I love this game

[Malekith]

Lephys, on 11 Dec 2014 - 03:51 AM, said:Lephys, on 11 Dec 2014 - 03:51 AM, said:

 

ctn2003, on 11 Dec 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:ctn2003, on 11 Dec 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:

All the new DA suck to me Dr3 is imp the worst out of them all it reminds me way to mutch of World of warcraft or somthing like that or some type of online MMORPG

Methinks people overly associate open-world games with MMO's. What's the difference between doing a quest in BG1, and doing a quest in DA:I? It's not isometric, and there are fewer map transitions. Seriously.

 

I'm not going to tell anyone to like DA:I, but at least dislike it accurately, please.

 

Anywho, while I think DA:I is great, in its way, I feel that PoE is also going to be quite great in different ways.

 

BG1 quests weren't the "go collect 25 wolf hides" go find 30 mushrooms for my goat to eat, which consists 3/4 of DAI quests. Though to be fair that's not only a MMO problem. I believe Bioware copied it from Assasins Creed, which is equaly shi*ty.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Malekith

[morhilane]

 

Lephys, on 11 Dec 2014 - 03:51 AM, said:Lephys, on 11 Dec 2014 - 03:51 AM, said:

 

ctn2003, on 11 Dec 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:ctn2003, on 11 Dec 2014 - 01:35 AM, said:

All the new DA suck to me Dr3 is imp the worst out of them all it reminds me way to mutch of World of warcraft or somthing like that or some type of online MMORPG

Methinks people overly associate open-world games with MMO's. What's the difference between doing a quest in BG1, and doing a quest in DA:I? It's not isometric, and there are fewer map transitions. Seriously.

 

I'm not going to tell anyone to like DA:I, but at least dislike it accurately, please.

 

Anywho, while I think DA:I is great, in its way, I feel that PoE is also going to be quite great in different ways.

 

BG1 quests weren't the "go collect 25 wolf hides" go find 30 mushrooms for my goat to eat, which consists 3/4 of DAI quests. Though to be fair that's not only a MMO problem. I believe Bioware copied it from Assasins Creed, which is equaly shi*ty.

 

 

They are actually called requisitions in DAI, not quests. They are also 100% optional, infinite and don't gives you XP, only power and a tiny bit of influence.

[Quetzalcoatl]

 

 

All the new DA suck to me Dr3 is imp the worst out of them all it reminds me way to mutch of World of warcraft or somthing like that or some type of online MMORPG

Methinks people overly associate open-world games with MMO's. What's the difference between doing a quest in BG1, and doing a quest in DA:I? It's not isometric, and there are fewer map transitions. Seriously.

 

I'm not going to tell anyone to like DA:I, but at least dislike it accurately, please.

 

Anywho, while I think DA:I is great, in its way, I feel that PoE is also going to be quite great in different ways.

 

Quests in BG1 are actually real quests where you talk to people to get it and and to turn it in and get cool conversations.

 

Yes, Baldur's Gate really set the standard with its amazingly complex quests:

 

Nessa the Cow

Candlekeep

50 ex.

• Dreppin, in the north part of Candlekeep, will ask you to get an antidote from Hull for his cow Nessa.
• Speak to Hull in front of the gates to the keep. He will tell you that you can have the antidote if you fetch his sword.
• Enter the barracks and take the antidote from the unlocked chest and give it to Drepping.

Rats in the Storehouse

Candlekeep

50 ex., 5 gold

• Reevor in front of the storehouse on the east side of Candlekeep will ask you to clean out the rats in the storehouse.
• Enter the storehouse and kill all the rats. Speak to Reevor again for your reward.

Phlydia's Book

Candlekeep

50 ex., Lynx Eye Gem

• Phlydia in the top left corner of Candlekeep will ask you to find her book.
• Just to the east, Dreppin will tell you that her book is in the hay behind him.
• Find Phlydia's book in the hay and return it to her.

Crossbow Bolts

Candlekeep

50 ex., 10 gold

• Fuller in the barracks in Candlekeep will ask you to buy some crossbow bolts for him.
• Buy some bolts from Winthrop in the Inn and give them to Fuller to get a reward.

Hull's Sword

Candlekeep

50 ex., 10 gold

• Speak to Hull in front of the gates and he will ask you to fetch his sword for him.
• Enter the barracks and take Hull's sword from the unlocked chest and return it to him for a reward.

Firebead's scroll

Candlekeep

50 ex., Potion of Healing

• Firebead Elvenhair in the inn in Candlekeep will request that you retreive his Identify scroll from Tethtoril.
• You will find Tethtoril walking around the library. He will give you the scroll.
• Return the scroll to Firebead and he will give you a potion of healing.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Quetzalcoatl

[Osvir]

@Quetzalcoatl: Uhm, I think those are just tutorial Quests.... in the first area when you spawn. There's tons of more quests in Baldur's Gate, but I think the main questline stands on its own. The side-quests aren't very exciting~ but it's what you do with it, how you immerse yourself and how you play and experience the games with your character(s).

ALL quests in ALL RPG's or other titles are essentially "Fetch this" in one way or another, it's how the game executes it that matters, and how you tackle/execute the obstacles. Mostly, in all games, you are repetetively clicking a single button over and over, dealing with different types of enemies the same way over and over.

Thus far, in the Backer Beta of PoE, the quests are the same as any other quests. I think they are a bit more interesting and fun though, intruiging. I want to know who House Deomel are, for instance, or what happens to Nyfre if you let her escape/save her, or what happens to Lord Harond and Lady Aelys afterwards, and so on and so forth and so on.

[archangel979]

 

 

 

All the new DA suck to me Dr3 is imp the worst out of them all it reminds me way to mutch of World of warcraft or somthing like that or some type of online MMORPG

Methinks people overly associate open-world games with MMO's. What's the difference between doing a quest in BG1, and doing a quest in DA:I? It's not isometric, and there are fewer map transitions. Seriously.

 

I'm not going to tell anyone to like DA:I, but at least dislike it accurately, please.

 

Anywho, while I think DA:I is great, in its way, I feel that PoE is also going to be quite great in different ways.

 

Quests in BG1 are actually real quests where you talk to people to get it and and to turn it in and get cool conversations.

 

Yes, Baldur's Gate really set the standard with its amazingly complex quests:

 

Nessa the Cow

Candlekeep

50 ex.

• Dreppin, in the north part of Candlekeep, will ask you to get an antidote from Hull for his cow Nessa.
• Speak to Hull in front of the gates to the keep. He will tell you that you can have the antidote if you fetch his sword.
• Enter the barracks and take the antidote from the unlocked chest and give it to Drepping.

Rats in the Storehouse

Candlekeep

50 ex., 5 gold

• Reevor in front of the storehouse on the east side of Candlekeep will ask you to clean out the rats in the storehouse.
• Enter the storehouse and kill all the rats. Speak to Reevor again for your reward.

Phlydia's Book

Candlekeep

50 ex., Lynx Eye Gem

• Phlydia in the top left corner of Candlekeep will ask you to find her book.
• Just to the east, Dreppin will tell you that her book is in the hay behind him.
• Find Phlydia's book in the hay and return it to her.

Crossbow Bolts

Candlekeep

50 ex., 10 gold

• Fuller in the barracks in Candlekeep will ask you to buy some crossbow bolts for him.
• Buy some bolts from Winthrop in the Inn and give them to Fuller to get a reward.

Hull's Sword

Candlekeep

50 ex., 10 gold

• Speak to Hull in front of the gates and he will ask you to fetch his sword for him.
• Enter the barracks and take Hull's sword from the unlocked chest and return it to him for a reward.

Firebead's scroll

Candlekeep

50 ex., Potion of Healing

• Firebead Elvenhair in the inn in Candlekeep will request that you retreive his Identify scroll from Tethtoril.
• You will find Tethtoril walking around the library. He will give you the scroll.
• Return the scroll to Firebead and he will give you a potion of healing.

You are trying so hard to appear like you know what you are talking about and still failing so hard. Please stop, it is not working. You are just embarrassing yourself. Edited December 11, 2014 by archangel979

[Quetzalcoatl]

You are trying so hard to appear like you know what you are talking about and still failing so hard. Please stop, it is not working. You are just embarrassing yourself.

 

Then I assume you agree with me? Otherwise you would've mentioned arguments to the contrary rather than personally attacking me.

 

It's not exactly a secret that the quests of the first Baldur's Gate weren't much to write home about. Though I guess you might think otherwise if you count characters like Minsc among the best written RPG characters.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Quetzalcoatl

[Osvir]

You are trying so hard to appear like you know what you are talking about and still failing so hard. Please stop, it is not working. You are just embarrassing yourself.

And you are....! *shrug* what I'm trying to say is that your post isn't rebutting anything, but rather simply tries to take a stance and gain authority/power in the debate/discussion by nonchalantly neglecting whatever he was saying. You don't address anything he is saying in his post. A.k.a. s.h.i.t-posting.

 

I think the point Quetzalcoatl is saying is that MANY if not ALL quests in Baldur's Gate are fetch quests. The dialogue, narrative can be everything from mediocre to good, to fun, such as the saving Dynaheir quest with Minsc (for instance). Baldur's Gate is one of my favorite games/cRPG's, but that doesn't mean that I think everything in it was "perfect" or "awesome". Critically looking at it, many quests aren't very exciting in their own, but depending on whatever character you have chosen to immerse yourself with in the game, a mediocre "Get this bottle from the neighbour" can become the best Quest in the world. Granted, that you're roleplaying and/or enjoying the game a lot as a whole.

 

But I understand your point as well, you have to seek out the quests, you have to talk to people, you have to look into your journal from time to time to figure stuff out, use your eyes and brains. In newer games there's either an arrow pointing you to where you need to go, or the minimap shows you an "!" where there are quests, or you can see, in-game, on-screen, characters with a yellow and big "!" that could've just as well have been an Azura's Wrath Buddha finger, pointing at the character that has the quest:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Haha! That'd be hilarious though, imagine if playing DA:I or WoW, and in the horizon, in the skyline and out of space, you see hands and fingers pointing down where all the quests are haha "HERE! GO HERE!" xD

Edited December 11, 2014 by Osvir

[archangel979]

There was nothing to address in his post except his desperation to prove he is right and fallen so low to list ONLY tutorial quests that are made to be as simple as possible. Any intelligent person understands that.

Until he actually has something to show except embarrass himself I don't see a point in debating this with him. He has proven nothing.

[GrinningReaper659]

 

 

 

All the new DA suck to me Dr3 is imp the worst out of them all it reminds me way to mutch of World of warcraft or somthing like that or some type of online MMORPG

Methinks people overly associate open-world games with MMO's. What's the difference between doing a quest in BG1, and doing a quest in DA:I? It's not isometric, and there are fewer map transitions. Seriously.

 

I'm not going to tell anyone to like DA:I, but at least dislike it accurately, please.

 

Anywho, while I think DA:I is great, in its way, I feel that PoE is also going to be quite great in different ways.

 

Quests in BG1 are actually real quests where you talk to people to get it and and to turn it in and get cool conversations.

 

Yes, Baldur's Gate really set the standard with its amazingly complex quests:

 

Nessa the Cow

Candlekeep

50 ex.

• Dreppin, in the north part of Candlekeep, will ask you to get an antidote from Hull for his cow Nessa.
• Speak to Hull in front of the gates to the keep. He will tell you that you can have the antidote if you fetch his sword.
• Enter the barracks and take the antidote from the unlocked chest and give it to Drepping.

Rats in the Storehouse

Candlekeep

50 ex., 5 gold

• Reevor in front of the storehouse on the east side of Candlekeep will ask you to clean out the rats in the storehouse.
• Enter the storehouse and kill all the rats. Speak to Reevor again for your reward.

Phlydia's Book

Candlekeep

50 ex., Lynx Eye Gem

• Phlydia in the top left corner of Candlekeep will ask you to find her book.
• Just to the east, Dreppin will tell you that her book is in the hay behind him.
• Find Phlydia's book in the hay and return it to her.

Crossbow Bolts

Candlekeep

50 ex., 10 gold

• Fuller in the barracks in Candlekeep will ask you to buy some crossbow bolts for him.
• Buy some bolts from Winthrop in the Inn and give them to Fuller to get a reward.

Hull's Sword

Candlekeep

50 ex., 10 gold

• Speak to Hull in front of the gates and he will ask you to fetch his sword for him.
• Enter the barracks and take Hull's sword from the unlocked chest and return it to him for a reward.

Firebead's scroll

Candlekeep

50 ex., Potion of Healing

• Firebead Elvenhair in the inn in Candlekeep will request that you retreive his Identify scroll from Tethtoril.
• You will find Tethtoril walking around the library. He will give you the scroll.
• Return the scroll to Firebead and he will give you a potion of healing.

 

 

You may be right about BG1 not having groundbreakingly deep, complex, or fun quests (I'm not commenting one way or another on that), but this argument you've presented is terrible. You listed the quests of the tutorial area. Candlekeep is an actual tutorial, with actual 'tutors' scattered about to teach the player how to play the game. The complexity of the quests in the tutorial area doesn't really matter much, they displayed the basics of how to communicate with NPCs, buy things at the store, engage in combat, etc.

 

As for the quality of companions in BG, yeah they were mostly caricatures to an extent, but who cares? I don't understand the snobbish hatred against levity and fun that can come from things such as one-dimensional, boisterous caricatures like Minsc. Computer games don't have to be all art and no entertainment and, in fact, art can be entertaining; I just don't see why it's so important that light-heartedness be crushed in order for some people to convince themselves that they're doing something worthwhile. Yeah, BG characters were simple and flat, yes there were fetch quests, but playing BG (and BG2) has provided me with who knows how many hours of fulfilling fun. Maybe the New Vegas or MoTB characters and writing were out of this world and deep and artistic, but the former uses what is essentially a first person shooter engine and the latter suffers from NWN2's terrible camera, etc. so I may never play either one. The BG games were fun and had solid gameplay that I (and apparently many others) did not find tiring.

 

All that being said, I'm really enjoying what I've seen so far of the writing in the BB and I'm looking forward to the mature writing and the complex companions in the final game, I'm just not sure that all the disdain for the simpler or lighter pleasures going on ITT is merited.

[Quetzalcoatl]

As for the quality of companions in BG, yeah they were mostly caricatures to an extent, but who cares? I don't understand the snobbish hatred against levity and fun

When did I imply such a thing? The problem is that I didn't find the supposedly funny BG companions funny, but obnoxious and annoying.

 

 

There was nothing to address in his post except his desperation to prove he is right and fallen so low to list ONLY tutorial quests that are made to be as simple as possible. Any intelligent person understands that.

Until he actually has something to show except embarrass himself I don't see a point in debating this with him. He has proven nothing.

I just copied the first few quests I could find (they were listed in order of when you encountered them), but I can list quests from other parts of the game if you like:

 

Zombie Hunting

North of Wyrm's Crossing

800 ex, 150 gold

 

• Speak to Wenric in front of the house in the area north of Wyrm's Crossing. He will offer you 150 gold to kill 20 zombies.
• Explore the area and kill 20 zombies. Return to Wenric for your reward.

 

The Mountain Bear

North of Gnoll Stronghold

150 ex, Boots of the North

 

• In the southeast corner of the area north of the Gnoll Stronghold, Jared will beg you to fight the mountain bear that's coming after him.
• Cross the bridge and defeat the mountain bear. Return to Jared and if your charisma is high enough, he will give you some special boots.

 

Angel the Cat

North Baldur's Gate

500 ex

 

• Speak to Petrine, an orphan standing outside her uncle Bheren's house in North Baldur's Gate. She will tell you that her cat has gone back to her uncle's house and she will ask you to get the cat's ring for her.
• Enter Bheren's house and you will find Angel upstairs. Take the Angel Skin Ring from the chest and give it to Petrine.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Quetzalcoatl

[Osvir]

You may be right about BG1 not having groundbreakingly deep, complex, or fun quests (I'm not commenting one way or another on that), but this argument you've presented is terrible. You listed the quests of the tutorial area. Candlekeep is an actual tutorial, with actual 'tutors' scattered about to teach the player how to play the game. The complexity of the quests in the tutorial area doesn't really matter much, they displayed the basics of how to communicate with NPCs, buy things at the store, engage in combat, etc.

 

As for the quality of companions in BG, yeah they were mostly caricatures to an extent, but who cares? I don't understand the snobbish hatred against levity and fun that can come from things such as one-dimensional, boisterous caricatures like Minsc. Computer games don't have to be all art and no entertainment and, in fact, art can be entertaining; I just don't see why it's so important that light-heartedness be crushed in order for some people to convince themselves that they're doing something worthwhile. Yeah, BG characters were simple and flat, yes there were fetch quests, but playing BG (and BG2) has provided me with who knows how many hours of fulfilling fun. Maybe the New Vegas or MoTB characters and writing were out of this world and deep and artistic, but the former uses what is essentially a first person shooter engine and the latter suffers from NWN2's terrible camera, etc. so I may never play either one. The BG games were fun and had solid gameplay that I (and apparently many others) did not find tiring.

 

All that being said, I'm really enjoying what I've seen so far of the writing in the BB and I'm looking forward to the mature writing and the complex companions in the final game, I'm just not sure that all the disdain for the simpler or lighter pleasures going on ITT is merited.

Most excellent GrinningReaper great post! I don't have anything further to add myself, it's like everything I've ever wanted to say!

 

The disdain can be easily explained as PPM's I think, "Public Private Messages". Stuff that should go in Private Messages, spills out as Public Messages.

[Quetzalcoatl]

 Accidentally double-posted. Mods, delete this post or the previous post.

 

As for the quality of companions in BG, yeah they were mostly caricatures to an extent, but who cares? I don't understand the snobbish hatred against levity and fun

When did I imply such a thing? The problem is that I didn't find the supposedly funny BG companions funny, but obnoxious and annoying.

 

 

There was nothing to address in his post except his desperation to prove he is right and fallen so low to list ONLY tutorial quests that are made to be as simple as possible. Any intelligent person understands that.
Until he actually has something to show except embarrass himself I don't see a point in debating this with him. He has proven nothing.

I just copied the first few quests I could find (they were listed in order of when you encountered them), but I can list quests from other parts of the game if you like:

 

Zombie Hunting
North of Wyrm's Crossing
800 ex, 150 gold

 

• Speak to Wenric in front of the house in the area north of Wyrm's Crossing. He will offer you 150 gold to kill 20 zombies.
• Explore the area and kill 20 zombies. Return to Wenric for your reward.

 

The Mountain Bear
North of Gnoll Stronghold
150 ex, Boots of the North

 

• In the southeast corner of the area north of the Gnoll Stronghold, Jared will beg you to fight the mountain bear that's coming after him.
• Cross the bridge and defeat the mountain bear. Return to Jared and if your charisma is high enough, he will give you some special boots.

 

Angel the Cat
North Baldur's Gate
500 ex

 

• Speak to Petrine, an orphan standing outside her uncle Bheren's house in North Baldur's Gate. She will tell you that her cat has gone back to her uncle's house and she will ask you to get the cat's ring for her.
• Enter Bheren's house and you will find Angel upstairs. Take the Angel Skin Ring from the chest and give it to Petrine.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Quetzalcoatl

[archangel979]

You found 3 quests that are direct fetch quests (and there are many more in BG1 although they don't always feel like it). Congrats. And you found probably the only kill X enemies quest with that zombie quest which is pretty out of the way.

 

Nobody said BG1 didn't have fetch quests, we said you talked to people to get it, done it and talked to them again to finish it. There was always a conversation and often it was interesting or funny or cute.

DAI is full of get quest (or find letter) do quest and BING, quest finished! No talk, no closure, no effort from writing team.

Skyrim wasn't much better but in another way. It forced you to walk all the way to another part of the real to finish that stupid fetch quest. Complete waste of time.

 

BG1 also often had you find quest items and then needing to find what to do with them. There was not automatically complete or quest markers to guide you like an idiot.

Edited December 11, 2014 by archangel979

[Quetzalcoatl]

There was always a conversation and often it was interesting or funny or cute.

It was none of those things. BG1's writing wasn't particularly good.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Quetzalcoatl

[archangel979]

 

There was always a conversation and often it was interesting or funny or cute.

It was none of those things. BG1's writing wasn't particularly good.

 

Says you. Millions of fans enjoyed BG1. The biggest complaint about BG1 were its companions and how they didn't have quests or romancing options.

You can came up with crap now but it is just that.

Edited December 11, 2014 by archangel979

[Quetzalcoatl]

 

 

There was always a conversation and often it was interesting or funny or cute.

It was none of those things. BG1's writing wasn't particularly good.

 

Says you. Millions of fans enjoyed BG1.

Pointing out that something is popular is usually an argument AGAINST why something is qualitatively good. You might as well claim that a shallow action RPG is better than the Infinity Engine games because it sold more.

Edited December 11, 2014 by Quetzalcoatl

[ctn2003]

 

You are trying so hard to appear like you know what you are talking about and still failing so hard. Please stop, it is not working. You are just embarrassing yourself.

And you are....! *shrug* what I'm trying to say is that your post isn't rebutting anything, but rather simply tries to take a stance and gain authority/power in the debate/discussion by nonchalantly neglecting whatever he was saying. You don't address anything he is saying in his post. A.k.a. s.h.i.t-posting.

 

I think the point Quetzalcoatl is saying is that MANY if not ALL quests in Baldur's Gate are fetch quests. The dialogue, narrative can be everything from mediocre to good, to fun, such as the saving Dynaheir quest with Minsc (for instance). Baldur's Gate is one of my favorite games/cRPG's, but that doesn't mean that I think everything in it was "perfect" or "awesome". Critically looking at it, many quests aren't very exciting in their own, but depending on whatever character you have chosen to immerse yourself with in the game, a mediocre "Get this bottle from the neighbour" can become the best Quest in the world. Granted, that you're roleplaying and/or enjoying the game a lot as a whole.

 

But I understand your point as well, you have to seek out the quests, you have to talk to people, you have to look into your journal from time to time to figure stuff out, use your eyes and brains. In newer games there's either an arrow pointing you to where you need to go, or the minimap shows you an "!" where there are quests, or you can see, in-game, on-screen, characters with a yellow and big "!" that could've just as well have been an Azura's Wrath Buddha finger, pointing at the character that has the quest:

 

 

 

 

 

 

Haha! That'd be hilarious though, imagine if playing DA:I or WoW, and in the horizon, in the skyline and out of space, you see hands and fingers pointing down where all the quests are haha "HERE! GO HERE!" xD

 

Macro Furry?

[archangel979]

 

 

 

There was always a conversation and often it was interesting or funny or cute.

It was none of those things. BG1's writing wasn't particularly good.

 

Says you. Millions of fans enjoyed BG1.

 

Pointing out that something is popular is usually an argument AGAINST why something is qualitatively good. You might as well claim that a shallow action RPG is better than the Infinity Engine games because it sold more.

 

Why are you on this forum? Seriously.

Don't you have another place you like more? Like bioware forums?

Edited December 11, 2014 by archangel979

[Malekith]

archangel979, on 11 Dec 2014 - 9:32 PM, said:

 

Quetzalcoatl, on 11 Dec 2014 - 5:38 PM, said:

 

archangel979, on 11 Dec 2014 - 5:26 PM, said:

 

Quetzalcoatl, on 11 Dec 2014 - 4:40 PM, said:

 

archangel979, on 11 Dec 2014 - 4:35 PM, said:

There was always a conversation and often it was interesting or funny or cute.

It was none of those things. BG1's writing wasn't particularly good.

 

Says you. Millions of fans enjoyed BG1.

 

Pointing out that something is popular is usually an argument AGAINST why something is qualitatively good. You might as well claim that a shallow action RPG is better than the Infinity Engine games because it sold more.

 

Why are you on this forum? Seriously.

Don't you have another place you like more? Like bioware forums?

 

To be fair, BG1 writing WAS mediocre, and while BG2 was much better in that aspect it wasn't truly great writen. The praise Bioware got for romance options and fleshed out characters instead of the things that they truly did good (great gameplay, great encounter design and briliand itemisation) is what lead us in the current Bioware.

[Lephys]

I apologize for contributing to the derailment of this thread. I was simply stumped by the seeming inaccuracies being brought up in order to bash DA:I, as I'm playing through the game right now and haven't had any of the problems that have been mentioned in this thread (I think I've done like... 3 actual fetch quests, maybe? etc.) It's kinda like if someone says "I don't like this food, 'cause there's way too much pepper in it," when there isn't any pepper in it. Maybe you don't like the food, and that's fine, but it isn't because there's too much pepper in it.

 

Anywho. My bad. We can take the DA:I discussion to a different thread that probably already exists.

[archangel979]

BG1 writing was not mediocre. Companions didn't have quests and there were no twists every few steps but Sarevok and the main quest were very well done. Each of the characters had a purpose and its purpose was explained.

The game didn't need conflicted bad guys at each turn (what is considered to be "good writing" today). It didn't need complex high court dealings, it was never meant to be Game of Thrones. It was a game where adventurers stop evil plan and find out about their destiny through very fun and challenging gameplay.

And there were so many NPCs you would run into that didn't have a quest attached but you would have good and quality short conversations with. Smaller side quests made sense and were often nicely written (the dwarf that wants his cloak back but once you give it to him he does not want it anymore because he has become a tourist attraction by now was funny; the rogue that takes your money and if you get him his boots back he rewards you with your money and some change :D; and these were the simplest ones).

Edited December 12, 2014 by archangel979

[Malekith]

archangel979, on 12 Dec 2014 - 02:11 AM, said:archangel979, on 12 Dec 2014 - 02:11 AM, said:

BG1 writing was not mediocre. Companions didn't have quests and there were no twists every few steps but Sarevok and the main quest were very well done. Each of the characters had a purpose and its purpose was explained.

The game didn't need conflicted bad guys at each turn (what is considered to be "good writing" today). It didn't need complex high court dealings, it was never meant to be Game of Thrones. It was a game where adventurers stop evil plan and find out about their destiny through very fun and challenging gameplay.

And there were so many NPCs you would run into that didn't have a quest attached but you would have good and quality short conversations with. Smaller side quests made sense and were often nicely written (the dwarf that wants his cloak back but once you give it to him he does not want it anymore because he has become a tourist attraction by now was funny; the rogue that takes your money and if you get him his boots back he rewards you with your money and some change :D; and these were the simplest ones).

We'll agree to disagree then. Such is life.

For the record i agree with everything you wrote exept that all these make the writing simply mediocre. Mediocre isn't bad, just not very good. Something that's is competently writen (but no exceptional prose), with a straightforward story without plotholes and characters that are simple and funny caricatures (no complex characters with personalities that feal real), a MUHAHAHA poweranger villain etc. are the definition of mediocre for me.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Malekith

[archangel979]

Sarevok was anything but a power rangers villain (ok, he seems like one when he kills Gorion). Go through the story again, his plan was more complex than Irenicus plan. Certainly more complex that modern Bioware villains (Archdemon, Reapers and so on). Overall, he is second most interesting Bioware villain after Irenicus.

And many characters felt real in BG1, they just didn't open up to you all the time (which I find stupid in many games or movies; people don't open up, they do the job they were assigned to do). Those that did like Sarevok's girl are obviously more complex than just being his sidekick. BG1 didn't have forced expositions just for the sake of having "more complex" characters.

 

When Nimbul says "Why they would send someone like me to deal with someone like you, I will never know" is enough information about this guy that showed up to kill me. I don't need to know why he became the assassin and that if I leave him alive I can redeem him.

Edited December 12, 2014 by archangel979

[Malekith]

archangel979, on 12 Dec 2014 - 02:25 AM, said:archangel979, on 12 Dec 2014 - 02:25 AM, said:

Sarevok was anything but a power rangers villain (ok, he seems like one when he kills Gorion). Go through the story again, his plan was more complex than Irenicus plan. Certainly more complex that modern Bioware villains (Archdemon, Reapers and so on). Overall, he is second most interesting Bioware villain after Irenicus.

Modern Bioware villains are outright bad so saying Sarevok is better than them doesn't say much. No one disagrees with that.

archangel979, on 12 Dec 2014 - 02:25 AM, said:

And many characters felt real in BG1, they just didn't open up to you all the time (which I find stupid in many games or movies; people don't open up, they do the job they were assigned to do). Those that did like Sarevok's girl are obviously more complex than just being his sidekick. BG1 didn't have forced expositions just for the sake of having "more complex" characters.

 

When Nimbul says "Why they would send someone like me to deal with someone like you, I will never know" is enough information about this guy that showed up to kill me. I don't need to know why he became the assassin and that if I leave him alive I can redeem him.

And Nimbul dialogue is an example for good writing to you? What exactly was good in that?

If BG1 plot and characters appeared in a novel, everyone and their cat would bash them as one dimentional and carricatures.  I don't apply different standards to games as far as story and characters go.

Dialogue and presentation need to be different in games, but good writing is good writing. Most games have **** writing. Some of them choose to don't focus on story and writing, so their **** writing doesn't get in your face. Some others do so.

 

BG1 characters were character sheets with one liners. To say that it was intentional because "people don't open up, they do the job they were assigned to do" (that's bullsh*t btw, my job involves meeting new people on a daily basis and most people can't shut up, i know more things about my clients daddy issues and lives than i would care, and talking to your average teenage girl feels very closely to flirting with your Bioware waifu. When people are forced to spent time together, they talk to each other. It doesn't matter if what they tell isn't their life story or even lies, but they talk) makes your characters bland intentionaly because writing wasn't something you chose to focus on. What it doesn't make it is good writing.

Edited December 12, 2014 by Malekith

[Sedrefilos]

One enters the thread to read about things people are excited about this game and istead finds posts about the writing quality of Baldur's Gate 1.

Maybe this conversation is to be continued in another forum, like 1 BG1 forum, or maybe start a personal conversation?

Because, you know... it's off-topic and fills up the thread with arguements people are not interested in since this in not a BG forum.