Namutree Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 What do you guys feel are the worst talents? I'm thinking of Hold the Line. Screw that talent. "Good thing I don't heal my characters or they'd be really hurt." Is not something I should ever be thinking. I use blue text when I'm being sarcastic.
Sock Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Field Triage and Wound Binding. 1 use per rest? Pfft. Especially since it doesn't scale with level. I also hold no stock in any of the +defense talents, since they are a mere +10, and Superior Deflection is a mere +5. Talents are rare, I need something of constant use, or if not of constant use then of extremely high value when used.
Sensuki Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) The health healing talents were just put there to shut the people up who asked for them. Same with the XP thing - I don't think serious consideration was put into those things it was more just a "STFU HERE!" kind of thing.They sound like great talents for the very early game, but after a while I wouldn't be surprised if later game monsters are doing really high per-hit damage, so it will only add a couple of hits worth of survivability at best. I also don't agree with them being there in the first place, as it went against one of the very things they said they were not going to do right from the beginning of the Kickstarter. Kind of goes against the game lore, and trivializes the existence of the split health mechanic. Edited February 13, 2015 by Sensuki 2
Namutree Posted February 13, 2015 Author Posted February 13, 2015 The health healing talents were just put there to shut the people up who asked for them. Same with the XP thing - I don't think serious consideration was put into those things it was more just a "STFU HERE!" kind of thing. They sound like great talents for the very early game, but after a while I wouldn't be surprised if later game monsters are doing really high per-hit damage, so it will only add a couple of hits worth of survivability at best. I also don't agree with them being there in the first place, as it went against one of the very things they said they were not going to do right from the beginning of the Kickstarter. Kind of goes against the game lore, and trivializes the existence of the split health mechanic. The healing talents are meh, but not worthless. It can extend your adventuring day, but you'll be slightly less effective in an immediate battle than if you had chosen a more combat oriented talent. Field Triage and Wound Binding. 1 use per rest? Pfft. Especially since it doesn't scale with level. I also hold no stock in any of the +defense talents, since they are a mere +10, and Superior Deflection is a mere +5. Talents are rare, I need something of constant use, or if not of constant use then of extremely high value when used. Superior deflection is absolute trash. It should be +8 at least. Even then it wouldn't be good, but at least it wouldn't be horrible. "Good thing I don't heal my characters or they'd be really hurt." Is not something I should ever be thinking. I use blue text when I'm being sarcastic.
Sensuki Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Anyway here's my list Deep Pockets - who needs 6 quick slots? Haven't played the full game, but I would probably never pick it Arms Bearer - Don't really care about extra weapon sets. Two is enough. Extra ones did occasionally come in handy in the IE games but it's not something I'd waste an advancement point on. Quick Switch - haven't seen the need so far, I haven't changed weapons in combat very often, because there's no ranged weapon penalty for shooting at close range. Have never changed Grimoires in combat. (What these three talents give are not inherently bad, but I don't think they're enough to waste an advancement point on) ------------- Shot on the Run - do you move very much when you are a ranged character? Probably not. Even though I suggested the mechanic in the first place, I don't think slowing ranged recovery while moving is even needed for the game tbh. Rapid Recovery [Fighter] - +1 Endurance healed every Constant Recovery tick, couldn't care less tbh.Ancient Memory [Chanter] - on it's own (without Beloved Spirits), +0.8 Endurance per tick is kinda silly, why not just make it 1 Endurance? It's only worth picking if you're going to take Beloved Spirits I suppose (which is currently bugged anyway). Graceful Retreat - I don't like this one because I don't like the Engagement system, and I just don't move if engaged, or use an ability that breaks it if I have one. I also helped with a mod that removes engagement, so ... Mental Fortress/Body Control/Unstoppable - haven't seen the need to take these, these are bad because they give exactly the same defense as Bull's Will, Bear's Fortitude and Snake's Reflexes, except they only protect you against certain types of attacks. They do stack, which is fine, but why would you ever pick them BEFORE picking the others? Probably need a buff.Hold the Line - I only take this to abuse disengagement attacks with the Fighter, that's the only reason I take it lol. Can play around the default benefit of this talent with good positioning.Envenomed Strike - Would be better as 1/encounter. I picked it but didn't think the poison damage made it worth investing. Might be okay with a very high Might and good accuracy though.Dangerous Implement - it does give a good damage bonus, but you would be daft to take it because Wizards make a lot of implement attacks per day, and using this talent would screw their adventuring day over royally. No thanks.Vulnerable Attack/Penetrating Shot - Kind of actually have to land a hit or better for this to be worth taking, and even then, damage multipliers scale better. I need to test this further, but currently I don't think it's worth it ? Vulnerable Attack *might* be good for fast weapons though. Penetrating Shot would likely hurt ranged DPS a fair bit because ranged weapons have long enough recovery times already.Arcane Veil (and related talents) - per rest ability. Wizards are usually at the back anyway, if they're taking damage you're likely losing the encounter anyway.Aggrandizing Radiance - the self-inflicted bonuses don't last for very long There's probably more class-related talents that I think are bad too, if I see any I'll post them.
Bazy Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) General: Dangerous implement... I hate talents that make you take more damage. Let alone do damage to you. Hold the line Graceful Retreat Wound Binding Field Triage Arms Bearer Runner Quick Switch Shot on the run - you have to move to recover faster... wat? Druid: All wildstrikes - only work during short duration spiritshift Bonus spirit shift - duration far too short Wizard: Arcane Veil Grimoire slam: Cool ability, just not worth it Edited February 13, 2015 by Bazy
Bazy Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) If the talent don't give some kind of passive/modal/per encounter generally not worth it. Anything per rest is pretty laughable. Envenomed Strike is a tough call, but it got nerfed pretty bad. Edited February 13, 2015 by Bazy
Sensuki Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) Vulnerable Attack actually goes really well with Two Weapon Style and fast weapons. At least versus human enemies wearing armor. Using Stilettos, you get 8 DT bypass. That brings graze damage up to around 7 (good for a graze in v435) and hits between 13-16 damage each. It's a fairly consistent damage output, and can be used (technically) on any class. I tried it with a Fighter just then actually, and it worked well. It was also good on the Barbarian and Rogue. Edited February 13, 2015 by Sensuki
Sock Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Penetrating shot on a chanter with a hunting bow is actually pretty useful. Hunting bow is pretty quick, and Ila Nocked nulifies the penalty. The low damage of the hunting bow also comes into play with it being (basically) +5 damage per hit.
Sensuki Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Congrats, you've possibly found the only build in the game where the Hunting Bow is useful
drunetovich Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Just give arbalest to everyone, obliterate everything with opening volley, runback reloading, lol. Shot on the run is handy.
Sensuki Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) That sounds like a theory, rather than something you actually did? edit: actually in this build, Fog of War is a bit broken, so you can actually do that if the enemies don't chase (and most don't in this build) Edited February 13, 2015 by Sensuki
Clean&Clear Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Off-topic: because there's no ranged weapon penalty for shooting at close range. There definitely should be one. 1
wanderon Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Off-topic: because there's no ranged weapon penalty for shooting at close range. There definitely should be one. And then a talent to avoid it? Nomadic Wayfarer of the Obsidian Order Not all those that wander are lost...
Sensuki Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 I don't really think there needs to be one, but it would be nice if enemies changed weapons when they got into melee or something. 2
Veevoir Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Anyway here's my list Arms Bearer - Don't really care about extra weapon sets. Two is enough. Extra ones did occasionally come in handy in the IE games but it's not something I'd waste an advancement point on. Quick Switch - haven't seen the need so far, I haven't changed weapons in combat very often, because there's no ranged weapon penalty for shooting at close range. Have never changed Grimoires in combat. (What these three talents give are not inherently bad, but I don't think they're enough to waste an advancement point on) What about getting an Aumaua with arms Bearer, Quick switch and 3xArquebuses + some melee set? You'd get an automatic rifle out of the slowest weapon in game (though it would be costly). Theorycrafting here, might be this have some fatal flaw (eg. no weapon switch during recovery) 1
Veevoir Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) IT WORKS HAHAH Now imagine a party of 6 such fellows. Sure, reload times between battles will be a killer, but making a public execution out of every fight might be fun! The munchkin in me squeals with joy. Edited February 13, 2015 by Veevoir
Luckmann Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 What works? Let me guess: switching weapons to get around reload speed? Or is it just powerful, not broken?
Hiro Protagonist II Posted February 13, 2015 Posted February 13, 2015 Thanks for the update on talents to avoid. Perhaps someone can make a thread for good talents to pick. 1
SergeantHans Posted February 14, 2015 Posted February 14, 2015 Penetrating shot is not bad at all with the blunderbuss imo
Osvir Posted February 14, 2015 Posted February 14, 2015 (edited) Thanks for the update on talents to avoid. Perhaps someone can make a thread for good talents to pick. Namutree (If I'm not mistaken) made a thread called "Best talents" previously. EDIT: Here it is (on page 1 as of posting) EDIT EDIT: *facepalm* Hiro Protagonist II, on 13 Feb 2014 - 11:40 PM, said: Best Talents Started by Namutree, Today, 12:04 PM Nevermind, I'm the fool Edited February 14, 2015 by Osvir
Sensuki Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 Penetrating shot is not bad at all with the blunderbuss imo Yeah that would actually be a very good combo, especially with Lead Spitter.
Sock Posted February 15, 2015 Posted February 15, 2015 Penetrating shot is not bad at all with the blunderbuss imo Yeah that would actually be a very good combo, especially with Lead Spitter. Not really, the lead spitter already has very high penetration. It's problem is just low damage in general.
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