Most overpowered builds post patch 2.02

[Parasol_Syndicate]

Carnage isn't even a good ability- it just has the potential to be. 

 

Sneak Attack, and Ancient Memory are good, because they don't require stat investment to perform. Constant Recovery is good, because it helps the class fulfill it's role. 

Carnage costs stat points to deal damage everywhere except where you want it, and utterly flatlines against most of the difficult, high DR fights. 

[brindle88]

Carnage isn't even a good ability- it just has the potential to be. 

 

Sneak Attack, and Ancient Memory are good, because they don't require stat investment to perform. Constant Recovery is good, because it helps the class fulfill it's role. 

Carnage costs stat points to deal damage everywhere except where you want it, and utterly flatlines against most of the difficult, high DR fights. 

not even the high DR fights, I think it flatlines on the low DR Fights

[Gairnulf]

5% Per point of CON, not 3.

I've fixed that.

 

Me, I'm more concerned about Barbarian PCs, and adding them to a full party than Solo play- and I'm still not seeing them as worthy investments.

They're not, because they are too fragile at the front line and totally redundant in the back line.

 

One of my bigger issues is that an intellectual barbarian with poor determination, as the game mechanics encourage you to make, is absurd.  

To model a base, primal state like berserking or frenzy with mere cunning and reasoning is ignorant of the very appeal of the class!

I agree it's absurd, and people have been protesting the unintuitive way in which primary attributes affect character stats. For example, which of the two is the real "Strength" - "Might" or "Perception"?

 

 

I think Carnage reduces Deflection, and not Accuracy, contrary to what the wiki says. I can't start the game right now to check though.

the primary target will hit with full accuracy but every other target affected by the carnage ability will be hit with -10 accuracy

 

I see.

[aweigh0101]

they should transition the current PoE-style of barbarian archetype into a hybrid paladin type from 2nd edition.

his melee prowess already cuts a large swath on the battle field and he's a warrior born and taught (i assume they're taught by their barbie dads or whatever how to properly swing their sword just so to hit 3 guls instead of only 1, etc) and taught to utilize their intellect to navigate, control and impose themselves on the chaos of the front line and thus control it. a disciplined cunning that operates in the reptilian part of their brains if you will.

seems to me logical next step to make them "better" is to have their "shouts" merge with their "frenzy" and have their battle cries inspire allies, weaken and crush the spirit of their foe and hey, why not throw in some minor bit of tolkien ranger lore too and in advanced levels have them seek meaning in the land. in-between aoe-CC'ing mobs with tall-grass of course.

1/4 bard, 1/4 ranger, 1/4 paladin and 1/4 warrior berserker. the sorcerer to the fighter's mage, if you will.

EDIT: i completely forgot the best thing ever about barbies from 2nd ed. immunity to fear/charm while enraged! they need dat, that would put them on their way.

Edited November 4, 2015 by aweigh0101

[brindle88]

The discussion regarding the Barbarian in this thread got me curious, and I decided to test the class myself.Before someone proudly declares that they didn't read anything because it was too long, and not because they are too lazy to read a meaningful post, I'll summarize: I agree with brindle88. The Barbarian is a very handicapped class currently. Now that that's out of the way, to present my arguments.How I do class testing is, I start a solo game on PotD. I think soloing the first chapter of the game gives you the best idea about a class' performance.Advantages:

• The lack of party members allows you to have the most consistency when testing the character's combat performance. When you win, you win thanks to your abilities.
• Playing on PotD ensures that every tenth of a second, and every percentage point count. You have very little room for mistakes.
• By necessity, you get to become really good with that class.
• You often have to threorize and experiment with a few different builds with the same class.
• As a side effect to lots of game loading, you learn and test out the game's systems.
• As a side effect, you can confirm if soloing is possible with this class.

Disadvantages:

• Random Number Generation becomes disproportionately important. That's because if, with a party of 4 or 5, you may on average score 2-3 bad rolls, but will still do useful things thanks to a couple of characters' good rolls, when you have a party of just one, almost every roll has to be a good roll, even when you are faced with just one enemy.
• You don't get a chance to test out talent synergies between classes. Not that anyone has ever made attempts to test synergies between classes anyway, at least to the best of my knowledge. Yet as a result, a class that only shines when in a party, might make a bad impression when soloing. This again touches on the question if some classes experience a big jump in performance when in a party, compared to when playing solo, and if yes, which combinations of classes are the optimal ones.

You can consider each of the eleven classes as a subclass of one of two great classes - a Fighter or a Caster. The existence of many active and modal abilities makes the difference between the two great classes a bit blurry, but still, it's fairly obvious after you look at a class' class talents and abilities, if it's expected to shed blood/endurance on the front line, or to boost allies/nerf enemies from the back line.Another typologization could be done concurrently to the first one, by the classes' base Deflection, Accuracy, and Endurance values. Combined with the set of abilities/talents/spells, they should give us a good idea of what is expected of a given character class.Given this information, and using these metrics, what is expected of the Barbarian class?

• It has the most endurance, and is the class with the biggest health-to-endurance multiplier.
• It shares the second-worst deflection with the Rogue. The worst deflection, on paper, is the Wizard's, but it can be augmented very effectively in a number of ways by the wizard himself. So much so that if I have just a Barbarian and a Wizard in the party, it would be optimal to use the Wizard as the tank.
• That being said, we can say that the Barbarian and the Rogue share the worst Deflection among the font-line classes (if the Rogue is used on the front line).
• Accuracy-wise, the Barbarian resides in a second tier of classes, along with the Chanter, Cipher and Paladin, with the caveat that all these classes while being equal to the Barbarian class in base Accuracy, surpass it in Deflection - 25, 20 and 20 respectively, vs the Barbarian's lousy 15 base Deflection.

A final note on Accuracy/Deflection/Endurance. You should know that if you strive to complete all or most of the side quests and tasks, your character will spend the majority of the game somewhere around levels 8-11, which for a Barbarian means unmodified values of:

• 46-55 Accuracy (plus a flat 1 point of Accuracy for each point you increase Perception above 10)
• 36-45 Deflection (plus a flat 1 point of Deflection for each point you increase Resolve above 10)
• 160-208 Endurance (plus 5% for each point you increase Constitution above 10)

So, it's abysmal Deflection, mediocre Accuracy and a large health pool, which together with the class' abilities will try to compensate for these disadvantages. How will it manage that?Regarding talents, all of the Barbarian's talents/abilities imply that it has to be used on the front line, so the AoE centered around him affects as many enemies as possible.Therefore, by the class' nature, the Barbarian will often be engaged by multiple enemies. Being engaged by multiple enemies (above your engagement limit) results in the "Flanked" status effect, which gives a character a penalty of -10 Deflection. In some circumstances this could reduce the Barbarian to 0 deflection (or even under 0 if that's possible), meaning that pretty much every attack is a hit and every other attack is a Critical Hit. Even with the barbarian's large health pool, he can't withstand this kind of beating while maintaining a good DPS - in other words - not unless you stack up his DR and as a result reduce his DPS, in order to keep him in combat longer.Knowing these things, what are the player's optimal strategies when distributing Primary Attributes scores?In version 2.03, the game suggests, of all things, Might and Constitution as strongly recommended and intelligence and and dexterity as recommended. I might be mistaken about those two, because I don't have the game open, but even if I am, it doesn't matter, because they look pretty wrong to me.For a solo build, what you want to give your character when it's from a front-line class is Accuracy and Action Speed, with Deflection also being important for those classes that can't boost their deflection through abilities, spells, etc.The reasoning is that when you are fighting multiple enemies, statistically, you are at a disadvantage, because for each time when you get a chance to score a hit, they will get more than one chance to score a hit at you. The way to mitigate this disadvantage is to increase the probability of your scoring a hit and the frequency with which you have a chance to score a hit, i.e. your DPS. Everything else takes a secondary place.This makes the Barbarian a bad choice for a solo build due to its naturally bad deflection and mediocre accuracy. When it comes to probability for a hit in combat, the Barbarian's best option is to go with double hatchets vs enemies with low or no DR (Skuldr Whelps), substituting it for a two-handed weapon when fighting targets with high DR (Tenfrith's abductors for example).However, even with maximized Accuracy and Deflection, the Barbarian is still no match for a simple Shade in the second level of the temple of Eothas, or for a group of three Xaurips, one of them a Champion (the encounter in Anslog Compass). With some degree of optimizing your path through Chapter I's areas, you may be able to raise enough money to buy the item in Gilded Vale that will let you summon an Animat. This might make it feasible to reach Caed Nua at level 5, but I'm having a hard time imagining the Battle in Caed Nua's main hall vs two Shades and 4 Phantoms (or were they 5).The Barbarian fails vs Shades in the following way - he gets hit by the Shade with 74 Accuracy vs his 30-something - 40 deflection at most. The secondary effect of the attack - Dazed - also hits with 74 Accuracy vs his 40-ish Fortitude. From then on, the Shade needs a few more strikes to bring the Barbarian down, and it scores them without error, simply because the Barbarian's Deflection is too low. It may be possible to still get through this battle with Potion of Wizard's Double, but then the final battle before reaching the end of the quest would still be too difficult for the Barbarian.I am currently soloing the game with a Wizard, lvl 6 right now. It's much easier to solo with a Wizard due to his CC capabilities, which provide for a multitude of approaches to combat vs many enemies at once (Bewildering Spectacle, Chill Fog, etc) plus the option to temporarily turn yourself into a high-DPS, high-Deflection fighter (Hardened Veil/Concelhaut's Parasitic Staff).Spending points for the attributes which become necessary for a viable solo build leave the Barbarian crippled in his most important attributes - Intelligence and Might, which allow the class to take advantage of his Carnage talent. Even with these maxed out, the Barbarian needs yet more points, to compensate for his lack of Deflection, either by pumping up Constitution or Resolve.Trying to compensate for the lack of Deflection by betting it all on DR and pumping up DR through equipment would just sink your DPS. Then you'd have to put hope in your accuracy, to score fewer attacks but more consistent hits. That would have been an option for the Barbarian if it weren't also handicapped in its Accuracy.This is why my conclusion is that the Barbarian sucks for a solo build.Normally if a class fails as a soloing class, that means it's a weak class in my book, but I'll ponder a bit on its chances when part of a party.I guess the Deflection deficiency will be less noticeable in a party, where the Barbarian can take advantage of the Fighter attracting all the enemies' attention, and of the Priest's buffs. Still, the Barbarian would remain vulnerable to AoE attacks and will more often than not succumb before the battle has ended.The Wild Sprint talent also inclines me to think that the Barbarian would be more viable in a party than soloing.However, with all this being said, I fail to grasp the point of the Barbarian as a class. If it's the Carnage ability, then that's in most cases no more significant than the effects of Chill Fog for example. If it's the afflictions he can cause on enemies, there are back-line caster classes who can cause these afflictions (and more), with less risk to themselves. The Barbarian doesn't provide boosts to allies, so all this leaves him with the role of an AoE damage-dealer and afflictions dispenser, only with the disadvantage of being very exposed to enemy aggro. That's too few advantages against too many disadvantages.Conclusion: unlike in the IE games, in PoE a big health bar can't compensate for an inadequate Armor Class. This means that a class that's betting on light armor, front-line attacks, and a large health pool, is doomed to feel inferior to classes with smaller health pools but rating higher in the PoE's equivalent of Armor Class.P.S. I challenge anyone arguing for the Barbarian's viability to post their videos of how they solo all or parts of Chapter I.

Gairnulf

 

If you have solod POTD with multiple characters, in your option, what is the most over powered build post patch 2.03 (now)?

[Livegood118]

I don't get all the hate for Barbarians.

 

Sure – as a solo character they're going to be complete junk. That's a given. You really need to be defensively orientated in some way to solo or have a lot of hard CC/be able to deal damage from a distance.

 

But that's like saying forks are bad/underpowered because it's hard to eat soup with them.

 

If you give a high might/high intellect Barbarian Tidefall and Accuracy Bracers and if they have a reasonable amount of resolve (<10) or concentration buffs you will be able to throw them in to a group of enemies and watch as chunks start appearing everywhere. The Barbarian will be able to take aggro from maybe 3-4 enemies themselves because of the rate of Endurance Drain – if they hit six or seven enemies for an average of 35-50 a hit they'll be healing themselves for like 50 Endurance each swing and potentially interrupting as well depending on what build you go for. They will, of course, be susceptible to CC but realistically unless you've got an uber-tank in the party everyone else probably will too! 

 

The key thing that can't really be put in to numbers is the fact that they can do this consistently and without much micromanagement whereas with spell based AOE classes you're going to be eating in to your spells-per-day. The value of a damage focused Barbarian is going to be increased even further with the nerf to per-encounter spells that is coming shortly.

 

I'll agree with two things though:

 

(a) If you're a big rester/not playing on POTD/don't care about micro you're probably just better off taking a spell-based AOE class.

(b) With the introduction of additional immunities in to the game – prone of which is the most common – the AOE Affliction Barbarian build needs a rethink. I don't know how many immunities have been introduced to stun but Star Caller/the unique Dozens spear are an option I guess then.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Livegood118

[Livegood118]

Also, I forgot to add that a Barbarian with St. Ydwen's Redeemer is a better undead (Vessel) slayer than anything else in the game and may as well be Buffy the Vampire Slayer on cocaine. 

[brindle88]

I don't get all the hate for Barbarians.

 

Sure – as a solo character they're going to be complete junk. That's a given. You really need to be defensively orientated in some way to solo or have a lot of hard CC/be able to deal damage from a distance.

 

But that's like saying forks are bad/underpowered because it's hard to eat soup with them.

 

If you give a high might/high intellect Barbarian Tidefall and Accuracy Bracers and if they have a reasonable amount of resolve (<10) or concentration buffs you will be able to throw them in to a group of enemies and watch as chunks start appearing everywhere. The Barbarian will be able to take aggro from maybe 3-4 enemies themselves because of the rate of Endurance Drain – if they hit six or seven enemies for an average of 35-50 a hit they'll be healing themselves for like 50 Endurance each swing and potentially interrupting as well depending on what build you go for. They will, of course, be susceptible to CC but realistically unless you've got an uber-tank in the party everyone else probably will too! 

 

The key thing that can't really be put in to numbers is the fact that they can do this consistently and without much micromanagement whereas with spell based AOE classes you're going to be eating in to your spells-per-day. The value of a damage focused Barbarian is going to be increased even further with the nerf to per-encounter spells that is coming shortly.

 

I'll agree with two things though:

 

(a) If you're a big rester/not playing on POTD/don't care about micro you're probably just better off taking a spell-based AOE class.

(b) With the introduction of additional immunities in to the game – prone of which is the most common – the AOE Affliction Barbarian build needs a rethink. I don't know how many immunities have been introduced to stun but Star Caller/the unique Dozens spear are an option I guess then.

Yeah of course, as you have clarified, you can give your barb a weapon and he may or may not die when he enters melee combat. The point we are making is that they are overall probably the weakest class and you have stated the AOE affliction build needs a rethink after the latest patch, man seriously it never worked in the first place on POTD, even before the patch. The accuracy was to low and the enemies deflection was to high to crit and land these afflictions.

 

As I have said before, on POTD, even with my rogue maxed to the absolute max with the highest accuracy with reckless assault I could not consistently land crits often enough to apply these afflictions with those weapons to one single enemy that was half a challenge to kill that often. To say the barb could do this with its inferior accuracy and further reduced with the carnage is complete BS.

 

I no I tested it.

[Livegood118]

 

I don't get all the hate for Barbarians.

 

Sure – as a solo character they're going to be complete junk. That's a given. You really need to be defensively orientated in some way to solo or have a lot of hard CC/be able to deal damage from a distance.

 

But that's like saying forks are bad/underpowered because it's hard to eat soup with them.

 

If you give a high might/high intellect Barbarian Tidefall and Accuracy Bracers and if they have a reasonable amount of resolve (<10) or concentration buffs you will be able to throw them in to a group of enemies and watch as chunks start appearing everywhere. The Barbarian will be able to take aggro from maybe 3-4 enemies themselves because of the rate of Endurance Drain – if they hit six or seven enemies for an average of 35-50 a hit they'll be healing themselves for like 50 Endurance each swing and potentially interrupting as well depending on what build you go for. They will, of course, be susceptible to CC but realistically unless you've got an uber-tank in the party everyone else probably will too! 

 

The key thing that can't really be put in to numbers is the fact that they can do this consistently and without much micromanagement whereas with spell based AOE classes you're going to be eating in to your spells-per-day. The value of a damage focused Barbarian is going to be increased even further with the nerf to per-encounter spells that is coming shortly.

 

I'll agree with two things though:

 

(a) If you're a big rester/not playing on POTD/don't care about micro you're probably just better off taking a spell-based AOE class.

(b) With the introduction of additional immunities in to the game – prone of which is the most common – the AOE Affliction Barbarian build needs a rethink. I don't know how many immunities have been introduced to stun but Star Caller/the unique Dozens spear are an option I guess then.

Yeah of course, as you have clarified, you can give your barb a weapon and he may or may not die when he enters melee combat. The point we are making is that they are overall probably the weakest class and you have stated the AOE affliction build needs a rethink after the latest patch, man seriously it never worked in the first place on POTD, even before the patch. The accuracy was to low and the enemies deflection was to high to crit and land these afflictions.

 

As I have said before, on POTD, even with my rogue maxed to the absolute max with the highest accuracy with reckless assault I could not consistently land crits often enough to apply these afflictions with those weapons to one single enemy that was half a challenge to kill that often. To say the barb could do this with its inferior accuracy and further reduced with the carnage is complete BS.

 

I no I tested it.

 

 

The secret to the Affliction Barb wasn't in accuracy (well, I guess it was, you need a good bit of it anyway) but piling up hits to crits as much as you can.

 

Off the top of my head you could have:

 

- +10% Tall Grass

- +20% Durgan Weapon

- +20% Dire Blessing

- +5% Paladin Zealous Focus 

 

All for +55% Hits to Crits total – this makes it much, much easier to land them crits (and you also deal a lot more damage).

 

I wouldn't say they get the "weakest" class award - they're strong at what they do, which is dealing as much damage in AOE as humanly possible. 

 

Chanters on the other-hand are more or less irredeemable at the moment.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Livegood118

[Livegood118]

Actually, you could be an Orlan too and an additional +10% for 65% Hits to Crits

[AndreaColombo]

- +20% Durgan Weapon

- +20% Dire Blessing

 

These two don't stack.

Edited November 4, 2015 by AndreaColombo

[Gairnulf]

Gairnulf

 

If you have solod POTD with multiple characters, in your option, what is the most over powered build post patch 2.03 (now)?

I haven't played with enough classes to easily compare. Soloing has different requirements to a character's base stats than playing with a party, and if we keep that in mind, I'd say a DPS Rogue would preform best, once he has the items needed to summon beetles or shades.

 

Classes who are more support-inclined and work well buffing the party will naturally be at a disadvantage for soloiong, but I guess you already knew that - Priest, Paladin. I guess some combinations of Ranger/companion will also be good, if for no other reason, simply because you get a "free" second party member. I don't have a definitive answer, but I'd bet on a Rogue which will have to pick his fights and use stealth until he has some summons items.

 

The trick to the Rogue is that it has the capability to avoid combat and has the easiest time when it comes to picking his fights, which will enable him to keep progressing through the game's content and gathering XP where other classes might hit a dead end because they don't have the Stealth and the Shadowing Beyond ability.

 

On a sidenote, it would make sense to go for Moon Godlike when soloing, regardless of class. Moon Godlike gives the character about 150% of its endurance pool - you get autohealed pretty much up to full endurance, when at 75% endurance, then at 50%, and then at 25%, and that's per fight(!). I wouldn't test a soloed character with this race though, because it would give me a wrong picture of its survivability unless I test all classes with this race. It is a real boost though and will probably be the biggest help to a soloing Barbarian, buying him enough time to try to score a few more attacks that may win him the fight.

 

But then again, it would be an equally good bonus to any other class, although it would probably be less relevant for classes which can reach high Deflection values early in the game and are thus less reliant on a large Endurance pool - a Fighter or a Wizard will probably be less affected by an increased Endurance pool, but it's still nice to have.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Gairnulf

[Elric Galad]

 

 

- +20% Durgan Weapon

- +20% Dire Blessing

These two don't stack.

It is strange because spells usually stack with weapon enchant.

 

Do you know what Durgan Steel stack with ?

Does it stacks with other weapons / armor enchants by the way ?

[AndreaColombo]

Do you know what Durgan Steel stack with ?

Does it stacks with other weapons / armor enchants by the way ?

 

It seems to stack with pretty much everything, but when I ran tests for my crit build I could never get the Durgan enchant to convert a hit to crit for as long as the spell was on. When the spell wore off, Durgan kicked in.

[Livegood118]

 

- +20% Durgan Weapon

- +20% Dire Blessing

 

These two don't stack.

 

 

 

Do you know what Durgan Steel stack with ?

Does it stacks with other weapons / armor enchants by the way ?

 

It seems to stack with pretty much everything, but when I ran tests for my crit build I could never get the Durgan enchant to convert a hit to crit for as long as the spell was on. When the spell wore off, Durgan kicked in.

 

This seems weird – my understanding was that enchantments from different sources will always stack: e.g.

 

- Talents/Innate Odd Level Abilities

- Modals

- Spells/"Cast" Abilities

- Weapons

- Shields

- Armour and other equipment

 

Is the Durgan thing intended or a bug as far as you know?

Edited November 4, 2015 by Livegood118

[AndreaColombo]

Is the Durgan thing intended or a bug as far as you know?

 

 

Great question. I assumed from the get-go that it was intended, but for all I know it might as well be a bug.

 

I'll raise it shortly so QA can have a look.

 

EDIT: ICYMI

Edited November 4, 2015 by AndreaColombo

[brindle88]

 

Is the Durgan thing intended or a bug as far as you know?

 

 

 

Great question. I assumed from the get-go that it was intended, but for all I know it might as well be a bug.

 

I'll raise it shortly so QA can have a look.

 

EDIT: ICYMI

I don't reckon that would be a bug, converting 50+ % of your hits to crits would fit into the pillars op phenomenon. I think they would have done this intentionally

[Teioh_White]

I'll just repeat myself a bit;

 

Pretty silly for anyone to think Barbs are a bad class. A bit limited in what they do, sure, but they're amazing at what they do, i.e. mow down packs of trash at melee range. And a large part of the combat in this game is mowing down packs of trash at melee range. I'd rather remove any other melee from my frontline than the Barb, just as they do so much good work in such a frequent part of the game. Of course, if folks think they're bad because they're trying to compare them to wizards, of course they are. Everything is lackluster compared to a wizard, and the other 2 casters + Cipher change are on the same curve.

 

It's kinda funny how that strength pretty much entirely comes from Carnage as well. It's really only class abilites that create any meaningful distinction between classes in this game, due to everyone having same general talent pools, stat choices, gear selection, and stat growth. The rest of Barb's class talents are somewhat unfocused and negligible, but Carnage alone is so amazing it carries the rest. Sorta like the anti-fighter, who gets absolutely no help from their core talent, but gets a nice +.25 mod and 13% speed boost. (okay, it isn't that great. poor fighter). An easy enough 2.15 mod + aoe 1.5 mod adds up to a lot of damage on the incredible amount of trash in this game, even compared to a rogues 3.35. And that's not even taking into account the slowing of all incoming damage from the interrupts and stun.

 

I'm really confused on how folks think it's some great task to crit things on PotD. Act 1? Sure, part of why it's the best part of the game. Act 2? It's just a bunch of tedious side quests that vomit gear and xp, letting classes safely nest and come out all overpowered for Act 3. And once in Act 3 and on to Act 4? It's no issue at all. Very few things outside the rare boss mobs break 80 deflection, the majority hang around the 60's. By 14, an unbuffed Barb sits around 90 acc, so Carnage swings at 85. Toss in one of the 3 blessings, and a single debuff from a caster, and wee, 30% crit rate. Add Durgon/Dire + another debuff (even just a flank)? Up to 50%, that can be set up every fight with minimal cost. And that's just the tougher things like Banshees, the majority of mobs are much easier to hit than that. And for the hard mobs, you'll always have someone hammering them with the Roar, giving them -30 to all defenses on top, so even those aren't impossible to crit.

[brindle88]

I'll just repeat myself a bit;

 

Pretty silly for anyone to think Barbs are a bad class. A bit limited in what they do, sure, but they're amazing at what they do, i.e. mow down packs of trash at melee range. And a large part of the combat in this game is mowing down packs of trash at melee range. I'd rather remove any other melee from my frontline than the Barb, just as they do so much good work in such a frequent part of the game. Of course, if folks think they're bad because they're trying to compare them to wizards, of course they are. Everything is lackluster compared to a wizard, and the other 2 casters + Cipher change are on the same curve.

 

It's kinda funny how that strength pretty much entirely comes from Carnage as well. It's really only class abilites that create any meaningful distinction between classes in this game, due to everyone having same general talent pools, stat choices, gear selection, and stat growth. The rest of Barb's class talents are somewhat unfocused and negligible, but Carnage alone is so amazing it carries the rest. Sorta like the anti-fighter, who gets absolutely no help from their core talent, but gets a nice +.25 mod and 13% speed boost. (okay, it isn't that great. poor fighter). An easy enough 2.15 mod + aoe 1.5 mod adds up to a lot of damage on the incredible amount of trash in this game, even compared to a rogues 3.35. And that's not even taking into account the slowing of all incoming damage from the interrupts and stun.

 

I'm really confused on how folks think it's some great task to crit things on PotD. Act 1? Sure, part of why it's the best part of the game. Act 2? It's just a bunch of tedious side quests that vomit gear and xp, letting classes safely nest and come out all overpowered for Act 3. And once in Act 3 and on to Act 4? It's no issue at all. Very few things outside the rare boss mobs break 80 deflection, the majority hang around the 60's. By 14, an unbuffed Barb sits around 90 acc, so Carnage swings at 85. Toss in one of the 3 blessings, and a single debuff from a caster, and wee, 30% crit rate. Add Durgon/Dire + another debuff (even just a flank)? Up to 50%, that can be set up every fight with minimal cost. And that's just the tougher things like Banshees, the majority of mobs are much easier to hit than that. And for the hard mobs, you'll always have someone hammering them with the Roar, giving them -30 to all defenses on top, so even those aren't impossible to crit.

We are saying barbs are inferior to all other melee classes, including paladins.

 

Of course you can give the barb the weapon and he can attack stuff.

[brindle88]

Anyway enough about barbs please. I was really interested if anyone has any over powered builds that they think are good post patch 2.02?

 

Would love to here them.

[Sking]

QA Approved Barb Strat,

 

Give your Barb a stick, stack his Might past 30, let him Graze (or just spam Scrolls of Valor), and put a Shield/Support Pally in front of him. Don't drop his Intel and you'll sweep encounters. Not as fast as a DPS Rogue but so much less effort and risk.

[Zenbane]

QA Approved Barb Strat,

 

Give your Barb a stick, stack his Might past 30, let him Graze (or just spam Scrolls of Valor), and put a Shield/Support Pally in front of him. Don't drop his Intel and you'll sweep encounters. Not as fast as a DPS Rogue but so much less effort and risk.

Oh thank heavens, some sensibility to this topic lol

 

I love my Barb, and pretty much abandoned this thread after all that inaccurate analysis. It's nice to see a QA Approved Barb Strat. A Death Godlike Barb with a Moon Godlike Paladin; quite the lovely duo.

 

 

Anyway enough about barbs please. I was really interested if anyone has any over powered builds that they think are good post patch 2.02?

 

Would love to here them.

I'm pretty sure at this point no one who has been paying attention believes for one second that you would truly "love to hear" other peoples ideas on power builds. You seem to have your own set opinion on the matter.

[brindle88]

 

QA Approved Barb Strat,

 

Give your Barb a stick, stack his Might past 30, let him Graze (or just spam Scrolls of Valor), and put a Shield/Support Pally in front of him. Don't drop his Intel and you'll sweep encounters. Not as fast as a DPS Rogue but so much less effort and risk.

 

Oh thank heavens, some sensibility to this topic lol

 

I love my Barb, and pretty much abandoned this thread after all that inaccurate analysis. It's nice to see a QA Approved Barb Strat. A Death Godlike Barb with a Moon Godlike Paladin; quite the lovely duo.

 

 

Anyway enough about barbs please. I was really interested if anyone has any over powered builds that they think are good post patch 2.02?

Would love to here them.

 

I'm pretty sure at this point no one who has been paying attention believes for one second that you would truly "love to hear" other peoples ideas on power builds. You seem to have your own set opinion on the matter.

Haha ok. Htf do you stack his might past 30 when you need points in perception, intelligence and dexterity. And spamming scrolls of valour? Does that mean I need to buy/ craft that scroll and use it on a continuous basis to make that work?

 

Of course if I did that he his carnage would be pretty affective. Paladins aura would also further increase the accuracy as well as the scroll.

 

BUT

 

When I when to university and did my masters in economics (sorry fro bringing that up) we where taught a principle in I think the very first year of my undergraduate degree and that principle is called OPPORTUNITY COST.

 

The barbarian

 

A: has to activate frenzy which has the speed of an average spell

B: activate the scroll

C: position into melee combat

D: you also have a talent selection there for the paladin (accuracy aura) that the paladin could use otherwise

E : you require a paladin in the first place

 

Now you can do all this and that's fine but by the time you do a cost base analysis vs a rogue or a fighter you will probably find that this is not very affective.

 

Especially scince every caster can do better with a simple spell out of melee combat.

 

But everyone has there own preferences.

[Zenbane]

Just because you created a Bullet Point list of things someone may do while combat is paused, doesn't mean you proved something about this imaginary "cost base analysis" (which doesn't even make sense in this context).

 

Also, typing a lot of words doesn't mean you're winning an argument. Did they not teach that at the University? Also, I have 2 degrees and 2 certifications in Technology, specializing in Software Development and Infrastructure Security. Just fyi since you decided to bring your finance academic resume in to the conversation.

Edited November 5, 2015 by Zenbane

[brindle88]

Just because you created a Bullet Point list of things someone may do while combat is paused, doesn't mean you proved something about this imaginary "cost base analysis" (which doesn't even make sense in this context).

 

Also, typing a lot of words doesn't mean you're winning an argument. Did they not teach that at the University? Also, I have 2 degrees and 2 certifications in Technology, specializing in Software Development and Infrastructure Security. Just fyi since you decided to bring your finance academic resume in to the conversation.

You can't actually do all those bullet points in one pause of combat. It's more like multiple pauses of combat. Let's leave petty arguing out of this. No ones interested. A strat was raised and I simply said there is a significant cost in doing that. For your barb to do all that there is a cost.

 

I couldn't care less about winning an argument grow up man