Captain Shrek

Calling for a thread close now. I think points have been made and the utility has ended.

I am totally averse to 2D artform but I still find serpents great because of its mechanics and settings. The art is crap as far as my tastes go. I dislike bit graphics.

Did you really use that gif outside of the codex? But on a positive note, serpent is really looking amazing. I am surprised with the small amount of money they asked for in the kickstarter they came up with such an original game. I await the combat beta.

All classes in PoE were intended to be designed for combat. That goal has failed. Priest for example is a distinctly inferior damage dealer, ironically relegated back to a "healing battery" role.

I don't care about IE games 6 second rounds. The comparison is pretty much moot at this point in time. It was a bad system for IE games which should really have been TB. But that ship has long sailed. So concentration on the problem at hand, PoE is an ACTION GAME. It should use mechanics that suit it better than using stuff that was a hack in the first place. Best solution: go for action based animation time. Actions that are hard to pull off should take more time and give more benefit, i.e. spell casting. While actions that are easy to pull off should have smaller animation time, i.e. most fighter/rogue attacks. Incidentally this also solves the problem with per-encounter stupidity associated with knowckdowns. If those actions are very rewarding but available infinitely many times, just making them slow would be not only realistic (in the sense you have to prepare for it, execution is fast) but also tactical.

I think it is not fine. It feels very artificial and does not have any reason to exist beyond disallowing Kiting. It is a very lazy band-aid for a real issue. The kiting problem ought to be addressed with AI, by allowing AI to act against it or kite itself frustrating the player tactically instead of with a passive mechanics. May be adding maluses on shooting while running will help if anyone is listening! Would then make sense to have a "shot on the run" talent.

Indeed. But no one knew that until now. No need to be butthurt.

Just a general assessment from BBs. What would happen of the Recovery time (also known as global cooldown in some circles) were completely eliminated? Instead replaced with animation time for different actions being different? Opinions?

Ok. The game has been delayed to 2015 early. May be this justifies the critics in this thread somewhat. The game * Would * have been rushed if it were released in december.

As much as I dislike the mechanics of this game, I would still think that it is indecent to pick through the accounting of the OE business. That is none of our affair and should not be a part of the discussion here.

I think the money should remain with PoE. It is being made for people with Asperger's anyway, right? What more charitable way to donate it?

IMPLYING THE STEALTH MECHANICS MAKES SENSE IN THE FIRST PLACE!

hmm. I perosnally do not find it interesting. I see it as a hacked D&D mechanics which fails to address the severe aspects of core SRD gameplay, like HP bloats and ridiculous static mitigations. Added to that I see only pointless (for me) things such as stamina or universal cooldowns. I can't really relate to that. Everyone to their own devices I guess.

I will give you a reason: Might affects healing because Healing was a stat the designers wanted to put into the game. These "derived" stats came before the main attributes. And when they realized they could put healing anywhere "lmeaningful" they tied it to Might. That's the best I can do.

So why does might affect healing?

Why is it a good thing? These games are called role playing for a reason. When the class wizard is practically defined by D&D as a group of people who study hard to gain knowledge of magic, why would they **** on their own logic? And funnily enough, it makes a certain kind of abstracted sense that is written into the game world. Intelligence is not some strictly defined trait in D&D. It encompasses a lot of aspects built around the general idea of memorization and correlation. EDIT: And concerning 2.e yeah, it was not the best of gaming designs out there. Which is why most of us play 3.5 / Pathfinder. 3.5 practically did what I was saying to the attribute system: They rescued it with content. Which is the right way of dealing with things. Cutting / merging content is what is practiced by Bathesda.

Well to be fair to D&D P&P every stat is useful as long as you have the right book to use it. A high int bard could potentially take the right feats locked by Int and become formidable warrior (as expertises are attached to it). Same for fighters, clerics and Paladins. With enough feats I wcould show that all stats provided means to NOT ONLY roleplay but also advantages in combat. That is the crux of the matter isn't it? PoE is trying to accomplish all of that with just the Core Attribute bonuses, all the while it should focusing on giving you content in the form of Talents bound to attributes and the proper content in game which uses those talents. The entire attribute balancing fiasco is also taking the game away from sensble storytelling into a purely excel sheet simulator. It is indeed wrong to accuse D&D like systems for dump stats. There were none. There were min maxers and there was nothing wrong with that either.

I personally think that NWN2 did an a-mazing job at UI for both character creation and spell casting. It seems they dropped the latter for PoE. What a shame...

Isn't DAI a RTwP game? Also, it has "better" graphics, engine and an "open world (read skyrim magic)". Not to mention it has "romances". The only advantage PoE has is probably better writing.

This is a great idea. Transperency is always good in character creation. So when re you taking that new job over Sensuki?

I'm pretty sure that making a high -int dump everything class in DnD except wizard makes an absolute useless Char. In the modern DnD's (4e more then 5e) if you don't pick the attributes designed and stated in the manual that your class needs, you can pretty much kiss your class features good bye. Sure, you get some skill points you might not have been able to use before, but you'd be absolutely neglecting the reason for picking the class in the first place. I've seen people do this, and they spend months not hitting anything and being pretty much useless, even in a pen-and-paper sense. It's pretty painful, they participate in Role-play and then zone-out in combat. In a game... there's no role-play (there's narrative) and a dead-end character like that is IMHO, it is something it's really important to avoid. Also, If obsidian can be successful, by making attributes provide different , but successful game play avenues for all characters, the re-play value of the game benefits immensely. I think it looks like they'll succeed, along with help of beta testers who buy into this idea. I don't even think the narrative will suffer. I would like to remind you that the same will happen in POE. Just try and make a high int dump everything else in PoE and report back.

I just want to remind everyone that even in D&D which I presume what Josh is targetting in his post as the evul system with dumbp stats, no stat was actually useless to all chars. Clerics could have points in Dex and still reap benefits that came from them. Josh is just reinventing the wheel and calling is Turbo charged bike roller.

Also, I doubt if the HP bloat is making game easier. Have you ever lost full stamina Sensuki? Are those values looking right?

Matt, that is why I asked what some general DT values are like. If they are ~ equal to damage you can gain from Might benefits, you would see only a little effect of might bonuses. But assuming that DT is smaller than the damage you can gain from Might, then yes, you are right: Your total damage will be larger over time with Might high.

Matt I think the DT will really eliminate the small damage bonus from might. Can you tell me what some average DT values are like? If they are comprable to usual damage values then they will wipe out the benefits of small bonuses to damage from might. Also, if you read my explanation correctly, I clearly explained that the PER bonuses are relevent only close to Def/Att ratio of 1. The farther you get from that the smaller is the effect. Then may be item + talent benefits to Acc dominate. But I can not definitely side with you that Might is all that useful. I would personally keep is jsut enought to overcome DT and the rest I will pump into ACC bonuses whereever I can get them.