A question for developers on combat experience

[edtate]

Let me start by saying that I have read many forum topics on this subject and am aware that there are other related threads. I wasn't able to find a good argument for the inclusion of combat experience however, simply many people trying to defend this design decision. I was an avid fan of the Baldur's Gate series and for this reason I must express my disdain at this decision as I believe it will remove the way that I enjoyed playing Baldur's Gate.

 

In BG I and II, experience can be earned through killing monsters and NPCs. This means you can venture to areas which are of a high level of difficulty and earn a high level of reward, solely for your ability to kill mobs of monsters. This required searching for canny strategies (Basilisks in BG I for example with scrolls of immunity to petrification) and encouraged players to try out a diverse set of characters, spells and skill combinations. Of course, this does not mean that you must skip the storyline, it simply means that you can challenge yourself _for a reason_ other than following a particular quest line.

 

This particular feature encouraged me to solo the game in BG I and II once I had completed it following the storyline. The reason why this topic has been so hotly debated in my opinion is, aside from the fact that it is a major change from the original Baldurs Gate series is that removing this element from the game removes one of the basic ways of playing the game.

 

Wasteland 2 goes a step further in depth in the sense that not only do mobs earn experience but killing NPCs earns you experience and changes the plot line. It is much harder of course to implement a game which allows for this level of freedom. In Baldur's Gate this was never the case. You could kill Shandalar, Drizzt or Elminster without dire repercussions. It did however take ingenuity to do it.

 

Having played PoE, the first thing I did was to launch all of my party members except my main character into combat with the poor folk over at Dryford. It took a long time but I successfully managed to rid myself of the NPCs by killing them. Then I proceeded, with my solo monk, to explore the surrounding areas and to follow the main plotline. Without earning experience from combat however, it all felt rather pointless. 

 

My question is this: Will PoE genuinely not have experience earned through killing mobs upon release (I have not seen developer feedback on the matter)? And if this is the case, how are you planning on catering for those of us who thoroughly enjoyed playing the original BG series in this way? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[PrimeJunta]

[Namutree]

Let me start by saying that I have read many forum topics on this subject and am aware that there are other related threads. I wasn't able to find a good argument for the inclusion of combat experience however, simply many people trying to defend this design decision. I was an avid fan of the Baldur's Gate series and for this reason I must express my disdain at this decision as I believe it will remove the way that I enjoyed playing Baldur's Gate.

 

In BG I and II, experience can be earned through killing monsters and NPCs. This means you can venture to areas which are of a high level of difficulty and earn a high level of reward, solely for your ability to kill mobs of monsters. This required searching for canny strategies (Basilisks in BG I for example with scrolls of immunity to petrification) and encouraged players to try out a diverse set of characters, spells and skill combinations. Of course, this does not mean that you must skip the storyline, it simply means that you can challenge yourself _for a reason_ other than following a particular quest line.

 

This particular feature encouraged me to solo the game in BG I and II once I had completed it following the storyline. The reason why this topic has been so hotly debated in my opinion is, aside from the fact that it is a major change from the original Baldurs Gate series is that removing this element from the game removes one of the basic ways of playing the game.

 

Wasteland 2 goes a step further in depth in the sense that not only do mobs earn experience but killing NPCs earns you experience and changes the plot line. It is much harder of course to implement a game which allows for this level of freedom. In Baldur's Gate this was never the case. You could kill Shandalar, Drizzt or Elminster without dire repercussions. It did however take ingenuity to do it.

 

Having played PoE, the first thing I did was to launch all of my party members except my main character into combat with the poor folk over at Dryford. It took a long time but I successfully managed to rid myself of the NPCs by killing them. Then I proceeded, with my solo monk, to explore the surrounding areas and to follow the main plotline. Without earning experience from combat however, it all felt rather pointless. 

 

My question is this: Will PoE genuinely not have experience earned through killing mobs upon release (I have not seen developer feedback on the matter)? And if this is the case, how are you planning on catering for those of us who thoroughly enjoyed playing the original BG series in this way? 

THERE WILL BE NO COMBAT XP!!! NONE EVER!!! KILL STUFF? WHO CARES? NO XP FOR DAT! WANT XP? DO A QUEST! WANT TO EXPLORE AND STILL PROGRESS? TOO BAD! DO A QUEST! THIS AIN'T NO BALDUR'S GATE! THIS BE PILLARS OF ETERNITY! IN THIS GAME, QUESTS ARE GOD! DON'T BE SAD THOUGH! YOU'LL GET STRING AND FUR FOR DA KILLS! DEY WORTH LIKE, 15 MONEYS! CAMPING SUPPLIES COST 300 MONEYS! ENJOY!

 

MAYBE DISCOVERY XP WILL SAVE DA DAY! LETS JUST HOPE QUEST XP GOD BLESSES US ADVENTURERS WITH XP FOR ADVENTURING! IF NOT JUST ROLE-PLAY A SERVANT AND ALL WILL BE GOOD!

[Marceror]

LOL, hey OP, we've had this topic many, many times, and very recently in fact, so don't be surprised if you some less than supportive responses.

[Namutree]

LOL, hey OP, we've had this topic many, many times, and very recently in fact, so don't be surprised if you some less than supportive responses.

DON'T BE PESSIMISTIC!!! SOON STUN AND DA WHOLE CREW WILL BE HERE! LET THE NEVER ENDING ARGUING BEGINS!!! WE NEEDS 30 MORE COMBAT XP THREADS! THERE WILL NEVER BE ENOUGH COMBAT XP THREADS!!!

[morhilane]

 

It should be an undead horse by now...

 

There is something interesting in the OP though. He's saying that he played BG 1 solo to get has much XP has possible, yet unless you are using an XP uncapper, you reach max level fast and stop gaining XP doing it that way.

[Namutree]

 

 

It should be an undead horse by now...

 

 

NOPE, IT AIN'T UNDEADS!!! IT'S DEADER THEN THAT!!! IT SO DEAD; IT'S UNUNUNUNUNUNDEAD!!! IT BE CHILLIN' WITH THE UNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNUNDEAD ROMANCE FEATURE!!!

[Marceror]

Love the caps lock (okay, not really)

[Namutree]

Love the caps lock (okay, not really)

I'm bored with it now. No more cap locks.

 

For the OP: There will not be any kill-xp. There may be better loot to find though. Also, there might be more quests per area. I'm still hoping that Obsidian will introduce discovery-xp.

 

When I say discovery-xp; I am referring to the idea that when the players finds a special area (like a dungeon) the game will award the player a small amount of xp. 100-xp seems fair. They might want to make the xp reward worth more/less depending on how dangerous the given map is.

[PrimeHydra]

edtate: You're not alone. I've having a hard time sticking with the beta simply because striking out to explore and fight baddies is unrewarding.

 

Don't mind the users who troll you for daring to create a new post on this hotly-debated topic--without bothering to point you to the current XP thread.

Edited September 13, 2014 by PrimeHydra

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

 

 

It should be an undead horse by now...

 

There is something interesting in the OP though. He's saying that he played BG 1 solo to get has much XP has possible, yet unless you are using an XP uncapper, you reach max level fast and stop gaining XP doing it that way.

1. I thought using uncapped XP was standard in most non-vanilla installations of BG?

 

2. At this point, the horse has been killed, raised as undead, had its negative energy purged, remains devowered by a pack of worgs, pooped out by the worgs, transformed into a poop monster by magic, been destroyed, and is now being torn apart at the atomic level.

Edited September 13, 2014 by KaineParker

[Roarkkk]

Lets hope this can be added using modsss.

Pretty much no incentive for exploring otherwise. it's like removing one (of the many) ways you can play a crpg.

Edited September 13, 2014 by Roarkkk

[Matt516]

*refreshes forum*

 

"Is the top post... really?"

 

*checks watch*

 

"Yup, it's combat XP o'clock again..."

[Seari]

I want combat xp, nao!

[Marceror]

*refreshes forum*

 

"Is the top post... really?"

 

*checks watch*

 

"Yup, it's combat XP o'clock again..."

I still want combat xp for significant battles, but I'm pretty much over talking about it too.

[Pray]

Just my 2 cents, i'm personally in favor of a diminshing returns for exp. First kill is 100%, second is 50%, 3rd is 25%, 4th is 12.5, 5th is 6.25, 7th is etc etc etc down to the limit of x-> 0.

[GreyFox]

It's not surprising there are more and more threads on this...unless the game ships with a sticker that says NO COMBAT XP....then people are going to be looking for it and then complaining about it when they find out there isn't any.

 

Perfectly reasonable and natural TBH.

[Marceror]

It's a fairly notable change from the IE games, so yeah, only expect that the buzz about this will increase as the release date gets closer, and more people become aware of it.