That's one ugly boat

[PrimeJunta]

Pillars 2 is going for a cool pirate vibe. Like, Pirates of the Caribbean, but maybe a bit earlier, although with seafaring nations like the Vailians and the Rauatai I wouldn't be surprised to see more refined ship designs than 15th century European ones. 

 

And they're giving us a ship. Not just any ship. A sloop: the quintessential pirate vessel. 

 

And... it looks like this:

 

 

That's not a sloop. This is a sloop:

 

 

And yes, that's about two centuries ahead of the general Pillars tech level. Whatever. It would still have been totally possible, and hey, you said sloop, which I dig and support because PIRATES! 

 

First, the hull. It's all wrong. It's rectangular and blocky, and the aftcastle is out of proportion with the rest of it. Even cogs which were notoriously ugly (and sometimes had tall aftcastles with no or low forecastles) were more rounded than that. Even if it's made by Dyrwoodans it has to look seaworthy, like it would be able to, you know, move through water somehow.

 

This is a cog. It's an ocean-going sailing vessel of roughly the tech level/time period we're talking about. It's also notoriously ugly.

 

 

The hull looks sort of similar, but it's not rectangular: it has a fish shape, which is kind of dictated by, y'know, hydrodynamics. You'll also notice that like the Defiant, it's single-masted -- but it's square-rigged. You rigged the Defiant like a sloop, sort of, but you had to angle the boom on the gaff sail up completely ridiculously so it would clear the aftcastle, and it's not running anywhere near enough canvas to start with. That's not just wrong, it's ugly and not-cool in a very ... not-cool way. 

 

I could go on but you get the picture. Pillars 2 is looking really good overall, but you dropped the ball badly on what should be one of the coolest elements in it. Please, have whoever modelled the Defiant look at some actual ship models and do it over. If you're not actual nautical engineers, pick a historical reference and work from that. I don't care about precise use of terminology. I don't care if you want to be period-correct and go with cogs, carracks, caravels, galleons, and what have you, or want to do that pirate thing to the max and give us sloops, schooners, cutters, brigs, frigates or whatever. Either one is cool. Just... not this ugly abomination of a... thing, okay? It triggers me, I used to build scale models of these things as a kid.

 

Please?

Edited February 24, 2017 by PrimeJunta

[Leferd]

Agreed.

[Pope]

I just hope it rocks a bit in the water. Like the little barge in the gif on the main page.

In the update video the ship looks so unnatural in the sea.

[teenparty]

She was a ship of the old school, rather small if anything; with an old fashioned claw-footed look about her. Long seasoned and weather-stained in the typhoons and calms of all four oceans, her old hull's complexion was darkened like a French grenadier's, who has alike fought in Egypt and Siberia. Her venerable bows looked bearded. Her masts... stood stiffly up like the spines of the three old kings of Cologne. Her ancient decks were worn and wrinkled, like the pilgrim-worshipped flag-stone in Canterbury Cathedral where Beckett bled. But to all these her old antiquities, were added new and marvellous features, pertaining to the wild business that for more than half a century she had followed... She was apparelled like any barbaric Ethiopian emperor, his neck heavy with pendants of polished ivory. She was a thing of trophies. A cannibal of a craft, tricking herself forth in the chased bones of her enemies. All round, her unpanelled, open bulwarks were garnished like one continuous jaw, with the long sharp teeth of the sperm whale, inserted there for pins, to fasten her old hempen thews and tendons to. Those thews ran not through base blocks of land wood, but deftly travelled over sheaves of sea-ivory. Scorning a turnstile wheel at her reverend helm, she sported there a tiller; and that tiller was in one mass, curiously carved from the long narrow lower jaw of her hereditary foe...A noble craft, but somehow a most melancholy! All noble things are touched with that.

 

Bah! No fun!

[RaketenRichard]

This game is about a 300ft tall magic statue walking around. Historical accuracy my ass.

[FlintlockJazz]

Personally I have no issues with cogs, always liked them since learning about them from The Patrician game back when I was a kid, but I think a caravel would have been perfect: they are around the right time period but also looked piratey (they were kind of the first of those type of ships), very nice looking ships in fact, they are small but also very seaworthy, and are often overlooked in gaming for more known ships like sloops.

 

[bonarbill]

Notice how you're like the only person complaining about this everywhere.  I doubt anybody else cares how accurate the boat looks. 

Edited February 24, 2017 by bonarbill

[mumbogumshoe]

I totally agree the boat is ugly. Sloops are fast, this thing doesn't look fast. However the model in the op isn't a sloop either. A sloop has only 1 headsail, 2 or more and it's a cutter. Doesn't matter to me though, at least it looks good.

Edited February 24, 2017 by mumbogumshoe

[Messier-31]

This game is about a 300ft tall magic statue walking around. Historical accuracy my ass.

 

Then who built the pyramids?

 

Check mate, mate.

Edited February 24, 2017 by Messier-31

[Leferd]

Notice how you're like the only person complaining about this everywhere.  I doubt anybody else cares how accurate the boat looks.

 

As an enthusiast of Patrick O'Brian, C.S. Forester, Sid Meier, and the Age of Sail in general...I care.

[Leeuwenhart]

Somebody's a Sea Nerd apparently...

[Leferd]

Armchair sea nerd. I get seasick.

[mumbogumshoe]

Armchair sea nerd. I get seasick.

 

So did Hornblower. Didn't stop him.

[JerekKruger]

Agreed! I couldn't quite describe why I didn't like the ship (boat?) but what you describe about it being too rectagular and the aft castle being far too large for it is spot on. It just doesn't look sleek or fast as a result. I think perhaps the mistake that Obsidian made was trying to include a windowed cabin a bit like larger ships from the age of sail had, but to avoid this cabin being tardis-like in its dimensions they had to make the aft castle far too big.

[Leeuwenhart]

Fake Sloop name confirmed: The Sea Nerd

 

 

Ps: im naming my boat ingame like this as an ode to you!!!!

 

True Story x

[JerekKruger]

This game is about a 300ft tall magic statue walking around. Historical accuracy my ass.

 

Fantasy settings that explain all their incongruences away with "magic" tend to be terrible fantasy settings.

[Lord_Mord]

You are not very nice. People thought about and created this thing and all you have say is: This is ugly.

 

I like it. **** your Pirates of the carribean bull****. Pirates of the carribean is a dumb childrens movie with silly, crappy ships.

[Heijoushin]

Yeah, pretty rude thread title. It looks fine to me. But then I never play much attention during the obligatory sea journey chapters in fantasy books.

[TheisEjsing]

Living my whole life on an Island, I should probably know stuff about boats and what not. I don't tho. And personally I find OE's ship with the door, stairs and the elevated control section cooler than the tiny model boat you prefer PJ.

 

I would, however, prefer this sail ship, if OE can get it out of customs. ;-)

 

Edited February 24, 2017 by TheisEjsing

[Leferd]

You are not very nice. People thought about and created this thing and all you have say is: This is ugly.

 

I like it. **** your Pirates of the carribean bull****. Pirates of the carribean is a dumb childrens movie with silly, crappy ships.

PJ's points still stand. It's this type of thoughtful constructive criticism that Obsidian appreciates and can take back to improve their game.

[JerekKruger]

You are not very nice. People thought about and created this thing and all you have say is: This is ugly.

 

So because work was put into creating this, we should lie and say we think it's great?

 

I like it. **** your Pirates of the carribean bull****. Pirates of the carribean is a dumb childrens movie with silly, crappy ships.

 

 

PrimeJunta mentioned Pirates of the Caribbean once, in the first paragraph of his post, as a short hand for what Deadfire is going to be like. He/she might correct me, but I don't think he/she was saying Obsidian should use Pirates as a source on inspiration, and the ships he then goes on to show images of are not ships from the Pirates movies.

[mumbogumshoe]

I don't mind the hull so much, even though I agree that it doesn't look sleek enough for a sloop. But I would like them to get the proportions right. Part of what makes sailing vessels look so cool is towering, billowing sails. Especially the mainsail on this thing looks tiny. 

Edited February 24, 2017 by mumbogumshoe

[Pope]

No worries, we passed 4 mil and thereby the new ship types stretch goal.

[JerekKruger]

I don't mind the hull so much, even though I agree that it doesn't look sleek enough for a sloop. But I would like them to get the proportions right. Part of what makes sailing vessels look so cool is towering, billowing sails. Especially the mainsail on this thing looks tiny. 

 

Whilst I agree, I think they do need to make concessions to ensure we can actually see our characters on the deck of the ship.

[mumbogumshoe]

 

I don't mind the hull so much, even though I agree that it doesn't look sleek enough for a sloop. But I would like them to get the proportions right. Part of what makes sailing vessels look so cool is towering, billowing sails. Especially the mainsail on this thing looks tiny. 

 

Whilst I agree, I think they do need to make concessions to ensure we can actually see our characters on the deck of the ship.

 

 

True dat...