Bug: Impaler of Thorns adds +4 for non-proficiency, doesn't say so

[_Harwin_]

This was mentioned in the "Known Issues" thread by a commenter, but is not part of the "Known Issues".  I read that Obsidian wants a separate thread for each bug, so here it is.

 

Kyra using Impaler of Thorns gets +4 added to combat difficulty, as if it were a weapon that required proficiency (like a longsword).  But the Impaler doesn't mention proficiency on it.

 

 

[Feywood]

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

 

Edited May 12, 2016 by Feywood

[Longshot11]

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

 

I was kinda hoping they changed the design, as the want for proficiency on this weapon sucks. First, it's a spear (and no other Spear requires proficiency) , and second, its the only halfway decent Melee weapon that weaker caster character can guaranteed get their hands on for support. It's basically perfect back up for a solo Ezren, and I had the feeling they slapped this arbitrary requirement just to spite the poor mage

[Sylvanta]

 

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

 

I was kinda hoping they changed the design, as the want for proficiency on this weapon sucks. First, it's a spear (and no other Spear requires proficiency) , and second, its the only halfway decent Melee weapon that weaker caster character can guaranteed get their hands on for support. It's basically perfect back up for a solo Ezren, and I had the feeling they slapped this arbitrary requirement just to spite the poor mage

 

 

This bug is actually the result of a change in text - while the card in the physical game states the difficulty increase (and was originally implemented to match this), it was later modified per Paizo to make it more in line with other spears and not require proficiency.  Text is correct; functionality is not!  However, this is also already fixed internally.

[Longshot11]

 

 

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

 

I was kinda hoping they changed the design, as the want for proficiency on this weapon sucks. First, it's a spear (and no other Spear requires proficiency) , and second, its the only halfway decent Melee weapon that weaker caster character can guaranteed get their hands on for support. It's basically perfect back up for a solo Ezren, and I had the feeling they slapped this arbitrary requirement just to spite the poor mage

 

 

This bug is actually the result of a change in text - while the card in the physical game states the difficulty increase (and was originally implemented to match this), it was later modified per Paizo to make it more in line with other spears and not require proficiency.  Text is correct; functionality is not!  However, this is also already fixed internally.

 

WHOA, WHOA, WHOA THERE!

You can't just drop this and leave me hanging - I had *expressly" asked about this on the Paizo forums (yeah, I *was* bitter about my solo Ezren) and MIke seemed to suggest the proficiency requirement is intended! And as of right now , the Impaler hasn't been officially FAQ'ed. So how and when exactly was this modified?

[Brainwave]

 

 

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

 

I was kinda hoping they changed the design, as the want for proficiency on this weapon sucks. First, it's a spear (and no other Spear requires proficiency) , and second, its the only halfway decent Melee weapon that weaker caster character can guaranteed get their hands on for support. It's basically perfect back up for a solo Ezren, and I had the feeling they slapped this arbitrary requirement just to spite the poor mage

This bug is actually the result of a change in text - while the card in the physical game states the difficulty increase (and was originally implemented to match this), it was later modified per Paizo to make it more in line with other spears and not require proficiency. Text is correct; functionality is not! However, this is also already fixed internally.

As this is the perfect weapon for Lini's sole weapon slot, I salute you!

 

Also this may be a bug but it's only allowing me to like your post once.

Edited May 12, 2016 by Brainwave

[Longshot11]

 

 

 

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

I was kinda hoping they changed the design, as the want for proficiency on this weapon sucks. First, it's a spear (and no other Spear requires proficiency) , and second, its the only halfway decent Melee weapon that weaker caster character can guaranteed get their hands on for support. It's basically perfect back up for a solo Ezren, and I had the feeling they slapped this arbitrary requirement just to spite the poor mage

This bug is actually the result of a change in text - while the card in the physical game states the difficulty increase (and was originally implemented to match this), it was later modified per Paizo to make it more in line with other spears and not require proficiency. Text is correct; functionality is not! However, this is also already fixed internally.

As this is the perfect weapon for Lini's sole weapon slot, I salute you!

 

Also this may be a bug but it's only allowing me to like your post once.

 

...until that sweet, sweet Deathbane comes along...

[Longshot11]

 

 

This is an omission on the digital card; the physical card mentions the proficiency requirement. I just ran into this myself when giving the spear to Lini.

 

I was kinda hoping they changed the design, as the want for proficiency on this weapon sucks. First, it's a spear (and no other Spear requires proficiency) , and second, its the only halfway decent Melee weapon that weaker caster character can guaranteed get their hands on for support. It's basically perfect back up for a solo Ezren, and I had the feeling they slapped this arbitrary requirement just to spite the poor mage

 

 

This bug is actually the result of a change in text - while the card in the physical game states the difficulty increase (and was originally implemented to match this), it was later modified per Paizo to make it more in line with other spears and not require proficiency.  Text is correct; functionality is not!  However, this is also already fixed internally.

 

So, since there was no FAQ on the Impaler over at Paizo, I brought the matter there. However, it would seem that there's some miscomunication along the line, as Vic Wertz denied the lack of proficiency being desired:

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2syxi?Does-Impaler-of-Thorns-really-require

 

I really hope he's in the wrong in this particular instance, but can we get a disclosure what is the 'correct' state of the card ultimately?

[Borissimo]

At this point, Obsidian can't say anything further on the matter without losing face, so I doubt we'll hear another official statement on the Impaler soon (or ever)

 

It's evident that Paizo wants the Impaler to have proficiency. For your home game, play the printed card as is. In the digital game, you get to choose.

Edited May 30, 2016 by Borissimo

[Longshot11]

At this point, Obsidian can't say anything further on the matter without losing face, so I doubt we'll hear another official statement on the Impaler soon (or ever)

 

It's evident that Paizo wants the Impaler to have proficiency. For your home game, play the printed card as is. In the digital game, you get to choose.

Well, not really. I can only guess that there's a lot of people involved in this project, and it's not always sure who had talked with whom. Sometimes things get lost along the chain of communication, it happens. So maybe Obsidian talked to Mike at Loneshark games (who, I guess is more involved with the game design), while maybe Vic (more responsible for the general design and consistency, far as I can tell) goes by Mike's last statement few months back. Or maybe it's something else entirely.

[Sylvanta]

 

At this point, Obsidian can't say anything further on the matter without losing face, so I doubt we'll hear another official statement on the Impaler soon (or ever)

 

It's evident that Paizo wants the Impaler to have proficiency. For your home game, play the printed card as is. In the digital game, you get to choose.

Well, not really. I can only guess that there's a lot of people involved in this project, and it's not always sure who had talked with whom. Sometimes things get lost along the chain of communication, it happens. So maybe Obsidian talked to Mike at Loneshark games (who, I guess is more involved with the game design), while maybe Vic (more responsible for the general design and consistency, far as I can tell) goes by Mike's last statement few months back. Or maybe it's something else entirely.

 

 

We get text updates from Paizo and update our cards accordingly.  I suppose the difficulty text was lost somewhere in transit.  We treat it as word of law unless something stands out as particularly odd, and given that the Impaler is a spear and other spears don't require proficiency, it seemed legit.  In the process of double checking on this with Paizo, I saw Vic's ruling in the same thread: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2syxi?Does-Impaler-of-Thorns-really-require#19

 

Vic:

The change was accidental. Weapon proficiency is desired.

 

 

As good as it is to not require proficiency for casters, it turns out to be a bug after all.  My apologies!  We'll get this rectified.   Good catch!

[Longshot11]

 

 

At this point, Obsidian can't say anything further on the matter without losing face, so I doubt we'll hear another official statement on the Impaler soon (or ever)

 

It's evident that Paizo wants the Impaler to have proficiency. For your home game, play the printed card as is. In the digital game, you get to choose.

Well, not really. I can only guess that there's a lot of people involved in this project, and it's not always sure who had talked with whom. Sometimes things get lost along the chain of communication, it happens. So maybe Obsidian talked to Mike at Loneshark games (who, I guess is more involved with the game design), while maybe Vic (more responsible for the general design and consistency, far as I can tell) goes by Mike's last statement few months back. Or maybe it's something else entirely.

 

 

We get text updates from Paizo and update our cards accordingly.  I suppose the text was lost somewhere - we treat it as word of law unless something stands out as particularly odd, and given that the Impaler is a spear and other spears don't require proficiency, it seemed legit.  In the process of double checking on this with Paizo, I saw Vic's ruling in the same thread: http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2syxi?Does-Impaler-of-Thorns-really-require#19

 

Vic:

The change was accidental. Weapon proficiency is desired.

 

 

As good as it is to not require proficiency for casters, it turns out to be a bug after all.  My apologies!  We'll get this rectified.

 

Darn it.