Can someone comment on the spellshaping?

[thelee]

Beta patch notes mentioned:

 

• Spell shaping is available for the Wizard, Druid, Priest, and Chanter classes! This passive ability allows for spell casters to adjust certain AoE spell radii to increase the power level or area that the spell can reach!

I'm *really* intrigued by this, and wondering if anyone had a chance to try it before the beta patch got pulled.

[InsaneCommander]

It allows you to use the "zoom" (mouse wheel) to increase/decrease the area of effect. I could only check it briefly so I didn't notice any indications of how the PL changed.

[thelee]

It allows you to use the "zoom" (mouse wheel) to increase/decrease the area of effect. I could only check it briefly so I didn't notice any indications of how the PL changed.

I'd be real curious to know how it interacts with something like supprpess affliction or salvation of time which afaict have no PL scaling.

[InsaneCommander]

It allows you to use the "zoom" (mouse wheel) to increase/decrease the area of effect. I could only check it briefly so I didn't notice any indications of how the PL changed.

I'd be real curious to know how it interacts with something like supprpess affliction or salvation of time which afaict have no PL scaling.

 

I didn't check a priest, but for the wizard you can see both in the ability tree and in the spell selection during combat which spells can be adjusted. Maybe those spells can't be changed?

[Purudaya]

There are a few AoE spells that can't be changed - missile salvo is one of them, meteor shower is another (IIRC). The ability tree will indicate which spells can be shaped once you have selected the spell shaping ability. From what I can tell, the spells that can be adjusted have three settings, available via the zoom function: (1) standard AOE, (2) about 30-40% larger at -1 PL, and (3) about 30-40% smaller at +1PL.

 

The effects of the PL adjustment are generally pretty miniscule - the percent chance to hit usually only goes up or down by a few ticks. It really makes a difference for friendly-fire abilities, though; enough to have me reconsidering spells I previously passed over now that they can be more flexibly targeted. Great feature.

[Volsalex]

Several more questions about spellshaping:
1)  Can you change the area of any "wave" spells (Rolling Flame, Crackling Bolt, etc.) or "cone" spells (Fan of Flames, etc.). If so, does it increase wave/cone length or its size?
2)  Is the extended area from Spell Shaping for circular spells foe-only, or does it scale both friend-foe and foe zones equally?

[thelee]

There are a few AoE spells that can't be changed - missile salvo is one of them, meteor shower is another (IIRC). The ability tree will indicate which spells can be shaped once you have selected the spell shaping ability. From what I can tell, the spells that can be adjusted have three settings, available via the zoom function: (1) standard AOE, (2) about 30-40% larger at -1 PL, and (3) about 30-40% smaller at +1PL.

 

The effects of the PL adjustment are generally pretty miniscule - the percent chance to hit usually only goes up or down by a few ticks. It really makes a difference for friendly-fire abilities, though; enough to have me reconsidering spells I previously passed over now that they can be more flexibly targeted. Great feature.

 

Interesting. Personally, given the nature of PL scaling, where party-friendliness is not a concern, it seems like I'd always want a bigger AoE. -1 PL is not that big of a deal compared to +30% aoe (so long as you're actually getting an extra target).

 

(edit: from my power-level scaling guide--unless they tweaked it--one PL will only make a single point difference in accuracy one way or another, unless it's an ability that only has an accuracy roll. so it's extremely minor for most abilities)

Edited October 22, 2018 by thelee

[InsaneCommander]

Interesting. Personally, given the nature of PL scaling, where party-friendliness is not a concern, it seems like I'd always want a bigger AoE. -1 PL is not that big of a deal compared to +30% aoe (so long as you're actually getting an extra target).

 

(edit: from my power-level scaling guide--unless they tweaked it--one PL will only make a single point difference in accuracy one way or another, unless it's an ability that only has an accuracy roll. so it's extremely minor for most abilities)

 

I was thinking the same thing. Loosing just 1 PL is more than ok for that area increase.

[Lampros]

Can you only change during combat?

[InsaneCommander]

Can you only change during combat?

 

No. My first test was hitting some fools in the Wild Mare. It was not combat. Yet.

[SChin]

Hey everyone!

 

Just to clarify; Making the AoE larger with spell shaping reduces the power level of the spell by 5, not by 1.

 

Making the AoE smaller increases the power level by 1.

 

Hope that helps!

[AndreaColombo]

That information should really be in the talent's description.

[Volsalex]

With such restrictions, I suppose Cipher should get this passive as well. It is pretty much a useful versatility tool where you can choose between bigger/longer effect or possibility to affect more targets losing a significant amount of power/duration (~20-25%).

[thelee]

 

Hey everyone!

 

Just to clarify; Making the AoE larger with spell shaping reduces the power level of the spell by 5, not by 1.

 

Making the AoE smaller increases the power level by 1.

 

Hope that helps!

 

 

thanks for that clarification.

 

-5 PL is definitely a more significant trade-off for more aoe. looking forward to playing with it.

[Purudaya]

 

Hey everyone!

 

Just to clarify; Making the AoE larger with spell shaping reduces the power level of the spell by 5, not by 1.

 

Making the AoE smaller increases the power level by 1.

 

Hope that helps!

 

 

Wow, by 5? That makes sense actually, as the to-hit chance seems to decrease more with a large AoE than it increases with a small one. I agree that the ability description should be updated with the specifics, especially given that the PL adjustment is asymmetrical.

[Archaven]

Wow -5 is really harsh. Is there incentive if shaping it bigger?

[protopersona]

Wow -5 is really harsh. Is there incentive if shaping it bigger?

Mainly just the ability to hit more targets, which can be substantial in some places.

[AndreaColombo]

Or to buff more party members without having to cram them in an itty-bitty living space that leaves them more vulnerable to AoE attacks.

[InsaneCommander]

-5 PL is a lot. Well, good to know. With the precise value in mind, we can choose when to use the expanded area or the increased PL.

[Purudaya]

-5 PL is a lot. Well, good to know. With the precise value in mind, we can choose when to use the expanded area or the increased PL.

I'd rather they do +2/-4, but it's still a useful ability for making friendly fire AoEs smaller alone. I was really surprised how often it enabled me to use a spell where I would've otherwise refrained due to poor positioning.

[Dr. Hieronymous Alloy]

With such restrictions, I suppose Cipher should get this passive as well. It is pretty much a useful versatility tool where you can choose between bigger/longer effect or possibility to affect more targets losing a significant amount of power/duration (~20-25%).

 

Ciphers can't have nice things!

[Wizard1200]

 

Just to clarify; Making the AoE larger with spell shaping reduces the power level of the spell by 5, not by 1.

 

Making the AoE smaller increases the power level by 1.

 

 

As Purudaya already suggested the power level should be increased by 2 if you reduce the radius and decreased by 4 if you increase the radius to make spell shaping interesting.

[Volsalex]

I made several tests with Spell Shaping and found several features and a minor bug I'd like to share. I will also add some already posted info to sum it all up in a single post for people who still don't have access to the passive but want to know some details about it.

I tested Wizard spells only, but I suppose the option is similar for all classes.

 

Spell Shaping:

- Is a passive ability available at Power Level 4 for Chanter, Wizard, Druid and Priest classes.

- Affects most targeted circular/cone AoEs. Doesn't affect "wave" spells and AoEs that are cast around the caster.

- Provides three states for the spells it affects: general AoE, smaller AoE, larger AoE, they can be switched via zoom buttons.

- Larger version increases area of effect by ~30-40% and reduces PL of the spell by 5, bonus area is "foe only" (only the second targeting circle is increased)

- Smaller version reduces area by ~40-50% and increases PL of spell by 1, also removes safe zone from Intellect and makes the area "friend-or-foe only" (except "foe-only" spells) 

 

Bug: for some DoT spells, PL change is not indicated in the description of its damage/duration (tested on Concelhaut's Corrosive Siphon, description of its damage/duration was the same for all three states).

 

I support the idea of smaller version adding 2 PL to the spell instead of 1 as the large area penalty and safe zone loss is quite a big tradeoff for only 1 PL. Such a change could also make smaller version much more flexible as it could be used not only to land more powerful or carefully targeted hits against tight/mixed packs, but also to slightly increase the spell's Penetration to match bigger Armor Rating of enemies at the cost of hitting less targets. 

 

I also support the idea of larger version penalty getting reduced to 4 PL because of the Penetration reason as well. -5 PL loss removes 1.25 points of Penetration which would often lead to actually losing two points of Penetration and suffering additional damage reduction, while 4 PL is a steady loss of only 1 point of Penetration, while still being a big reduction to the spell's damage/duration.

Edited October 26, 2018 by Volsalex

[InsaneCommander]

Thanks for sharing your observations, Volsalex.

 

Edit: And yes, making it a 2 PL increase and -4 decrease is a good idea.

Edited October 26, 2018 by InsaneCommander

[Hoo]

Thanks for sharing your observations, Volsalex.

 

Edit: And yes, making it a 2 PL increase and -4 decrease is a good idea.

I agree with this. The current penalty, -5 PL, seems too heavy. Remember that most of passive abilities simply give advantage(s) and require a 1 skill point to obtain it; Spell Shaping ability is NOT free, so this must provide obvious merit instead of zero-sum trade off imo.

[AndreaColombo]

Agreed -5 is a tad harsh.