Russia passes more homophobia laws

[Cultist]

Agreed, I doubt anyone would intentionally make themselves  sound so ignorant and bigoted to ask a question "why care about equality and human rights in other parts of the world"

 

@ Cultist

 

The Russian government does care. They don't like negative publicity as they are trying to position Russia as a viable destination for many international events. They have also stated that there will be no discrimination against any gay athletes.

you are just too accustomed that everyone around you is a tolerant and all-caring.

 

As for government - China purged ****load of mislim Uyghurs during their 2009 uprising. There was an outrage, a lot of "how could they!" "everyone should sever all diplomatic ties with China!" and similar naive statements. In the end, China ignored all complaints and accusations. Nobody cares, no one cancelled any important business contracts and China is as appealing to investment as before.

But you can stick with that belief that "likes", meetings and declarations of support can change anything.

[Amentep]

But you can stick with that belief that "likes", meetings and declarations of support can change anything.

There should be an internet petition in there, full of nicknames, just for good measure.

[Malcador]

 

But you can stick with that belief that "likes", meetings and declarations of support can change anything.

There should be an internet petition in there, full of nicknames, just for good measure.

 

Doesn't the White House have to address them if they get above a certain limit, think it was 50,000? It could change stuff!

[Cultist]

Doesn't the White House have to address them if they get above a certain limit, think it was 50,000? It could change stuff!

Yeah, it totally worked with SOPA, which was not cancelled but delayed. Plus, companies acted to stop it.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Cultist

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

GB's site is the first to come up. Enjoy your science. BG have 12 month period. In most othe cases it is for life. You can read similar statements on official sites of other countries. Learn to check your facts.

 

12 month delay != banned forever. I don't suppose you know what "forever" actually means?

 

You'd be surprised but once pedophilia have been considered as something normal.

 

It was once considered normal to have a son marry his father's wife, stone people for eating shrimp, and for someone to own slaves. Not very good things, and with the exception of the first, all are illegal in civilized countries. Not sure what this has to do with homosexuality though.

 

 

And I never thought that PE was a result of DA2, I merely pointed out about auditory disbalance.

 

 

So you aren't the "Cultist" who would whine about being betray or whatever? Heh, must of been that other one then.

 

What makes you think they are wrong? Because you don't like them? Well, you are into big disappointment - you can't force big players to "behave themselves". China laughed after some idiots screamed about their Tibet policies, Russia ignored everyone after war in Georgia. Saudi Arabia can ignore everyone because for them it is enough to say "@#$% you!" and everyone will shut up, because noone want to deal with overpriced oil. Israel ignores anyone who tries to interfere with thein politics.

So just relax and let the butthurt flow through you.

Never mind that China's huge inequality will lead them to collapse, or that Russia's and Saudi Arabia's power will likely evaporate with the advancement of renewable energy. The idea that any country has the right to harass it's citizens to the degree Russia, China, and the Islamic countries do is so against the idea of human rights anyone who believes they are justified in doing that is insane. Edited August 26, 2013 by KaineParker

[BruceVC]

 

Agreed, I doubt anyone would intentionally make themselves  sound so ignorant and bigoted to ask a question "why care about equality and human rights in other parts of the world"

 

@ Cultist

 

The Russian government does care. They don't like negative publicity as they are trying to position Russia as a viable destination for many international events. They have also stated that there will be no discrimination against any gay athletes.

you are just too accustomed that everyone around you is a tolerant and all-caring.

 

As for government - China purged ****load of mislim Uyghurs during their 2009 uprising. There was an outrage, a lot of "how could they!" "everyone should sever all diplomatic ties with China!" and similar naive statements. In the end, China ignored all complaints and accusations. Nobody cares, no one cancelled any important business contracts and China is as appealing to investment as before.

But you can stick with that belief that "likes", meetings and declarations of support can change anything.

 

 

Cultist you seem very cynical about what ordinary people can or can't do. You need to make a stand around your opinion on what matters in life especially on social issues like bigotry. It doesn't matter if you personally  can't implement specific social changes in a certain country. That's not the point. I live in a country where racism use to be a law and changes only came because people around the world objected to it and said it wasn't acceptable. Your opinion does matter and can have an impact, it just may take time

Edited August 26, 2013 by BruceVC

[Malcador]

Depends on being a big player enough though to ignore the world and get away with it, admittedly up to a point (that Izzard skit about killing your own people being ok vs killing other people). US can and does, Russia certainly like wise.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

It is interesting you bring up South Africa Bruce, because that is a perfect example of a nation with a barbaric policies that changed due in part to pressure from other nations. If people started boycotting a certain countries products because they dislike what that country does, that sends a clear message that can't be ignored if enough people do it.

[Cultist]

 12 month delay != banned forever. I don't suppose you know what "forever" actually means?

*sigh* then go check US policies. Or check other countries. You will definetely be surprised.

 

It was once considered normal to have a son marry his father's wife, stone people for eating shrimp, and for someone to own slaves. Not very good things, and with the exception of the first, all are illegal in civilized countries. Not sure what this has to do with homosexuality though.

And who makes that exceptions? Collective western hivemind?

 

So you aren't the "Cultist" who would whine about being betray or whatever? Heh, must of been that other one then.

I never hid that I don't like DA2 and made a topic about Anti-Dragon Age 2 . Have no idea what do you mean by "betray"

 

Never mind that China's huge inequality will lead them to collapse, or that Russia's and Saudi Arabia's power will likely evaporate with the advancement of renewable energy. The idea that any country has the right to harass it's citizens to the degree Russia, China, and the Islamic countries to is so against the idea of human rights anyone who believes they have that is insane.

I suppose you are one of those overhyped types who preach about solar plants and renewable energy. Well, enjoy your wishful thinking. You are operating in "what if"'s, speculations and assumptions. Good luck waiting till saudi oil sites dry out.

[Malcador]

So, prediction when Russia will cave ?

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

*sigh* then go check US policies. Or check other countries. You will definetely be surprised.

 

Already did, medical associations think its bull****. 80s Lawmakers aren't the best judges of science, seeing as they contemplated categorizing "ketchup" as a vegetable.

 

And who makes that exceptions?

 

Legislators.

 

I never hid that I don't like DA2 and made a topic about Anti-Dragon Age 2 .

 

That is some massive butthurt.

 

 

I suppose you are one of those overhyped types who preach about solar plants and renewable energy. Well, enjoy your wishful thinking. You are operating in "what if"'s, speculations and assumptions. Good luck waiting till saudi oil sites dry out.

I don't see how nuclear energy and battery powered vehicles that have already been proven to work is "wishful thinking" but whatever.

 

So, prediction when Russia will cave ?

If the West protests and boycotts, I'd say that the stance softens a few months before the Olympics. If just online protests and a few pundits, Putin will push harder to look tough.

Edited August 26, 2013 by KaineParker

[BruceVC]

It is interesting you bring up South Africa Bruce, because that is a perfect example of a nation with a barbaric policies that changed due in part to pressure from other nations. If people started boycotting a certain countries products because they dislike what that country does, that sends a clear message that can't be ignored if enough people do it.

 

That's exactly my point, there are many things we can do as ordinary citizens to show our dissatisfaction with the policies of another country. And sometimes it may be as simple as boycotting there goods if you feel strongly enough about a particular social injustice. Sometimes that's all you can do but you still make a stand

Edited August 26, 2013 by BruceVC

[Cultist]

Depends on being a big player enough though to ignore the world and get away with it, admittedly up to a point (that Izzard skit about killing your own people being ok vs killing other people). US can and does, Russia certainly like wise.

Man, noone is going to risk their contracts for homos, animal rights or other hippie idiocy. It's not a matter of nuclear weapons or army size. Only jingoistic and idealistic people would think that US will start a war with China to free Taiwan.

 

Cultist you seem very cynical about what ordinary people can or can't do. You need to make a stand around your opinion on what matters in life especially on social issues like bigotry. It doesn't matter if you personally  can't implement specific social changes in a certain country. That's not the point. I live in a country where racism use to be a law and changes only came because people around the world objected to it and said it wasn't acceptable. Your opinion does matter and can have an impact, it just may take time

And cynical i am. I think that homosexuality is a deviation, like pedophilia or zoophilia. Only difference with other diseases is that we could not yet determine the cure. That is my opinion and "you are wrong!" or "a lot of celebrities said homos are okay!" will not change it as I came to it after listening to both pro and cons arguments. So I just enjoy funny discussion where I can mock people about some sensitive subjects.

And by the way - people started objecting that "racism" only after it declared war upon them. Not before that.

[Malcador]

Oh, they're going to be on you now. Brace yourself!

[BruceVC]

 

Depends on being a big player enough though to ignore the world and get away with it, admittedly up to a point (that Izzard skit about killing your own people being ok vs killing other people). US can and does, Russia certainly like wise.

Man, noone is going to risk their contracts for homos, animal rights or other hippie idiocy. It's not a matter of nuclear weapons or army size. Only jingoistic and idealistic people would think that US will start a war with China to free Taiwan.

 

Cultist you seem very cynical about what ordinary people can or can't do. You need to make a stand around your opinion on what matters in life especially on social issues like bigotry. It doesn't matter if you personally  can't implement specific social changes in a certain country. That's not the point. I live in a country where racism use to be a law and changes only came because people around the world objected to it and said it wasn't acceptable. Your opinion does matter and can have an impact, it just may take time

And cynical i am. I think that homosexuality is a deviation, like pedophilia or zoophilia. Only difference with other diseases is that we could not yet determine the cure. That is my opinion and "you are wrong!" or "a lot of celebrities said homos are okay!" will not change it as I came to it after listening to both pro and cons arguments. So I just enjoy funny discussion where I can mock people about some sensitive subjects.

And by the way - people started objecting that "racism" only after it declared war upon them. Not before that.

 

 

I assume you know some gay people, how do you treat them when you meet them, do you say to there faces you think there sexual orientation is a physical affliction?

 

I am not  going to try to change your mind by explaining why homosexuality is not a disease as you clearly won't listen to reason. I would like you to present one credible link though that explains that homosexuality is a sickness and can be treated, just one?

 

Finally why would you get enjoyment from mocking people about topics they believe in, does this seem like the rational and reasonable  thinking of a normal person?

[Cultist]

Already did, medical associations think its bull****. 80s Lawmakers aren't the best judges of science, seeing as they contemplated categorizing "ketchup" as a vegetable.

Yet the law still stands. In all that countries.

 

Legislators.

Wait, what? Just above you said that Lawmakers aren't the best judges of science, seeing as they contemplated categorizing "ketchup" as a vegetable. And now you expect people like that to create the Laws of God-Blessed Western Civilization?

 

That is some massive butthurt.

That was a great hype just after PE kickstarter ended in huge success. Had a great fun with excercizing a good old popamole bashing.

 

I don't see how nuclear energy and battery powered vehicles that have already been proven to work is "wishful thinking" but whatever.

Car fuel is only a part of oil processing. Where do you think plastis come from?

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Yet the law still stands. In all that countries.

 

 

There are also laws against buying alcohol on Sundays, just because a law exists, doesn't mean it is grounded in scientific fact or even common sense.

 

Wait, what? Just above you said that Lawmakers aren't the best judges of science, seeing as they contemplated categorizing "ketchup" as a vegetable. And now you expect people like that to create the Laws of God-Blessed Western Civilization?

 

You asked "And who makes that exceptions?", not " are those exceptions good". Either way, it is a bad misreading seeing as the point was out of all those things that were commonplace back in the day, only marrying your father's widow is still legal.

 

That was a great hype just after PE kickstarter ended in huge success. Had a great fun with excercizing a good old popamole bashing.

 

I didn't realize you were bashing Twitcher.

 

 

Car fuel is only a part of oil processing. Where do you think plastis come from?

IKEA

 

http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/60146194/

 

If you meant plastics, yes that comes from Oil production, however bioplastic is becoming more viable due to the rising costs of oil.

[Hurlshort]

Don't feed the trolls, people

 

I initially forgot the comma there, which made sense in a different way.

 

I mean, I get that there are plenty of people that freak out about gay people, but I have a hard time believing there is seriously people who still doubt the effectiveness of solar power and the importance of renewable energy.  

[Cultist]

I assume you know some gay people, how do you treat them when you meet them, do you say to there faces you think there sexual orientation is a physical affliction?

 

I am not  going to try to change your mind by explaining why homosexuality is not a disease as you clearly won't listen to reason. I would like you to present one credible link though that explains that homosexuality is a sickness and can be treated, just one?

 

Finally why would you get enjoyment from mocking people about topics they believe in, does this seem like the rational and reasonable  thinking of a normal person?

I know one. And he knows about my views but as we work is separate divisions there were no conflicts.

I need no link because I prefer to base my opinion on my obervations rather than internet topics. With animals, homosexuality in my opinion is a replacement behaviour\deviation caused by change of enviromental, social or populational situation. Humans are much more complex animals with complex social structure and advanced brain functions. Thus, it is immensely harder to determine what causes a pathology\deviation. The fact that homosexuality is not treated and is viewed as a variation of norm is a result of a vicious circle - you need subjects to research, in other words experiments on humans, which is not possible. Yet.

We can't cure HIV or AIDS yet, that doesn't mean we should not try.

And I enjoy such threads because it is a good place to excercize rhetorics and demagogy.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

Don't feed the trolls, people

 

I initially forgot the comma there, which made sense in a different way.

 

I mean, I get that there are plenty of people that freak out about gay people, but I have a hard time believing there is seriously people who still doubt the effectiveness of solar power and the importance of renewable energy.  

Well, I'm no longer in the mood to feed people to trolls, thanks for spoiling the fun Hurlie.

[Malcador]

Don't feed the trolls, people

 

I initially forgot the comma there, which made sense in a different way.

 

I mean, I get that there are plenty of people that freak out about gay people, but I have a hard time believing there is seriously people who still doubt the effectiveness of solar power and the importance of renewable energy.  

You need to widen your Internet browsing if that's the case.

[alanschu]

 

 

Already did, medical associations think its bull****. 80s Lawmakers aren't the best judges of science, seeing as they contemplated categorizing "ketchup" as a vegetable.

 

Yeah it's antiquated legacy and there's some level of impetus to see it removed, thankfully.  Not fast enough, however.

[Walsingham]

I know one. And he knows about my views but as we work is separate divisions there were no conflicts.

I need no link because I prefer to base my opinion on my obervations rather than internet topics. With animals, homosexuality in my opinion is a replacement behaviour\deviation caused by change of enviromental, social or populational situation. Humans are much more complex animals with complex social structure and advanced brain functions. Thus, it is immensely harder to determine what causes a pathology\deviation. The fact that homosexuality is not treated and is viewed as a variation of norm is a result of a vicious circle - you need subjects to research, in other words experiments on humans, which is not possible. Yet.

We can't cure HIV or AIDS yet, that doesn't mean we should not try.

And I enjoy such threads because it is a good place to excercize rhetorics and demagogy.

 

 

I could observe that your illness analogies have sinister forebears, but I doubt you'd care.

 

Instead, consider the implications of what you are saying for other 'aberrant' behaviour. 

 

You already recognise that humans beings are much more complex than animals. I do not automatically deny that homosexuality is a 'deviant' behaviour, and that animals would regard this as destructive. But I do deny that we need to live by the same rules as animals, living or dying by nature's word. That is our glory and (arguably) our curse.

 

In other words, I am accepting of Man's right to f*** other men, because doing so reinforces our right to f*** nature. And given that nature cares no more for us than the dodo or panda, I'd say that f***ing nature was much more important than gayness.

 

An ostensibly scientific adherence to what nature tells us, is by contrast, no better than the argument a seaslug might make simply existing.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Walsingham

[Tale]

I think all has been said that needs to be on the topic. It's getting into bickering and some personal attacks. Let's call it a day.