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savior99

Some doubts and questions

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Hi all,

 

Just started this MASTERPIECE of a game, I am level 5 now, i really like how slow the characters are in advancing (not like in Wasteland 2...) it really rewards you much more when you finally level up.

 

Since i do not want to cheat to fix my characters, i would like to avoid spending skills on useless stuff and i have also some other doubts.

 

They are many, so you can reply only to some points, but any advice (no spoilers please) would be appreciated :

 

1 - Is Stealth a viable solution for some quests ? In that case i think all the characters should have the same level otherwise the lowest one would apply. (i.e. if one character has 0 the whole group would have 0 because the group would be spotted because of him). Is it also affected by the armor worn ?

If that is so, i would need to spend a lot of points there. 

 

2 - How much Stealth is necessary to avoid some combat ? 

 

3 - How much is the maximum points you can assign to those skills (stealth, athletics, ecc) 

 

4 - Do you get the possibility to increase some attributes (might, dexterity, etc.) at some point?  (apart from items I mean)

 

5 - Is greater Frenzy good for my main Barb ? I think +2 in Might would translate in only little points of dps, maybe there are some better Class specialization for the Barbarian ? Like i think i will take "savage something" that gives you roughly +100 Endurance once per fight, and then the one that gives you a bonus when you have two enemies engaged.

 

6 - If i don't take the latter at level 5, will I have the chance to get it later? If so, at what level ?

 

7 - Do chanters get new phrases only at level up ? Or are there books or items for that purpose?

 

8 - Could you please indicate me some (link) to the useful (and useless) spells for Wizard and priest ?

 

9 - I noticed that the priest i got (Durance) is quite useless, i would like to replace him with a rogue. If i don't take a rogue soon enough, when i meet him/her, he will have auto leveled-up, so maybe taking some useless feat...is it better if i take him/her asap ? If so, where do i find one ? I still need to go to Defiance Bay.

 

10 - What are the best way to replenish health between camps ? the skills to cure self/allies do not seem so good. Or did you invest feats there? 

 

11 - If anyway i do some mistakes, is there some user friendly character editor ? ("IE mod" does not look so easy to use for that purpose and in fact it is not specific for that).

 

Many thanks if you can shed some light ! :)

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1 - highest chr. applies, not lowest. Stealth can be used to avoid trash-mob combats (can't avoid scripted dialogue triggers) but overall it's application in the game doesn't seem particularly awesome. I don't think most are pumping it to high levels. I did eventually, only because I had nothing else to put the points in.

 

2 - not sure - at least 4 I'd think. I know at 8 I was able to scoot past people in smaller rooms/hallways (vs. the wide outdoors) because the time of the rotating yellow circle increased, allowing you to get past before being seen. Still didn't feel terribly "sneaky", however.

 

3 - pretty sure you can devote all your points for those if you wish. If you don't spend all 6 pts each level, they carry over to the next time you levelup/use the screen.

 

4 - There's a few ways you can get permanent bonuses to various things, but that's spoilery. Might want to do a Search in one of the spoiler forums, or look in a wiki.

 

I know nothing about Barbarians, so...

 

7 - chanter phrases are level ups, no skillbooks or anything like that in PoE

 

8 - wizard - low level, fan of flames and the CC ones are popular. High level, all the CC ones. Wizards have a long growing pain period, especially if you don't like friendly fire management. Priest's are mostly handy for healing Endurance and combat buffs and also have growing pains but get some decent spells later (eg, around level 8 or 9 Priests/Wizards can suddenly go from "useless/ok" to "sorta awesome"). That said, Priest debuffs are largely useless/not required at all, ever, imo.

 

9 - if you hire a higher level rogue/adventurer at the inn, you create/they join party at lvl1, then you keep hitting the level up button to make them their max available level.

 

10 - the only way to replenish HEALTH is to sleep/camp. (edit) Health and Endurance are two separate things. Endurance is combat health.

 

11 - there are console command cheats for attributes, but that (and the others) will disable achievements. Fine tuning small mistakes would require a mod.

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“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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10 - the only way to replenish HEALTH is to sleep/camp.

 

Not exactly true, there are a couple of skills that allow minor Health healing once or twice per rest

 

 

3 - pretty sure you can devote all your points for those if you wish. If you don't spend all 6 pts each level, they carry over to the next time you levelup/use the screen.

 

 Also not sure but I think you cap Lore at 10? 

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True about the minor health talents. That almost no one wastes their points on once they've tried them once. ;)

 

Kana in my game has 13 Lore (no bonuses). I think the only cap is the number of points available through clvl 12. (I don't think there are high level scrolls to go with it, however...again, I dumped points in it because they had nowhere else to go, lol)

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“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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Thank you Lady Crimson and Jimmious.

 

Yes, i was referring to those two "utilities" skills , one that restores HEALTH for self (around 100/150 HP) and the other one that heals an ally (50-100 HP) .

 

I just got Kana that comes with that already and i use it when my tank is almost dead, it just prolongs the time until my next rest a little. And wanted to know if other poeple took it themselves or not.

 

Regarding the Barbarian skills, to make it more general, I meant: there are some Class skills that you get at certain level threshold i guess. (i.e 5, 7?, 9 ?). And i meant...if i give up one tat i would like, because there is a more interesting one at that level, will I have the chance to get it at a later level up ?

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LadyCrimson, are you sure the highest stealth level applies? I had the impression that the stealth level is applied individually - i.e. when my whole party was sneaking the different chars were detected at different speeds.

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3 - Ten is the most you need in a skill, except for Mechanics, for a couple of level 12 traps/locks.

 

4 - A few, but they tend to involve "evil" quest resolutions, if that matters to you.

 

6 - Yes, a few levels later.

 

8 - http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/76463-priest-spell-ratings/ Priest

 

9 - There is no companion Rogue to meet. Has to be the main character or created at a tavern.

 

10 - Don't take Field Triage or Wound Binding, just rest at an inn or camp.


Exoduss, on 14 Apr 2015 - 11:11 AM, said: 

 

also secret about hardmode with 6 man party is :  its a faceroll most of the fights you will Auto Attack mobs while lighting your spliff

 

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1 - yes but the main thing is that it makes almost all fights much easier

2 - 0 as you can sneak past things even with no points in stealth (stealth is way OP atm)

3 - don't know, it gets exponentially more expensive as skills go up; mechanics is the only one worth maxing out

4 - afaik no

5 - maybe, depends on how you're playing it

6 - yes, all the lower-level class abilities remain available when you get to pick them later

7 - only on level-up afaik

8 - they're all somewhat useful, but my favorite (low-level) ones are Chill Fog, Slicken, Fan of Flames, and Curse of Blackened Sight (wiz), Iconic Projection, that AoE over time healing spell from level 2, and that thing that debuffs deflection from level 1 (priest)

9 - Durance is far from useless, play him right and he will turn most hard-ish fights into cakewalks; if you want a rogue though you need to hire one. They're always 1 level below charname.

10 - avoid getting hurt in the first place.

11 - console.


I have a project. It's a tabletop RPG. It's free. It's a work in progress. Find it here: www.brikoleur.com

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LadyCrimson, are you sure the highest stealth level applies? I had the impression that the stealth level is applied individually - i.e. when my whole party was sneaking the different chars were detected at different speeds.

I think when this happens it's because the party members can't all be the same distance away from the same enemy (eg, they can't all stand on the same exact spot), and it seems to me that the closer you are, the faster that circle timer runs. Although I could be wrong. It's just what I make of my observations.

 

 

Thank you Lady Crimson and Jimmious.

 

Yes, i was referring to those two "utilities" skills , one that restores HEALTH for self (around 100/150 HP) and the other one that heals an ally (50-100 HP) .

 

I just got Kana that comes with that already and i use it when my tank is almost dead, it just prolongs the time until my next rest a little. And wanted to know if other poeple took it themselves or not.

 

Regarding the Barbarian skills, to make it more general, I meant: there are some Class skills that you get at certain level threshold i guess. (i.e 5, 7?, 9 ?). And i meant...if i give up one tat i would like, because there is a more interesting one at that level, will I have the chance to get it at a later level up ?

The thing about those health skills is that for the precious point used, once your chrs. have way way way more than 200 health, it'll feel like a wasted point. :)

 

And yes, for my other chrs you could always choose a skill later, if you still want it more than the next tier up ones, at the moment, instead.


“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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Don't take Field Triage and Wound Binding, they aren't entirely terrible, but with so few talents available on level ups they're a waste of a talent slot. Just rest to regain health, you have enough camping supplies. Taverns also give you bonuses to skills, which is another incentive to use them.

 

Athletics around 3 on all party members helps avoid constant fatigue. The highest Mechanics checks in the game are 12, but you can easily pass them with 11+lockpicks. Or even 10 with an inn bonus.

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Thanks a lot all !!! 

 

Mazeltov, i was just reading that link you posted, and that is what i was looking for, thx!

 

Sometimes reading the description of the spells doesn't really give you a feeling of how really useful (or useless) a spell is.

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LadyCrimson, are you sure the highest stealth level applies? I had the impression that the stealth level is applied individually - i.e. when my whole party was sneaking the different chars were detected at different speeds.

I think when this happens it's because the party members can't all be the same distance away from the same enemy (eg, they can't all stand on the same exact spot), and it seems to me that the closer you are, the faster that circle timer runs. Although I could be wrong. It's just what I make of my observations.

 

I went and tested this via friendly NPC's and having chrs. approach one at a time, and I think you're correct/I was wrong.

 

Eder with 9 Stealth, his yellow circle took about 3.5 to 4 seconds to fill up (something like that, I didn't timer it). Aloth with 4 stealth was way faster to fill. So I guess I thought what I thought because Aloth is always in the back, so he isn't in detection range as soon and I'd be focusing on Eder (in front) and only notice Aloth as he dragged along in back. :)

 

From that brief test tho, I'd say Stealth needs to be pretty high to be useful in tight quarters. 4 stealth really isn't much time at all. Aloth was the only one left who didn't have at least 7. :)

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“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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Thanks for that test and those numbers. So i guess i will save my points for something else instead of Stealth. Maybe i will give some only to durant who is also the unlocker/trapper ...so maybe i can avoid some fights and still getting some loot from chests.

 

By the way I noticed that the wolf pet of Sagani seems to have quite a good stealth...is there a way to see its stats ?

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Hi LadyCrimson, you write:

 

"9 - if you hire a higher level rogue/adventurer at the inn, you create/they join party at lvl1, then you keep hitting the level up button to make them their max available level."

 

I have tried yesterday recruiting a rogue and i noticed that i can choose which level. My party is at level 4 and I can choose a rogue up to level 3.

 

I did not have money for a level 3 so i took a lvl 1. But there was no "level up" available. Probably it has changed somehow ?

 

Anyway i was thinking of not taking a "custom" character. That way i would loose any quest related to the "main" characters, wouldn't I ?

 

I was thinking that actually maybe i would need another tank, instead of a squishy rogue. Rogue needs also much more micro management. And i have already enough to do with the wizard and the priest...

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If you hire at level 1, they are level 1 and thus there is nothing to level up. ;)

If you are level 11 and you hire an inn adventurer who is, say, lvl 10, you create them (choose class, starting stats etc) and then when you leave the creation screen and they're actually part of your party, they are "lvl 1" but given enough experience to level up to 10, so thus you get to level them up (pick all their skills/talents) to lvl 10 right away. Otherwise they would have to AI auto-assign all skills and that's not what most would want.

Inn adventurers are always at least 1 level behind yours (can't hire one that's exactly your level).

As to what to make ... I tend to make either an extra Fighter/tank if I'm not one myself, or a Priest, because I don't like the companion priest. There are however two companions that can act as tanks or at least tank and off-tank. One you get early, the other later.


“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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Thanks for the clarification :)

 

Which class is the off-tank (and what do you mean by "off-tank") I will get later on ?  the first tank you refer to is the fighter Eder i guess. I am myself barbarian and making Kana the second tank does not seem a good choice. Also sending Sagani's wolf to be slaughtered all the time just to have some time at the beginning of the encounters does not seem very fair.

 

I would need another tank actually.

 

Related to this, what are the stronghold requirements to send the companions I am not using adventuring to gain XP ?

 

I did not see the option yesterday when I added the rogue.

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Related to this, what are the stronghold requirements to send the companions I am not using adventuring to gain XP ?

They have to be not in your party. eg, any companions you aren't using "sit around" in your Stronghold doing nothing, and you can use the Stronghold menus to assign them to tasks.

 

The other tankier companion is

 

 

a paladin you can encounter in one of the areas of Defiance Bay/Act2.

 

 

And off-tank...well I don't know what "everyone else" defines one as, but I tend to see them as a character who is not the main-tank...eg, they can soak up dmg and be a decent tank, but may have other purposes than to just stand and engage (some kind of extra-support role or being the one you send to flank enemies your main tank has already engaged) and is not the one you tend to first send into the fray to start the fight. If that makes sense. It's not always a class-dependent thing, imo...just a party-role aspect.


“Things are as they are. Looking out into the universe at night, we make no comparisons between right and wrong stars, nor between well and badly arranged constellations.” – Alan Watts

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1 - I know at least one quest that you can do with Stealth and it was pretty fun trying to avoid all guards. If you fail the stealth you will get to murder everyone there which I didn't want with my character. I think there are more but I didn't really try for those as I didn't care if I murdered everyone or not.

 

Stealth is group based and you will not be able to get everyone safely through as you need lots of skill into stealth.

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Related to this, what are the stronghold requirements to send the companions I am not using adventuring to gain XP ?

They have to be not in your party. eg, any companions you aren't using "sit around" in your Stronghold doing nothing, and you can use the Stronghold menus to assign them to tasks.

 

The other tankier companion is

 

 

a paladin you can encounter in one of the areas of Defiance Bay/Act2.

 

 

And off-tank...well I don't know what "everyone else" defines one as, but I tend to see them as a character who is not the main-tank...eg, they can soak up dmg and be a decent tank, but may have other purposes than to just stand and engage (some kind of extra-support role or being the one you send to flank enemies your main tank has already engaged) and is not the one you tend to first send into the fray to start the fight. If that makes sense. It's not always a class-dependent thing, imo...just a party-role aspect.

 

 

Thanks dude. Yes, i was not using the hired rogue, then went to the stronghold menu, but did not see any option to assign her to any mission. That's why I am asking...maybe i need some upgrade? I've only built 2 things (repaired the wall and the shelter that gives you the bounty missions).

 

Yes..off-tank...that makes sense. Thanks again.

 

@Archangel: do you refer to 

 the mission in Raedric's hold ? because the main reason why i asked that question is that because I had to slaughter them all, and I would have liked finishing the mission in another way. It took me a  lot of time/reloads and did not get much XP points.  

 

And when i said that the lowest score would apply I referred exactly to what you are saying... i.e.  If everyone had 10 in Stealth, but one character had only 1, he would be the one to get spotted by the enemies and that would make all the other points spent for other characters useless...so i've decided not to invest in stealth, maybe only on one character, the trapper/unlocker.

 

The other ones they all have around 2, I will keep it at 2 for all of them. Better than 0 anyway, and it doesn't cost many points.

Edited by savior99

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#1 - you can use it to sneak past mobs, so far there's only been one quest for me where i needed to have a decent stealth score, and the cipher the game supplies you with has a good stealth score already so i just used her.

#2 - 3-4 if you just need to sneak past the edge of their vision (i.e they are just visible at the edge of the fog of war) 8-10 if you need to sneak past them at a close distance, like small rooms/passages.

#3 - for every level in a skill you need 1 more skill point to level it. so for lvl 1->2 = 1 skill point, 2->3 is 2 skill points needed, and so on. you get 6 skill points per level, max level possible is 12 for a maximum of 72. there's nothing stopping you from maxing out a single skill, you can max the one your PC isn't focusing on on one of your companions instead.

#4 - Yep, though usually any opportunity to get a stat increase comes at a cost ;)

#5 - Take savage defiance @ lvl3, no substitute for it.

#6 - you should be able to take it each level up if you haven't gotten it yet, but the problem is a lot more useful abilities might be available thattake priority by then. for example, if you don't take One stands Alone at lvl 5 you're just gimping yourself. so if you havnt picked up savage defiance when you level up to 5, you're best off not taking it then either since one stands alone is so much better to have. ideally though you will want both of them.

#7 - only at level up, same for the cipher and their skills. wizard is the only spellcaster that can learn skills from spellbooks. with a sufficiently high enough lore skill though, any character can use scrolls to cast spell.

#8 - Priests get access to all spells anyway, but the best ones in my opinion are : Armor of faith, Halt, Dire blessing, Triumph of the crusaders, and pretty much all of the seals - try to put down the highest level seal you can cast before each fight with a group of enemies.

Wizards - Chill Fog, Parasitic Staff, Slicken, Curse of Blackened Sight, Miasma of Dull-Mindedness, Firerball, Crackling Bolt, Alacrity of Motion, Displaced Image, Confusion, Essential Phantom, Blast of Frost, Malignant Cloud, Gaze of the Adragan, Minoletta's Precisely Piercing Burst (the only minoletta spell worth getting imho, the rest of them are crap.)

#9 - if you are going to play without a priest, you're gonna have a bad time.

#10 - besides one or two skills, resting is really the only viable way to regain health. just put it off untill your characters are allmost at 0 hp anyway, it's endurance you want to worry about. allways have a priest for the heals. druid has a small amount of (endurance) healing spells as well. 

#11 - nothing out there besides IEmod. Honestly though, it only takes 1 console command to find your characters name as he is defined by the game, and one more to reset him back to level 0, so you can re-level him up again. if that is too much effort for you, you're better off restarting anyway.

Edited by Xosmi

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Stronghold adventures appear randomly, so you can't assign anyone when you don't have any missions available. Just wait for them.

 

I don't want to say too much about Raedric's Hold as this is a spoiler-free forum, but you can reach Readric killing hardly anyone and the final conversation also has one path allowing you to avoid the battle.

Edited by Rosveen
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#11 - nothing out there besides IEmod. Honestly though, it only takes 1 console command to find your characters name as he is defined by the game, and one more to reset him back to level 0, so you can re-level him up again. if that is too much effort for you, you're better off restarting anyway.

 

Thanks, I took Savage defiance" indeed, it seemed too useful to skip, since endurance is what i am always lacking...and I was planning to take one stand alone at lvl 7. Even though my barb is not a tank so i would not want to engage too many enemies at a time...i do not see that a real DPS talent, but more a tanky one.

 

I do not remember what i took at lvl 1 and 3, maybe I will decide to reset my character (i do not wanto to restart, at least now)

 

I am quite decent with computer skills, i would really love if Sagani had a bear instead of a wolf as companion...maybe i will give this a try.

 

Do i risk to spoil my save game though ?

 

EDIT, By the way, I have just read that even if you respecc Sagani, she will keep itumaank as companion :(

Edited by savior99

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@Archangel: do you refer to the mission in Raedric's hold ? because the main reason why i asked that question is that because I had to slaughter them all, and I would have liked finishing the mission in another way. It took me a  lot of time/reloads and did not get much XP points. 

 

And when i said that the lowest score would apply I referred exactly to what you are saying... i.e.  If everyone had 10 in Stealth, but one character had only 1, he would be the one to get spotted by the enemies and that would make all the other points spent for other characters useless...so i've decided not to invest in stealth, maybe only on one character, the trapper/unlocker.

 

The other ones they all have around 2, I will keep it at 2 for all of them. Better than 0 anyway, and it doesn't cost many points.

We are going to spoiler territory if we talk about specifics of quests.

 

That location is possible to avoid most of the conflict but that is not the one I did so in. That was much later in second town.

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yep sure, i do not want to enter any spoiler...sorry if i kinda did it before maybe, I will try to put a spoiler tag. (EDIT: Done)

Edited by savior99

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#11 - nothing out there besides IEmod. Honestly though, it only takes 1 console command to find your characters name as he is defined by the game, and one more to reset him back to level 0, so you can re-level him up again. if that is too much effort for you, you're better off restarting anyway.

 

Thanks, I took Savage defiance" indeed, it seemed too useful to skip, since endurance is what i am always lacking...and I was planning to take one stand alone at lvl 7. Even though my barb is not a tank so i would not want to engage too many enemies at a time...i do not see that a real DPS talent, but more a tanky one.

 

I do not remember what i took at lvl 1 and 3, maybe I will decide to reset my character (i do not wanto to restart, at least now)

 

I am quite decent with computer skills, i would really love if Sagani had a bear instead of a wolf as companion...maybe i will give this a try.

 

Do i risk to spoil my save game though ?

 

 

Well, barbarians are made to engage a lot of enemies at once - the more enemies surounding you, the more of them will be hit by carnage (the passive skill that makes your melee attacks function as AoE) 

Editing your savegame through console commands shouldn't corrupt your savegame, but it will mean you cannot unlock any achievements anymore.

 

As far as i know though, it's not possible to change sagani's animal companion. quoted from the IEmod console info page : 

Sagani will now keep her Itumaak even if you respec her into another class.

If you respec Sagani into any other class, no further actions are necessary, you're all good.
However, if you respec her into Ranger, you will be promoted to pick an animal companion by the game. It's just a formality, so pick any. When you're done, Sagani will still keep her Itumaak.

Though I don't know if this means that you can't change her companion at all, or that you can change her companion, but that she will keep itumaak on top of the one you changed it into (effectively giving her 2 companions) Try it, and find out i suppose :)

Personally, i don't care about achievements, and to be on the safe side concerning your saves, simply create another save before toying with the console command, so you can allways roll back to that one if you do encounter problems.

Edited by Xosmi
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