Grinch

You did have to learn scripting but it wasn't that hard. Somebody actually created a program that allowed non-scripters to write scripts. I used it all the time. After awhile I learned the scripting language and just plain scripted without the program. You could get as detailed as you wanted with the scripting too. DAO's options are better for sure. Once you understand those options you can get your whole party to do basically anything you want. The same could be said for NWN2. It also had a programmable AI for NPC party members. I'm using it right now to play the IWD campaign mod. No problems at all. I can even tell my magic users and healers what scale of spell casting to use so that spells aren't wasted on lower level mobs. I get a kick out of setting it all up and just watching what my party does with my commands. To me it's not having the game play itself since I actually setup the commands. I would love to see something like that implemented for this game. Either that or a turn based system like ToEE or Divinity OS.

True the default scripts were crappy but you could write your own scripts or download some pretty good scripts. Scripts was a feature of BG too. It wasn't added on to a subsequent game as development of the IE engine progressed. Sometimes there's just too much going on to control 1 character and 5 npcs. A turned based system such as in ToEE or Divinity OS would be a good alternative too. I disagree about there not being any tanks in this game too. If a fighter isn't a tank then what is he. His sole purpose is to be on the front line absorbing punishment so that the back line archers and mages can do damage. I don't think it's a problem of the game not having tanks. I think it's more a problem of fighters not having the tank-like abilities that we're used to from other games. Knockdown is one example. Power attack and parry other examples. In every RPG I've ever played each class played a specific role. That seems to be missing here. You could load up a fighter with the mechanics skill and never take a rogue. You can load up your whole party with the sneak skill to avoid combat. At times it seems like this game struggles trying to be both a game with classes and a game where classes don't matter.

You haven't been to Australia have you? People do this to me all the time. Happens in Austria too. Just today I happened to have such a lovely conversation on the street. Not directed at me, but about a common experience we shared. Choice words were used. Never said it doesn't ever happen. I said it doesn't make sense and normal people don't act that way. It's a pretty good way to get punched in the mouth or even worse.

Not sure turn based would help pathfinding but it might actually help the AI. If all combatants have to make an initiative check those with higher initiative are going to go first. If works quite well in BG2 by turning of NPC AI and pausing after every combat round. Works well in ToEE and NWN2 too. Turns are taken depending on initiative so a high initiative wizard is going to get a fireball off before anything can get out of the way or take it's turn. Seems a lot more tactical compared to real time too.

The thought of taking BG2's encounters and putting them in a turn based game without concurrent combat rounds (which IE games basically are) is frightening. Enemy mage group just won the initiative roll? Yeah sorry, eat two or three Horrid Wiltings, not to mention the thought of Kangaxx winning initiative. Now that would be glorious. You can do just that. BG2 can be played in a turn based style by pausing after every round. To me it makes it a more tactical game as having good initiative really means something then. NWN2 lets you do the same thing. It's a lot of pausing but you can turn of the AI and control every character that way. I think turn based in PoE would be a great way to play. Out of curiosity, how long is a combat round in PoE? The reason I'm asking is because I thought about setting the combat timer to pause after every combat round. It would make it more turn based and since the NPCs don't have any AI they would be easier to control.

Hmm nice ad hominem there dude. Maybe they are not fanboys but are just pointing out that it's not bad design just because you suck at the game? Or maybe Zherot has a point. I think it's bad design too. Even BG gave you the opportunity to write and use scripts. This is supposed to be the 'spiritual successor' to the IE games and it doesn't even have all the features the IE games had. Seems like a step backwards to me.

Profanity fits fine. It is consistent with style that they use in other conversations around the game. I don't see how it don't fit in game's setting. If you're playing the game for the first time, how would you know what that style is? I've got no problem with profanity in the game. Just with the way it's used. At least let it make some sense. Complete strangers don't walk up to each other, start talking then all of a sudden start swearing. That's poor writing. It's also poor writing that the whole option isn't expanded on. Aloth claims a misunderstanding, you choose that option for your character and then the whole conversation dies. Nothing more is said about it. Then it's back to normal conversation and either having Aloth join up with you or going your separate ways. When your character doesn't swear at all before that situation and swears very little after it then that one conversation is out of place. You can't roleplay a character who constantly swears if he isn't constantly swearing. If you play game first time then in that point of time you can't anyway judge if it fits in the game, so it doesn't matter. Way it is used is fitting because it just crude alternative of insult that was used by Aloth second personality which your character don't know existing in that point of time. It isn't outburst that comes from nowhere, it is phrase that is used by your character to emphasis the point that Aloth insulted that man. Conversation dies because Aloth don't want talk about it more and tiers conversation to elsewhere and your character don't care enough to continue. This is because there is limits on how much conversation options developers can offer for the player. As I said previously it is just flavor option that gives you to play more crude character. Fact that your ability show similar crudeness in other conversations is limited is not fault of this option but how those other conversations are written. Although I would argue that you can play quite crude character that uses profanities where they fit in sentences without using them as additional emphasis, like "this ****ing game don't ****ing offer ****ing conversation options that I **** want ****!!!", but they are instead used in places where they naturally fit if you want to be crude but not use profanities as only to make your sentences sound more aggressive, like that "You did tell that one man to go **** his sister.", where profanity is where it should be if it is used as verb in this case. To make this sentence to use said profanity in way as it is used in modern language in those "locker room conversations" it would look more like "You ****ing told that ****ing man to, ****, to go **** his ****ing sister ****ing ****." And if they would had offered such option I would agree that it probably would not fit in the game. You don't have to play the whole game to know if a profane dialogue option fits. Aloth was the one being crude. Not your character. The option doesn't fit because there's no swearing up to that point by your character. It's a pretty normal conversation between Aloth and the character. Then out of the blue your character has the option to respond with a profane remark. How do you roleplay a crude, swearing character who only swears once? It's poor writing. It gets even worse because that particular option leads to a dead end conversation. Aloth doesn't explain the misunderstanding or his desire not discuss it any further. It's a dead end. You proved my point by saying the lack of crudeness in other conversations is a result of how they're written. It shows that the crude option is out place and doesn't fit. As I said it's poor writing. If you're going to give players the ability to roleplay a character who is crude and swears then you have to give players an option to do it more than once. The way it is now, it's looks like it's a juvenile attempt just to put profanity into the game. I'll also repeat what I said earlier. Nobody walks up to or helps a complete stranger and just starts using profanity. With friends, family and co-workers it's possible but not strangers. If you do that with strangers people tend to look upon you as a person with a mental problem or it may even get you punched in the mouth. Even people who use profanity on a regular basis pretty much know when it's acceptable and when it isn't. Thanks for helping me prove my point.

Profanity fits fine. It is consistent with style that they use in other conversations around the game. I don't see how it don't fit in game's setting. If you're playing the game for the first time, how would you know what that style is? I've got no problem with profanity in the game. Just with the way it's used. At least let it make some sense. Complete strangers don't walk up to each other, start talking then all of a sudden start swearing. That's poor writing. It's also poor writing that the whole option isn't expanded on. Aloth claims a misunderstanding, you choose that option for your character and then the whole conversation dies. Nothing more is said about it. Then it's back to normal conversation and either having Aloth join up with you or going your separate ways. When your character doesn't swear at all before that situation and swears very little after it then that one conversation is out of place. You can't roleplay a character who constantly swears if he isn't constantly swearing.

And nevermind that they either just fought together or the player character just saved Aloth's hinparts by talking the brawlers out of a fight. Strawman after strawman after strawman. If you just said, you don't like swearing in games, fine. One doesn't have to like everything. But as I said, this is getting ridiculous. Doesn't matter if they just fought together or the character saved Aloth. Do you always start swearing when you help a complete stranger? It's not strawman after strawman. It's poor writing. It has nothing to do with me liking swearing. It has to do with whether or not it fits in the context of the situation and conversation. It doesn't fit. The whole conversation option is a dead end too. It's not expanded on. At first I didn't like this game but after a 4th attempt at playing, I've grown to like it. That doesn't mean that I'm going to praise everything about it. I think some of the writing is poor and this is just one example. A normal person wouldn't say what your character has the option of saying. Maybe to a friend but not to a complete stranger. You can claim this is ridiculous all you want. But you keep responding. Why? I'm not one who is against profanity in games, books or movies. But the situation and dialogue has to make sense. To me it doesn't make sense for your character to say something like that to a complete stranger. Maybe in your part of the world they do that. Not where I live though. Profanity is sometimes used to show anger or in a joking manner with family, friends or co-workers. It's not something used when talking to complete strangers. Think that's ridiculous? Then don't respond.

As has been said repeatedly. You don't have to use it either. It's up to you to choose a different option. From my perspective, it makes sense for certain characters and I did use it. Does it make any more sense for the player character to provoke the fight or say that it was actually fun to get rid of the villagers? These are options too, and fitting options for certain characters. That's not an elementary school play, but a roll playing game where you can evolve the character of your player and get the traits to show for your efforts. The point is the opition doesn't need to be there. How many times do you want up to a complete stranger and start swearing? It don't "need" to be there but that don't mean that it isn't good option to be there. As most conversation options that you can select through the game are there just for the flavor, meaning that most conversation options in the game aren't "needed", but removing them would remove lot of players ability to play character that they want to play. And I know lots of people that start to talk to strangers and friends using swear words, because it is habit that they have developed in their social circles. Tell me something. How does swearing in that situation enhance the roleplaying of your character? The option doesn't fit. Up until that point your character doesn't swear at all. He could have swore at Calisca or Heodan or the tribesmen who killed all the travelers. But he/she didn't. So how does one option allow you to roleplay a swearing character. They don't go to the inn swearing, telling the innkeeper to give them a 'f***ing' room. They doesn't swear when dealing with the miller and the villager dispute. They doesn't swear in the temple ruins. That's all just in Gilded Vale in the first part of the game. So except for that one option there isn't a lot of opportunity for your character to swear at all. As for people talking to strangers and swearing, I know if somebody came up to me swearing I'd probably punch them in the mouth. Swearing around friends, co- workers or in locker room is different. It's people you're familiar with and around on a daily basis. You wouldn't help a complete stranger fix a flat tire then say 'There you go. I fixed your f***ing tire'. You would say something like 'There you go. I fixed your tire'. The point is the swearing doesn't fit and the conversation option is a dead end. It's not expanded on. It's poor writing.

For you it doesn't. Period. We have said again and again, that it depends on the character you're playing. If you can only imagine a noble character, who blushes when hearing swear words, then you probably don't roll a slave, a laborer or a mercenary either. Sorry, this is getting ridiculous. I can't imagine anyone, who hasn't called a total strange ****. Not even in road rage. Walking up to somebody you don't know, carrying a conversation with them and then all of sudden starting to swear just doesn't make sense. Nobody does that unless they're looking for a fight or they have a mental problem. The dialogue option makes no sense at all. if you use that option and then tell Aloth that you heard the same thing when he claims a misunderstanding, the conversation dies. Instead of being expanded on it goes nowhere. Why doesn't Aloth explain why it was a misunderstanding? Or why he would say something like that? Why would your character walk up to a complete stranger and start using profanity when there are other ways to say the same thing. It has nothing to do with roleplaying a character who swears. Your character goes from swearing right back to a decent conversation with Aloth and the decision to either join up or go their own separate ways. Your character goes to the inn and talks with the innkeeper. No swearing there. He doesn't say 'Give me a f***ing room'. It doesn't fit. I agree it is getting ridiculous trying to convince people who are too blind to see what I'm talking about.

As has been said repeatedly. You don't have to use it either. It's up to you to choose a different option. From my perspective, it makes sense for certain characters and I did use it. Does it make any more sense for the player character to provoke the fight or say that it was actually fun to get rid of the villagers? These are options too, and fitting options for certain characters. That's not an elementary school play, but a roll playing game where you can evolve the character of your player and get the traits to show for your efforts. The point is the opition doesn't need to be there. How many times do you want up to a complete stranger and start swearing? I got no problem with profanity being in the game. I'm saying that it doesn't make sense with the way it's used. The official at the Hanging Tree is all business then all of a sudden responds with a comment about 'digging for sh*t'. Your character walks up on a complete stranger (Aloth) arguing with villagers. After the villagers are chased off or killed one of the dialogue options is to tell Aloth that he did tell a villager to 'go f*ck his sister'. Aloth claims a misunderstanding, your character states he heard the same thing and the whole issue is dropped. It was pointless. It was as if that option was written to sqeeze the F-word into the dialogue. It didn't fit. And you character and Aloth don't know each other. People just don't walk up to strangers and start swearing. It doesn't make sense.

a) No, "your" character didn't. He had the *option* to do it, if you, the player, found it in-character for him. If your character did swear in that situation, it is nobody's but your own fault. Yours alone, because you chose that dialogue option. Don't complain about your own decisions. If you didn't choose that option, then no one in that scene used swear words (apart from Iselmyr, of course). Why complaining? b) You did notice that the game's language is usually contemporary American English? They use certain terms from the invented languages for things that don't exactly correspond to English words - a Vailian duc is not the same as an English duke, and a fampyr is not Robert Pattinson. The action of having sexual intercourse with your closer relatives, however, is a concept that is well-known to English-speakers (in theory, one hopes), and basically the same on both Eora and Earth. There is no need for using foreign languages. c) We get it, you don't like swear words. It doesn't matter about the stinking options. What part of that don't you get? The problem I have is that the profanity doesn't fit. It has nothing to do with me liking swear words. I've heard them and I've used them. I play games that has profanity in them. It has to do with the fact that it doesn't fit. They changed some of the language in the game to give it more of a fantasy type feel but then used contemporary profanity. Why? Because all the adolescent kids playing wouldn't know what the 'swear' words were if they changed them. Then the way they used them in conversation doesn't make sense. The official at Hanging Tree is one example. He's all business and then all of sudden when your character asks for help makes a comment about 'digging for sh*t'. How many times have you been to the DMV and had the clerk taking your picture say something like 'Good morning. Look at the camera. Now don't you f*cking move'. It doesn't happen. Then take the whole Aloth thing. It would be like coming up on a complete stranger who's car is broke down. You help them fix it and then say 'There you go. I got you f*cking car fixed'. People just don't do that. It may only be a game option but it doesn't fit. You character doesn't swear anytime before that. How many times do you come upon a complete stranger and just start swearing? I know somebody will claim they do it but it's a good way to get punched in the mouth. The point is that it doesn't fit. Having profanity in those instances doesn't make any sense. It doesn't add to the gameplay, immersion or roleplaying of your character. It's just there.

You did play the game, right? So does the name Iselmyr ring any bells? Yeah. So? That explains Aloth insulting the villagers. It doesn't explain the whole conversation being dropped when your character tells Aloth he heard the same thing the villagers did. It doesn't explain the need for profanity in the conversation. Aloth didn't use it. Your character did. Why would your character walk up to somebody they don't know and start using it. I can see your character helping Aloth out of trouble with the villagers. People help strangers all the time. But most people I know don't walk up to strangers and just start swearing. Not unless they have a mental problem. That's what doesn't make sense to me. That and the fact that they went out of their way to change parts of the language but used contemporary profanity that you can hear on a street corner or a locker room. It's nice to know that f*** still means f*** and s*** still means s*** though. Heaven forbid those words might change in another language in a fantasy setting.

I understand they created a language. That's my point. They went through all the trouble to create a language but used contemporary profanity that can be heard on any street corner or locker room. I'm not against profanity in games when it makes sense but to me it doesn't make any sense the way it's used in this game. It's as if it was added just for the sake of adding it. DA:I has the same problem. One other thing I'd like to point out is that good games don't need it. It doesn't make them any more mature, hard core or immersive.I can't think of one older cRPG that had profanity in it. I'm sure somebody will prove me wrong but I don't believe any of the IE games had it. Arcanum didn't. I don't recall DA:O, Mass Effect or the NWN series having it either. Some of the mods for NWN did but not the game itself. It's only with the modern cRPGs. Developers, writers or whoever is making these modern games need to grow up and put their resources towards other aspects of the game instead of trying to be clever. The way they're doing it, it just makes them look juvenile pretty much the way those romance scenes in modern Bioware games do.

Hmm, let's see. A drunken brawl? I definitely wouldn't expect polite tea party conversation. Can't speak for DA:I though. I haven't played it, nor will I ever play it. I don't believe Aloth was drunk. Just the villagers and yet they said nothing profane at all. The first time I played through, I thought Aloth had some type of split personality or something. One minute he was talking peace and misunderstandings. The next he was insulting the villagers and their families. He also didn't directly say 'Go f*** your sister' which is what your character is supposed to claim to hear him say. There's a reference made but nothing said literally. That's what I mean about the profanity not fitting. Then it wasn't expanded on. Aloth claimed they misunderstood but when your character says he heard the same thing the conversation ends. It's a dead end. It makes it seems as if the profanity was just added for the sake of adding it.

Totally fitting in my book. No offense, but your alternative for Aloth is what I would find ridiculous. Yselmir didn't put it politely, so why should my character? And what's more, you don't have to say it. You just have to give it a rest with one of the other options. How is it fitting? And how is the alternative ridiculous? Because in that option your character points out that Aloth clearly insulted that man and not try anyway beat around the bush with that fact like your alternative does. There is such alternative option in that conversation as you can instead to choose to say "You did make a rather lewd suggestion regarding one of the aggressors and his own sister." , which makes your alternative needles and even poorer option than one that is offered. The point I'm trying to make is that it doesn't have to be there in the first place. It adds absolutely nothing to the game. What's the point? It doesn't make the game any more immersive. It's not like somebody's saying 'Holy s***, a dragon!'. It's adding profanity just for the sake of adding it. They went to all the trouble of changing names like duke to duc, vampire to fampyr etc. Then they used profanity that you could hear on a street corner or locker room. It's poor writing. The game isn't any more mature or hard core because of it. As a matter of fact it makes it seems more juvenile. As I said in my other post, I don't mind profanity when it fits. But it seems out of place. A GTA game or military shooter wouldn't be the same without the profanity. In other words there's a time and place for it. It's not just this game either. DA:I has the same problem. The Blackwall recruitment sequence is fine then all of sudden out of nowhere BAM!. There was no need for it. It didn't make the scene or story any better. Same can be said of Aloth and the Hanging Tree. The story isn't any better because of it. That's what I mean about poor writing. The conversation just dies when your character tells Aloth that they heard the same thing the villagers did. It wasn't expanded on. Aloth claimed a misunderstanding. Your character claims to have heard the same thing. But the conversation went nowhere after that. At least give a reason why Aloth claims a misunderstanding. The way it was written it makes it look like the whole thing was done just to put the word f*** into dialogue somehow.

Totally fitting in my book. No offense, but your alternative for Aloth is what I would find ridiculous. Yselmir didn't put it politely, so why should my character? And what's more, you don't have to say it. You just have to give it a rest with one of the other options. How is it fitting? And how is the alternative ridiculous? Not everybody goes around throwing out profanities in every conversation. Suppose your character was a priest. Maybe a fighter or rogue would say something like that. Not many priests would. Once you know the game by playing it through you can skip the options with profanity. But with a first play through you can't because you don't know and odds are you may hit an option that has it. The point is it's not needed. It doesn't add a single thing to gameplay or immersion. This really may surprise you but not everybody goes around just waiting for a moment to use profanity. Some people never use it. You claim the Aloth situation is totally fitting. How so? First off Alotth didn't literally say 'go f*** your sister'. He made reference to that but didn't say it. So why does the character have to respond by saying it? It doesn't make any sense. It adds absolutely nothing to the game. Are you telling me that you got more immersed in the game because the words f*** and s*** are in it? It's childish, adolescent crap. It doesn't make the game any more hardcore or mature. There are times and places where profanity fits in. The examples I gave were neither the time or places for it. To me it's a sign of poor writing and an attempt to draw in the 12 year old crowd who gets tickled everytime they see or say 'bad' words. As I said, I've read 100's of fantasy novels without profanity and some with it. Those with it didn't try to force it into the story just for the sake of having it in. Profanity fit in those stories just as it does in some games. It's hard to imagine a GTA game without some profanity in it. It just doesn't fit here.

It may be true that you have to choose certain dialogue options to see it. My point is that it's not needed. It doesn't fit. At the tree you have a dignitary who interviews newcomers. All business until the character asks about getting help for feeling strange. Then the dignitary goes on about corpse stink and digging for sh**. It could have been worded differently. The way it was worded added nothing to the conversation at all. Then take Aloth's situation at the inn with one of the drunks. The dialogue could have read 'you told him to go sleep with his sister' instead it was 'you told him to go f*** his sister' which added nothing to the conversation. It was pointless. Seeing profanity in a military shooter or a game like GTA is one thing. You expect to see it there. To see it in a fantasy type setting, for me at least, it needs to make sense. The way profanity is used in this game doesn't make a whole lot of sense or add anything in the way of immersion or story. Like I said it's as if 12 year old wrote the story. I can just see them snickering and laughing believing themselves to be really clever because of the 'swear' words they wrote into the game It's not only this game either. DA:I has certain situations where it doesn't make sense either. Recruiting Blackwall, talking about Grey Wardens and darkspawn for instance. When Blackwell decides to join the Inquistion and is asked what one Grey Warden can do, his answer is 'Save the f****** world'. No profanity from Blackwall before that or after. To me that's not clever writing. It's stupid because there's no point to it. I've read 100's of fantasy novels with no profanity in them at all. I've also read some fantasy novels that were laced with profanity but it fit and made sense with the story the author was trying to tell. I think some game developers are adding profanity just for the sake of doing it. In the two examples I listed PoE and DA:I use it where it's not needed and it seems out of place. It takes away from game immersion the way they use it.

The thing that bothers me with the language is that it immerses you with fantasy name changes but then at times uses locker room profanity. DA:I does the same thing. It's almost as if the writers were 12 year olds trying to see how many curse words they could get away with. Don't know about anybody else but I lose immersion when it's like that. I don't mind profanity in games but have a reason for the profanity. The Hanging Tree dialogue between you and the dignitary ends up with what I believe is profanity for no reason. All the way through the conversation the dignitary acts in a proper manner then all of a sudden blurts out a profanity in the course of the conversation. To me it didn't make any sense. Aloth's confrontation in front of the inn is the same way. No doubt Aloth insulted the villagers but it didn't come close to what you are supposed to have heard him say which was a profanity. My point is it didn't have to be there. It was clear Aloth was throwing insults. It's as if profanity was thrown in just for the sake of doing it. It's supposed to be a fantasy setting not a locker room

I disagree about rangers. I'm not that far into the game and my ranger is only level 3 but he seems to be doing just fine with a war bow. I took the bear as a pet and it doesn't seem mediocre at all. He can hold agro enough for my ranger to hit with the bow and the other NPC's to get involved. I usually send the pet in first to buy time. It's very rare that he loses a lot of health or endurance. Like I said though I'm early into the game. Just picked up Durance. So things are subject to change further in. I agree with you about AI scripts. It's the one thing I really miss from the IE games. I don't really like the idea of having to babysit my whole party to get them to use spells or special abilities. Slow combat helps but I would much rather have scripts so that I only have to control my main character. Seems like PoE took a step backward compared to IE games in this case. If they ever came out with a turned based, action point mode that would eliminate the need for scripts but with the real-time nature of this game you either have to babysit your party by constantly pausing or just use standard attacks and forget about special abilities/spells.

I don't know if you can really credit or blame Sawyer for NWN2. He was the design lead. But Chris Avellone was the creative director. Wouldn't that mean that all design decisions would have to be approved by Avellone? Which position holds more power? If it was Avellone's then you would have to say he had the bigger hand in how NWN2 turned out.

And yet Sawyer says in regards to crpg rule sets: pretty much all games get it wrong IMO. And there was a lot of feedback from players in the beta which was ignored because of ~feels~. Sounds like Sawyer may be the one who's wrong and not everybody else.

Is there AI on Easy but not on Normal? I don't understand. All I want to do is not have to babysit the NPC's and be able to count on them to use their abilities. Like I said, I could use scripts in the IE games and even make custom AI scripts. Why don't the NPC's have any AI? Is there a specific reason?

This is really the problem with all modern CRPGs. People tend to talk with ignorant contempt about AD&D but that was RPG for decades and decades; all developed by the gamers themselves for years andn years. Every single detail of AD&D was there for a reason. The job of Black Isle wasn`t to reinvent the wheel but to move the 30 year RPG tradition AD&D represented over to a new medium, period. But at the same time the development of RPGs was taken away from the gamers themselves and put in the hands of more or less clueless devs who all later decided to reinvent the wheel because they had forgotten what their job was. And we have no way of complaining and, because of CRPGs replacing our traditional RPGs, very few alternatives. It is impossible for a development team to make a new system that is even close to being as good as AD&D was. It can`t be done. So why do they keep trying? I think part of the problem is they all want to create a 'blockbluster' type hit and become 'rockstar' famous. They would be much better off just targeting a possibly somewhat smaller but specific audience (AD&D, D&D crowd) than to target a general audience. I also think a lot of it has to do with ego. They think they can create something better than the system that 's been around and established for almost 40 years. Like you said, they don' t need to reinvent the wheel.