Paladin Questions: Order and Stats

[cycl0ps]

Looks like I am making a paladin, but I have a couple of questions:

First, does the following stat distribution look good for an all-round frontline support/tank:

16 Str

10 Con

10 Dex

16 Per

10 Int

16 Res

 

I didn't want to dump any stat for RP concerns.  I see many people dump Str for a full tank build, but I want to support as well, which means I need to land death blows, do some damage, and, most imporantly, heal.  Also, I left Int at 10 because I hear that the auras' AoEs are measly to begin with, and Int does little to help.  Also, these stats give me +12 in all defences.

 

Does the above look viable for what I want?

 

Second, what order is good for RP?  I am leaning towards BW because I like to play aggressive characters, but the cruely aspect turns me off a bit.  Many of the others are a bit too stoic/rational for my taste.  However, will I gimp myself in choosing BW by acting in ways contrary to the story.  I don't want to feel I need to make dumb decisions just to support my order's requirements.

 

Also, what order get the most dialogue interaction/references?  The least?

 

Any advice or comments would be appreciated.

[Exoduss]

Paladins are a bit complicated to play , to begin with get Dexterity down to 3 or 4 depends what race you can get also if you go for a dwarf you can have 2 dexterity thats amazing because dexterity does nothing for paladin , there is no discussion here stat gives you nothing , so skip it . Put those Points into Perception and Resolve having 16 is kinda mediocore because you neither get all the dialogue options neither have a proper maxed stat just not good, max those 2 ( Per and Res ) , Divide rest of your points between might con and intelect i suggest having exactly 10 con as you do now its perfect number tbh , also dont go Bleak Walker you wont like being cruel everywhere , just go Darcozzi Paladini best one imo nice skills and you can be Passionate , Clever AND Agressive ( Passionate and Clever are main which increases his strength but Darcozzi Paladin gets no penalty for being Agressive ) so basicly Passionate Clever and Agressive will make you a bad ass Roleplayable pally who can turn from Passionate into Agressive really fast , who takes no orders from any1 , and who wont be fooled by random ogre or looter .  Also if you Decide to Max Perception Int And Resolve all the way to 18 you will be able to choose more than half of dialogue choices that are just a great improvement from playing some1 with max might and dexterity ... 

Edited April 16, 2015 by Exoduss

[redneckdevil]

Bleak walkers are a lot of fun to rp. As far as aggressive and cruel, I just roleplay that that order teaches u to be in that constant state of mind to use ur pally powers and abilities to their fullest. U don't always have to pick cruel or aggressive since most responses have a neutral one as well.

The stats are very similar in what I'm using as my bw pally as main tank on normal and I'm doing fine and loving it.

[Exoduss]

When playing on hard and above there are no real secure ways to get BW talent to work ( after paladin downs an enemy .... yeh right this like never happens ! ) also i got a plan in mind to test DPS Paladin build on PotD which would concentrate on last hiting stuff so it can trigger those after paladin downs an enemy effects , would use some talents that lets you switch to guns fast and last hit something got this idea when i noticed Pallegina starting with a pistol , might be thats how you supposed to down an enemy with paladin because other ways dont really work effectively 

[MoxyWoo]

Exoduss explained most things as well as Dracozzi being one of the better of the whole bunch.  Oddly, passionate/clever tend to be more like emotional/cheeky which is very fun for me.

 

Mechanically, you want to pick the dialogue options (can be turned on to see via option menu) that are the above to gain the faith/conviction bonuses that make you an off tank that barely equals the fighter.  Additionally, Fires of the Dracozzi Palace (2nd lvl class talent) is amazing for all of act 1 and part of act 2 as you get retaliation much faster.  Optionally, I like less micro manage so used Moon God-like even though Fire can double dip via Scion of Flame for synergy, as Moon then gave you the feeling of healing via auras.

 

Fires also targets reflex which is a weak save for many monsters so can hit reliably.  That said, the base damage is always ~10 burn, so won't increase with levels, but for a talent that is good for much of the harder parts of the game to me, its a great deal.  Later on, Zealous Focus and having the inspiring exhortation for +10 acc for 20+seconds was also a great per encounter support ability.  Though once again, all of these DO NOT stack with priest spells, but DO stack with their Inspiring Radiance, so you can use Durance as a disabler rather than buffer which is pretty decent when spells do matter, so there's some flexibility to hopefully get that same feel.

 

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/77712-class-build-dracozzi-paladini-aka-the-pc-paladin/

Edited April 16, 2015 by MoxyWoo

[gkathellar]

16 Str

10 Con

10 Dex

16 Per

10 Int

16 Res

 

I didn't want to dump any stat for RP concerns.  I see many people dump Str for a full tank build, but I want to support as well, which means I need to land death blows, do some damage, and, most imporantly, heal.  Also, I left Int at 10 because I hear that the auras' AoEs are measly to begin with, and Int does little to help.  Also, these stats give me +12 in all defences.

 

Yeah, that's a solid tank spread. Personally, I'd dump Dexterity and bring up your three good stats to max, though - using Sword-and-Shield style makes up the difference in Reflex, and you'll be a better tank overall.

 

 

Second, what order is good for RP?  I am leaning towards BW because I like to play aggressive characters, but the cruely aspect turns me off a bit.  Many of the others are a bit too stoic/rational for my taste.  However, will I gimp myself in choosing BW by acting in ways contrary to the story.  I don't want to feel I need to make dumb decisions just to support my order's requirements.

 

Unfortunately, Cruel/Aggressive/Deceptive largely come down to, "I am a jerk." Stoic is basically refusing to say anything. Rational tends to be ... actual stoicism, yeah. Clever falls somewhere between, "I make jokes," and "I am abrasively tactless." Passionate translates to, "judgmental ass." Diplomatic/Honest/Benevolent are, for the most part, all the same thing.

 

None of the orders get a ton of special interaction - I'd just go with what interests you.

[Exoduss]

Moon Godlike does indeed feel very Paladin'ish my usual choice , also one of female head versions has okay~ look for a GodLike 

[Kaigen42]

Personally, I like pumping Intellect on Paladins because if you get it high enough, your aura will in fact cover your entire party (it also improves Lay on Hands and some of the Exhortations). At any rate, I'd be inclined to drop Con and Dex a little bit to get your other stats up higher. I used to be inclined to dump Might and pump Con, but after seeing how little it does for a Paladin's overall Endurance, I'd say go ahead and pump Might. Action speed isn't very useful on a Paladin either, as you'll already be swinging slowly from wearing heavy armor.

 

Options directly unlocked by your order choice are pretty few and far between. I think I remember seeing maybe 2 for Kind Wayfarers/Bleak Walkers, one of the rest. Pick whichever one fits how you want to play the character, as most of the order talents are marginal, and you want to get your Faith and Conviction bonus up quickly. It's not very hard to max out ~4 dispositions, so don't feel like you'll be limited to your favored options (though still stay away from the disfavored).

[Luckmann]

 

16 Str

10 Con

10 Dex

16 Per

10 Int

16 Res

 

I didn't want to dump any stat for RP concerns.  I see many people dump Str for a full tank build, but I want to support as well, which means I need to land death blows, do some damage, and, most imporantly, heal.  Also, I left Int at 10 because I hear that the auras' AoEs are measly to begin with, and Int does little to help.  Also, these stats give me +12 in all defences.

 

Yeah, that's a solid tank spread. Personally, I'd dump Dexterity and bring up your three good stats to max, though - using Sword-and-Shield style makes up the difference in Reflex, and you'll be a better tank overall.

 

 

Second, what order is good for RP?  I am leaning towards BW because I like to play aggressive characters, but the cruely aspect turns me off a bit.  Many of the others are a bit too stoic/rational for my taste.  However, will I gimp myself in choosing BW by acting in ways contrary to the story.  I don't want to feel I need to make dumb decisions just to support my order's requirements.

 

Unfortunately, Cruel/Aggressive/Deceptive largely come down to, "I am a jerk." Stoic is basically refusing to say anything. Rational tends to be ... actual stoicism, yeah. Clever falls somewhere between, "I make jokes," and "I am abrasively tactless." Passionate translates to, "judgmental ass." Diplomatic/Honest/Benevolent are, for the most part, all the same thing.

 

None of the orders get a ton of special interaction - I'd just go with what interests you.

 

 

The way "Cruel" is not really cruel and just kick-the-puppy evil, "Rational" is inconsistent, and "Clever" is just "dumb smartass" really annoys the hell out of me.

 

Aggressive isn't actually that bad, sometimes, but I've yet to see a Cruel alternative that wasn't just meaningless jerk-ness, I think.

 

I really liked the idea of Bleak Walkers at first, but in play.. they're really just Blackguards. They should've made them Favour Aggressive/Rational and Disfavour Diplomatic/Passionate. At least them they would've fitted the description better.

[mazeltov]

When playing on hard and above there are no real secure ways to get BW talent to work

 

Level 1 Minoletta's Minor Missiles scrolls deal 75 average damage before DR to a single target at 18-19 Might. Fast cast, and with a massive 15m range. The scroll version is significantly more powerful than the Wizard version, probably because the devs thought that was balanced by the "scarcity" of ingredients. Stag's Horn at level 3 does a nice spike of single target damage, too. Probably equivalent to an Arquebus+FoD hit/crit.

[KDubya]

I do not understand the "dex does nothing for a paladin" comments. Dex affects your action speed and thus the number of actions you can perform in a given time.

 

If 10 dex gets you 10 attacks, 3 dex gets you 7.9 attacks and an 18 dex gets you 12.4 attacks.

 

If the plan is to make a punching bag aura bot then I suppose a 3 dex is a good plan. If you are trying for the last kill type abilities a higher dex would get you more DPS which would help to get more kills.

 

For a paladin every stat has usefulness, which leads to the issue of ending up as more of a generalist in a team of specialists.

 

Also you should turn off the dialogue descriptions and just pick the response that sounds better to you rather than game the system to maximize your faith and conviction. To me the potential bonus or penalty caused by your role play decisions is the big draw for making a PC paladin at some point.

[CriticalFailure]

The way "Cruel" is not really cruel and just kick-the-puppy evil, "Rational" is inconsistent, and "Clever" is just "dumb smartass" really annoys the hell out of me.

 

Aggressive isn't actually that bad, sometimes, but I've yet to see a Cruel alternative that wasn't just meaningless jerk-ness, I think.

 

I really liked the idea of Bleak Walkers at first, but in play.. they're really just Blackguards. They should've made them Favour Aggressive/Rational and Disfavour Diplomatic/Passionate. At least them they would've fitted the description better.

I'm playing a BW, and I have to agree with this. I was hoping for ruthless and "the end justifies the means" and I just got generic baby-eating, which I don't even like when playing a proper blackguard either. Yeah, you don't HAVE to always pick the favoured options, but then the game is basically telling you that you're doing it wrong (or at least that you could do better).

 

I was also expecting some more special dialogue options related to my order, but so far I've only got one, which actually happens to make a decision about whom to ally with in a certain quest for you. All in all, the main draw the class had for me is turning out to be quite disappointing so far.

 

Funnily enough, there's an instance where slapping a maid counts as "cruel", but killing her is... nothing.

[Kaigen42]

I do not understand the "dex does nothing for a paladin" comments. Dex affects your action speed and thus the number of actions you can perform in a given time.

 

If 10 dex gets you 10 attacks, 3 dex gets you 7.9 attacks and an 18 dex gets you 12.4 attacks.

 

If the plan is to make a punching bag aura bot then I suppose a 3 dex is a good plan. If you are trying for the last kill type abilities a higher dex would get you more DPS which would help to get more kills.

 

For a paladin every stat has usefulness, which leads to the issue of ending up as more of a generalist in a team of specialists.

Which is why I think a Paladin really has to resist the urge to be a generalist and specialize if you want to get anywhere. If you want to get the support effects from killing enemies, make a light armor wearing pike wielder and go full dps stats/talents. You'll need it just to compete with the dedicated dps in your party for those kills. If you want a tanky paladin, forget about getting kills; picking up all the talents you need to be tanky means you aren't going to have any left to pick up damage or accuracy with. There are plenty of support options for the Paladin that don't involve finishing off enemies that you can capitalize on instead.

 

If you're wearing brigandine/plate, no amount of Dex is going to mitigate that 50% penalty. If you're not wearing heavy armor, what are you doing tanking?

[TomScotch]

I do not understand the "dex does nothing for a paladin" comments. Dex affects your action speed and thus the number of actions you can perform in a given time.

 

If 10 dex gets you 10 attacks, 3 dex gets you 7.9 attacks and an 18 dex gets you 12.4 attacks.

 

If the plan is to make a punching bag aura bot then I suppose a 3 dex is a good plan. If you are trying for the last kill type abilities a higher dex would get you more DPS which would help to get more kills.

 

For a paladin every stat has usefulness, which leads to the issue of ending up as more of a generalist in a team of specialists.

 

Also you should turn off the dialogue descriptions and just pick the response that sounds better to you rather than game the system to maximize your faith and conviction. To me the potential bonus or penalty caused by your role play decisions is the big draw for making a PC paladin at some point.

 

In my experience CON is unnecessary for a paladin. So long as you have access to decent healing (And with lay on hands you're already partway there), you mitigate enough damage with your high defenses to rarely be in danger of KO, even as a tank.

 

I just recently PotD with a paladin:

17 MIG

3 CON

12 DEX

14 PER

14 INT

18 RES

 

I know a lot of people will balk at setting CON to 3, but I was on the frontline and had the lowest number of knockouts in the party.

[Exoduss]

Tankier your char less con you need ,  i run my rangers and ranged rogues with 15 con because all of the stats except Might and Dex are useless to them , and they use no armor , Meanwhile my main tank paladin has 10 CoN and only advantage of this is that i dont really need to heal him ever if i went 3 con i could maybe built more might and went for some last hiting order like Wayfarers

Edited April 18, 2015 by Exoduss