:

I feel like the Strand of Favor + Deltro's Cage Helm + everything else you can think of that is worth extending duration on is somewhat ruining my gameplay now as it is so powerful... so my question is: how do you guys maintain the interest and maybe the discipline to play once you know that Strand of Favor + Deltro's and other strong effects that can be extended are so transformational to the game balance? Do you manage to avoid them, or only use for Ultimate run prep?

I think you should finish the game for the first time, in a serious way, without using any kind of exploits/mods. After that you won't feel guilty anymore and you can play just for fun, pass over the boring parts quickly and explore things you missed the first time.

[Not So Clever Hound]

1 hour ago, Kaylon said:

I think you should finish the game for the first time, in a serious way, without using any kind of exploits/mods. After that you won't feel guilty anymore and you can play just for fun, pass over the boring parts quickly and explore things you missed the first time.

Yes that's fair. I've actually done my share of complete playthroughs with no or minimal cheese. I just came very late to the party in terms of all the exploits that the community discovered over time - and my jaw quite literally dropped with some of those. But I've recovered now . I know when I want to play builds "in a serious way" as you say, and I when I want to have fun discovering how much the game lets us get away with.

[dgray62]

I agree. I finished the game once without any mods installed, and without knowledge of any exploits, as a SC monk, which slowly builds power naturally throughout the game. Now I play around with different builds, mods and exploits just for fun.

[dgray62]

22 hours ago, dgray62 said:

Too bad you have to go to Deadfire to get the Strand of Favor.

On second thought, Eothas must be immune to lightning in a body made of living adra.  The exploit probably wouldn't work on him even if it was possible.

[Not So Clever Hound]

51 minutes ago, dgray62 said:

immune to lightning in a body made of living adra

The Adra Dragon was immune to Shock and Burn, that's true.

Eothas showed that he was impervious to Burn at Ashen's Maw.

It is probably reasonable to assume he's impervious to Shock as well.

That beer with the Doemenels will have to wait .