Sock Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 (edited) In my opinion, the skill checks for traps/scrolls are too high, requiring someone to really focus down one path in order to deal with them. For example, the chain lightning traps in the Skaen temple require 10 mechanics to disarm. In order for me to disarm them, I had to focus ONLY on mechanics, saving every skill point on level up, in order to disarm them. Practically, what this means is that mechanics will always be a mule skill, something you would likely never take on your main character unless you don't care if you miss out on conversational uses for things like lore and survival. and it also cripples your character when it comes to athletics, which has become something very useful to take to some level on all characters. Scrolls face the same problem, as their lore requirement is so high that by the time your lore is high enough to use it, you probably already have a character that has been able to cast the spell in question for three levels. What is everyone else's opinion? Edited February 7, 2015 by Sock
Bazy Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 (edited) I don't think 10 is really that high. You can get +3 from character creation By level 4 you can get it to +8 By level 5 + 9 (which you get after dealing with medrath) And supposedly there are some +2 items you can pick up. And there are conversation options for all (most?) skills and attributes. Regarding the scroll issue... It lets you cast them on classes that normally can't cast the spell. I would hope my rogue needs to be a higher level than my wizard to cast it. Edited February 7, 2015 by Bazy
Luckmann Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 You should probably have added a "No clue."-option.
Sensuki Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 (edited) As I stated a few times here and on other forums, the reason people max skills is because skill check design promotes it. Classic case right here. If the devs want us to invest in multiple skills they should design the game to support that, which isn't really the case here. Edited February 7, 2015 by Sensuki 1
Luckmann Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 (edited) Something that would alleviate this quite a bit would be if they actually allowed you to spend Skill Points on the first level. Since the cost of Skill Ranks are multiplicative by rank, lower ranks are much cheaper than higher ranks. Yes, it'd only be 6 points, but given that that is potentially 3 ranks (if placed in a single skill), I think it's a meaningful difference. As it works right now, the game is a bit schizophrenic on skills. On one hand, the skill system itself favours diversification (since lower ranks in non-prime skills are cheaper than higher ranks in your "main" skill) but on the other hand the checks themselves "in the wild" seem to favour complete specialization.They need to be looked over a bit for sure, but first stop, I'd like an "extra" levelup's worth of skill points on character creation. Edited February 7, 2015 by Luckmann
Sensuki Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 Yeah, the problem is with the ability check design. I don't think they designed any skill checks to require multiple skills either like 4 Lore, 3 Mechanics - that would have encouraged investing in split points.Sock is right about Lore and Mechanics in particular really promoting maxing them. 1
Bazy Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 Yeah, the problem is with the ability check design. I don't think they designed any skill checks to require multiple skills either like 4 Lore, 3 Mechanics - that would have encouraged investing in split points. That's a interesting idea.... I noticed on Josh's stream there was one option where it was 5 Mechanics OR 4 Mechanics and some lockpicks.
Sensuki Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 Yeah because lockpicks can make up the deficit for being short on Mechanics to unlock a chest etc
cmergler Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 Yeah because lockpicks can make up the deficit for being short on Mechanics to unlock a chest etc But only if the character is one level short.
Sock Posted February 7, 2015 Author Posted February 7, 2015 (edited) I would love a utility talent that provides +2 skill points per level (not retroactive). That would actually be something worth considering taking from the utility side. Edited February 7, 2015 by Sock
constantine Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 As I stated a few times here and on other forums, the reason people max skills is because skill check design promotes it. Classic case right here. If the devs want us to invest in multiple skills they should design the game to support that, which isn't really the case here. So let's say I want to spread out skill points to each character in 3 skills- I'm screwed ? Matilda is a Natlan woman born and raised in Old Vailia. She managed to earn status as a mercenary for being a professional who gets the job done, more so when the job involves putting her excellent fighting abilities to good use.
Sensuki Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 One thing that we haven't considered I guess is that you'll probably get items with skill bonuses and the Stronghold (if you upgrade it) will provide skill bonuses when you rest, so the checks probably are okay for the full game, dunno about scrolls though - might be a bit high.
Luckmann Posted February 7, 2015 Posted February 7, 2015 (edited) One thing that we haven't considered I guess is that you'll probably get items with skill bonuses and the Stronghold (if you upgrade it) will provide skill bonuses when you rest, so the checks probably are okay for the full game, dunno about scrolls though - might be a bit high. Yeah, honestly, it might not be that bad. With item bonuses, bonuses from resting, and mechanics being boosted by expendable lockpicks (which I have no doubt will be a simple gold tax in the end), it might just be spot on and we'd just never notice in the Backer Beta. Good point. Why do scrolls even exist? Because muh Rogue Loremaster/Archaeologist. Edited February 7, 2015 by Luckmann
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