SilverSun

He had to make Luke give into his anger,make him mad and unleash on him. But the key is Vader had to stay the stonger of the two to stay in control of the fight. When Luke first took his saber back from Pal and took a swing at him Vader stopped him because he had not given fully into his anger and it still needed to be pulled out him. The book explains that Vader stopped him because there was still a chance that he could kill Pal and return to his friends. Luke needed to be beaten by Vader so Luke understood that Vader was the one in charge. Sort of how Malak turned Bas in Knights. He didn't kill her,he made her feel her anger to the point it over took her all the while staying in control of her. Vader knew pushing Luke with Leia would set him off,his mistake came in when he under estimated just how hard Luke would come off at him. Had Vader been able to stay in control the situation might have been different. Remember in the Zahn book Last Command the dream Mara has of Luke and Vader's fight? She see's Luke and Vader fighting and then turn on and kill Pal. IF Vader had stayed in control,had stayed the stonger of the two then that scene might have been what actually came to pass.

Full out no,but he didn't hold back like he did in Empire. He really pulled his punches in the Cloud City fight. And that doesn't change that he where he wanted Luke to fall he still needed to be the stonger of the two,needed to win. His whole plan through the end of Empire and ROTJ was to have his son at his side and have the two of them rule. He wanted to be the Master,he was tired of being the one under thumb. He wasn't trying to kill Luke but he still needed to beat him in order for his plan to work. Letting Luke knock him around was not part of his plan. As I said before I'm not saying Luke was the stronger of the two as a whole. Vader just hit the wrong button at the wrong time and it caused Luke to snap for a moment-Just long enough to beat his father. But it was still never part of Vader's plan to get beat down the way he did. It doesn't fit with staying the stonger of the two and staying the Master. Which is what he truly wanted.

If vader were maimed it was a really good deal if he got or almost got luke. What does it matter to vader if he re-loses a body part It's not the loss of the body part,it's the loss of the fight. Vader did not want to lose the fight he did not want to die. He wanted to rule the galaxy with Luke and without Pal. He wanted to be the master with his son at his side. Didn't the ROTJ book make a comment about Vader feeling embarrased by his son after the first shot he got in and that is when Vader started in on Luke without holding back? And another scene in the book as Pal is shocking Luke about Vader crawling back to Pal like beaten dog to his Master? Vader wanted Luke to fall to the dark side be he not only wanted to be the stronger he needed to be for his plan to work.

He can "die" in battle. He just "wakes up" if there's still a character that is up in battle. Takes a certain amount of time I'm pretty sure. But if he's the last person up and he goes down then it's game over. Not to mention he only starts with a few VP so it might not always be a life saver.

*Hands Shin some Force Absorb* Don't use it all at once,it costs a lot.

The ROTJ book doesn't use the term "Force Choke" but it does say he uses the Force to choke them I'm pretty sure.

Well you have more brains then pride then. Something the character did not.

I hate Maul's death scene. It make no sense what-so-ever. This dedicated, vigiliant Sith suddenly decides that he doesn't need to pay attention or attempt to defend himself, and also decides not to attack Obi-Wan as he flips through the air. Maul was far too caught up in his own power and ability. Pride is the biggest giant killer. That was part of the point behind the scene. Someone said something about not gloating after killing Qui Gon,little different situation. Qui Gon was dead but Obi-wan was still there and able to fight. When he gloated over Obi-wan there was no one else there to be a threat,except for obi-wan who he thought he had dead to rights.

Heh,and the funny thing is they weren't really being a threat to him. They were just in his way. *See today's lesson:Never push the buttons on a Skywalker.*

Can I keep him deactivated and use him as a lamp in the Hawk? Least he'd have more of use for me then he did in Knights.

As I said,kind of hard in a case such as this. The over all plot really isn't going to have too many things that should surprise people. But I'm sure if nothing else there will be little plot points that I wouldn't have thought to be there.

The over all plot is a little hard not to know if you know anything about the OT. And having been a fan since I was in diapers I'm pretty sure I can guess how things are going to go in ep3 for the most part. Which is why I'm wanting a few surprises in areas outside the main plot.

No one has said,I guess we could find out in ep3.

*LOL*Sorry...it was right there. I had to ask.

OSW-Does your eye twitch? Or do you just wink a lot?

It is used a lot in stories,in the SW world it plays an important part in showing some of the key differences between both sides and some of the problems the different sides have. One of the big ones on the Dark Side is pride,it has been the death of more then one Darth.

Also like silversun said about Vader pusing the wrong button to set Luke off. Same with Anakin when he slaughtered the Sand People(Tusken Raiders), his mother died in his arm. Today's Lesson: Do Not Push the Buttons of a Skywalker.

Ob-wan is hanging over the cliff with no way to defend himself. Maul stood there like a jackass for freaking 20 seconds looking at him. More then enough time for any Jedi with any skills to find away out of the situation. Had maul simply attacked he could have cut Obi-wan down to size and/or knocked him down the shaft. Instead his pride and struting ended up having him be the one cut in two and sent down the shaft. Maul had the the fight won and over with,he beat himself. Again that's how it goes sometimes. People get far to caught up in their own ability and it costs them. Same situaton with Pal,he had Luke down and out. But instead of killing him he played with him. Which then gave Ani time to come back and he tossed the old man over the egde to protect his son.

If he could have won the fight why not do so and end Vader's path of destruction? Why not make up for his past mistakes and strike a major blow against the Empire? He couldn't beat Vader and he knew he it. And being in once piece after a fight doesn't mean you were the better fighter or had no problems with the fight. Look at Obi-wan and maul,it wasn't Obi-wan's great skills that won that fight. Maul beat himself,which is how it goes sometimes. I'm saying Obi-wan could just mange to beat Ani,perhaps because of Ani's own doings like Maul. Which if that's how it turns out would also show support for the idea that He could not have beat Vader on the Death Star.

That's fine with me and all but if someone starts singing the "Evil" Cartman friend song...I'm gone.

Different time frames there. Obi-wan could not have won the fight against Vader on the Death Star. Obi-wan could beat Ani yes. Vader is not the same person when speaking about power. And the fight between Ani and Obi-wan is suppose to be 11 minutes or something like that. Obi-wan wins obviously but we don't know by how much.

Just a little something I'll throw out there. At the end of Empire and Jedi Vader was trying to do the same thing. Turn Luke to the darkside. The difference is when Vader beat the hell out of Luke in Empire,Luke did not have the traninging or ability to even come close to fighting his father. In Jedi Luke was much stonger then he was in Empire. Now that doesn't make him stronger then Vader but I think it shows that Vader didn't "let" Luke knock him around. He under estimated how much his son had grown in the Force between their fights. Now Vader had the advantage until he pushed the wrong button on Luke,that being Leia. That set Luke off which changed the fight. Might not have been as a whole stronger then Vader but at that individual part of the fight he was. A lot having to do with Vaders under estimation of his son. IIRC the novel ROTJ has Vader thinking something along the lines that he can't afford to hold back anymore because his son has grown in power.

I wouldn't mind them being in the game but it's a big deal IMO.

His electric tooth brush blew up on him. Sad really...

Just feel like there's going to be some kind "twist" to things. Now anyone who knows anything about SW isn't going to be surprised by the over all plot or what happens. Which leaves some side area to throw in said twist. Like I said before I had my ideas about Qui Gon but that pry won't work. So this little area is the only place I can see throwing something in.