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I oppose porting P:E to consoles  for several reasons, three come to mind right now:

1) Games for consoles are generally made to be played on the TV with player sitting on a couch 2+ meters away. This already excludes walls of text. Either dialogues will be fully voiced or it will be in big bold letters with max 2 lines of text. Both of this options mean that there will be much less text:

you can't expect player to scroll trough BG2-sized dialogue in a box that contains a maximum of say ~60 words at a time

you can't expect developer to pay most of their money to voice actors - see Skyrim and compare it with Morrowind for amount of text

2) Because console is a bigger market, games that are not PC exclusive will *eventually* be developed for consoles first and then ported to PC. What that means you can see comparing DA:O with DA2. The first one was a promising start to potentially great series of RPGs (and dumbed down version of it on consoles), the other was an aRPG.

3) The IE-like games simply will not port well to console. You need to either sacrifice PC or console version or develop two versions which is more expensive

Because of all these problems I wouldn't support it if I knew it would be ported to console. Don't get me wrong, some of such games are great (Bastion comes to mind), but I certainly would not preorder or kickstart it. Would definitely wait for a review. 

Edited by forfs
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People don't play games like SimCity and Warcraft on consoles, those games were not the successes they were on consoles, Maxis and Blizzard ceased console support for those franchises. The Playstation did have a mouse which allowed the games to be played satisfactorily but not many people owned one. Halo didn't get a great PC port, and it's fundamentally a console game with many design decisions centred around the gamepad.

 

Any development time dedicated by Obsidian to console is taking away PC development time. Who is going to be developing the expansion and potential sequels while PE is ported to consoles?

 

I'd like to see it in action before declaring the touchpad on the PS4 and OUYA consoles as equivalent to a mouse. Some people were saying that about the Wiimote, and that was blatant bull****.

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I would assume that with USB ports, you should be able to use just about any keyboard or mouse with a console. I know you could use any old USB keyboard with a PS2 just fine, because I did for FF11, and when typing out names for my NCAA games.

 

With that said, there are those licensing fees, porting costs, the extra time required and you would have to be able to find some way of making the game playable with a controller whether it is with an alternating HUD between controller/KM controls, or using the bumpers to trigger more buttons like in the old WordPerfect 5.1 Shift/Alt/Ctrl F1-12 days.

 

I can play Dragon Age Origins on PC perfectly fine with an XBox controller, and do everything that I can with a keyboard and mouse via that method with Xpadder.

You see, ever since the whole Doritos Locos Tacos thing, Taco Bell thinks they can do whatever they want.

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I propose a Project: Eternity arcade console, requiring 50 cents every time you die, to continue. Complete with joystick and 6 ultra-responsive buttons! 8D

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Should we not start with some Ipelagos, or at least some Greater Ipelagos, before tackling a named Arch Ipelago? 6_u

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  • 1 year later...

I have always believed this and now Chris Avellone has confirmed the impact a console version will have. But I would still like someone who really understands the technical mechanics to explain why a console version of any game is generally not as complex as the PC game. I have heard many theories and speculation but based on Chris comments above, why can't you have a BG2 on console?

Fallout 1 -> Fallout 2 - > Fallout: Tactics

All 3 are very much cRPGs. And while Tactics breaks the lore, and isn't amazing like 1&2, it is still very much a cRPG. Notice how they all play like other cRPGs, with multiple buttons on the keyboard to do things.

 

Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel

Fallout 3 -> Fallout: New Vegas

There is a HUGE difference between the first set of three, and the last 3. Even ignoring the odd one out(Tactics and Brotherhood of Steel), and just focusing on the main series. And for the record Fallout: New Vegas is my favorite one in the series, and I own them all.

New Vegas had to have huge amounts of NPCs cut, and have Vegas sectioned off more(there are literally mods on the Nexus that restore the game to how it was originally planned). Why did this happen? Consoles couldn't handle having that many NPCs on the screen, or that much of Vegas loaded all at once. Then there are things like how New Vegas was praised for finding a good solution to party management(with the Companion Wheel) while using the controller. Or how all text/menus are designed around console controllers, and how they are tedious to use with a keyboard and mouse(also there are literally mods on the Nexus that fix this also).

 

Just stop and count the number of buttons on the controller, and count the number of buttons on the keyboard. Notice how the range of motion is limited with joysticks(something Valve is so desperately trying to solve with their controller), compared to a mouse. It's not just RPGs that suffer from consoles. There was the Shadowrun FPS game in 2007 that had crossplay between consoles and PC, the PC players had to be nerfed to allow for a fair playing field. Even Gears of War 1 was going to have crossplay between the PC and console, but the same thing happened there. Only worse, Microsoft took really good console players and put them in the game against average PC players, and the PC players still dominated.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Sorry for the double post, but I can't seem to see an "Edit Post" option.

 

Another thing I thought of was that Chris Avellone within the past year said in a KOTOR interview that one of the big reasons that K3 never happened was because the engine that K1&2 were made on, would have to be remade to make K3 since it would have been made on new consoles. Due to the new generation of consoles that were being made. That is a huge issue with consoles, having to make and remake content over and over again.

 

That is even ignoring the fact that even the PS4/XB1 hardware is already considered outdated as far as specs go. Even the AAA games are not being pushed out at 1080p with 60fps on the next-gen console hardware. (Not that it is being used to make PoE but) Unreal 4 Engine had some tech demos shown, and parts of the demos were not even able to be simulated on the PS4 hardware, and a lot of the parts that were able to be made were not reproduced to the same quality. Admittedly, it was missing somewhat minor things, but in other cases it was missing some important things. The PS4 wasn't producing fog nearly to the same caliper as the PC hardware, and for some games like Silent Hill, the fog is integral to creating the atmosphere of the entire series

 

This ignores things like Microsoft's business practice with the Xbox 360 and charging $10,000 to do an update(not release an expansion, just a regular bugfix update). So consoles are held back "on their own terms" even.

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You know what? Console fanboys always branded PC gamers as elitist or master race or call them 'beggars' or pirates. What Sony and Microsoft had done was clearly dividing gamers and make their console fanboys to hate against PC gamers.

 

The only real reason i have to play on consoles because they are 'conservative' and 'selfish'. If you look at IGN and Gamespot before GTA5 were announced for PC, these fanboys literally laugh at the face of PC gamers with profanity, insults, it's not even funny. They clearly branded PC gamers as low as dogs. I have never seen in gaming that console fanboys were made to HATE. They are brainwashed in hating other gamers on other platforms namely PC gaming.

 

Now look who's begging?. Now i don't hate any platform. The only reason i HAVE to play on a console is because they do not want to make the game available on PC. So if they refused to make their so called 'exclusives' to PC, why should PC exclusives make available to them? What kind of mentality is that? On top of that, PC gamers were constantly harassed as the pirates. Now honestly, does piracy not exists on consoles?

 

Enough of the rant at the moment but i sincerely urge Obsidian to not release the game on consoles. No i'm not platform racist (as i game on PS4 for their exclusives), why can't they buy a PC to play a PC exclusives game? Why because they are the master race now?

 

But based on latest gameplay demo, it seems that inventory screen are scroll-based and UI is definitely "console" friendly. It probably means, a console version was planned all along with PC. I have nothing to lose as i play on multi-platform. I'm just voicing out the console fanboyism are really getting out of place. Most indies will release their game multi-platform and that's a good thing. Just don't turn yourself onto "exclusives" so that your fans are forced to play on consolized, dumbed-down consoles.

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No, no, no, no, no.

 

They always compromise RPG's they are the main reason why RPG's are so bad these days.

I hate to break it to you guys, but compromises are made all throughout development.

 

The compromise argument is a very, very weak one.

 

Fortunately, they have stated this is PC-exclusive. Now, does that mean it will stay an exclusive? Probably not. 

 

 

Please no console port, ever.

 

EVER

Why should they not port it after the PC version is done? How does it harm you then?

 

Serious question.

Edited by Bryy
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I dont have a problem with consoles either. If they want to do it... why do i care...it´s their time and their money then because I already have my game bought for PC. And that console kiddys laugh at PC gamers is well... if i can only be entertained by a  game but not inspired to be creative and start working with these opportunities then who is the low level?

 

so PC gamers have a big advantage always just because you can use tools to do stuff yourself. Console players can only be consumers! Thats it.

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Why should they not port it after the PC version is done? How does it harm you then?

The Witcher II UI.
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^

 

 

I agree that that is such a stupid idiotic pathetic garbage hateful retarded scumbag evil satanic nazi like term ever created. At least top 5.

 

TSLRCM Official Forum || TSLRCM Moddb || My other KOTOR2 mods || TSLRCM (English version) on Steam || [M4-78EP on Steam

Formerly known as BattleWookiee/BattleCookiee

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Because it's not being made with consolification down the road in mind, but a pure K&M setup?

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^

 

 

I agree that that is such a stupid idiotic pathetic garbage hateful retarded scumbag evil satanic nazi like term ever created. At least top 5.

 

TSLRCM Official Forum || TSLRCM Moddb || My other KOTOR2 mods || TSLRCM (English version) on Steam || [M4-78EP on Steam

Formerly known as BattleWookiee/BattleCookiee

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To complete the point being made: the Witcher 1 UI was pretty good. The Witcher 2 UI was not (at least, not if you used a keyboard and mouse). The difference between the two is that the Witcher 1 was ported after the fact,at which point $$$ dictated that the Witcher 2 would be a console game first, and a PC game as an after thought.

 

For some odd reason, I don't want that to happen with this (hoped for) series of games, and the easiest way to ensure this is to advocate against a console version ever being made, even after the initial release.

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Please no console port, ever.

 

EVER

Why should they not port it after the PC version is done? How does it harm you then?

 

Serious question.

 

It doesn't harm me at all, it harms the game. As others have stated, even a port after the fact will do serious damage to future expansions and/or sequels. Need I mention Dragon Age? Origins was designed for PC with a port after the fact, and look how da2 turned out. Just saw gameplay for DA3. Guess what? Designed for console. I almost puked.

 

I know that there is a ton of money there for Obsidian, but I hope they stick to their guns and honor all the backers that backed a PC game. Once that fork in the road has been explored, even a little bit, there is no turning back.

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I know that there is a ton of money there for Obsidian, but I hope they stick to their guns and honor all the backers that backed a PC game. Once that fork in the road has been explored, even a little bit, there is no turning back.

How in the world is making a console port after the fact not honoring the backers or some other entitled Us vs. Them BS?

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Eh.  I'm not completely against a port, but the game seems extremely unsuited to it mechanically.  There's a reason DA:O got much, much lower scores on console than PC.  The small RTS style of combat that these games have used is extremely hard to control with a controller.  Since the graphics are neither 3D nor vector based (to my knowledge), scaling to different TV sizes and resolutions could be a small problem as important details are lost.  Furthermore, I wouldn't want to see Obsidian's talent, which is lean in a good way diverted from possible sequels or new IP for it.

 

But I wouldn't be against them sending the game to Paradox, and saying "you can make this a console port and sell it, and give us x% of the profit."  The problem is that they would still need to be vigilant about the quality of such a port to protect their reputation, and making a quality port would probably be pretty hard.

 

I would have a problem with them changing development of this game and future sequels to accommodate a port.

Edited by anameforobsidian
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I know that there is a ton of money there for Obsidian, but I hope they stick to their guns and honor all the backers that backed a PC game. Once that fork in the road has been explored, even a little bit, there is no turning back.

How in the world is making a console port after the fact not honoring the backers or some other entitled Us vs. Them BS?

 

I'd be willing to bet that almost 100% of the backers wanted a PC game, not a console game. Porting this game will absolutely ruffle the feathers of most backers, just look in this thread. I don't know how many great PC games/sequels have to be ruined by porting for people like you to understand that porting a game to console ruins the game for pc. Also, while you may not think it's "us v them", they sure do, along with most other players, both console and pc.

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For myself, I certainly agree that Obsidian has the right to port this game to consoles after release, using the funds raised by selling the game on the PC to do so, both legally and morally.  In fact, I can argue that they should do so -- it would maximize the profit making potential of the game.

 

But...

 

If they choose to do so, I would be far less interested in a PoE 2, and would almost certainly not back a Kickstarter for such a project, or any future Kickstarter that Obsidian might create.  My goal in backing this game was to create a game optimized exclusively for the use of mouse and keyboard, with the understanding that Obsidian agreed to accept lower revenues demanded by such a design in return for not having to repay their backers (restoring some, but not all, of the lost profit potential from not porting to the console).  If it turns out that Obsidian wants to have their cake (get up-front funding that they don't need to pay back) and eat it to (maximize revenues by releasing on consoles), then why would I continue to support them?

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For myself, I certainly agree that Obsidian has the right to port this game to consoles after release, using the funds raised by selling the game on the PC to do so, both legally and morally.  In fact, I can argue that they should do so -- it would maximize the profit making potential of the game.

 

But...

 

If they choose to do so, I would be far less interested in a PoE 2, and would almost certainly not back a Kickstarter for such a project, or any future Kickstarter that Obsidian might create.  My goal in backing this game was to create a game optimized exclusively for the use of mouse and keyboard, with the understanding that Obsidian agreed to accept lower revenues demanded by such a design in return for not having to repay their backers (restoring some, but not all, of the lost profit potential from not porting to the console).  If it turns out that Obsidian wants to have their cake (get up-front funding that they don't need to pay back) and eat it to (maximize revenues by releasing on consoles), then why would I continue to support them?

I could not have said it better myself.

 

+1 internetz for you sir.

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Also, while you may not think it's "us v them", they sure do, along with most other players, both console and pc.

I fully understand that. I'm not going to change my opinions based on some irrational fears of the pure artist vs. the corporation and others false sense of superiority because they play PC or console.

Edited by Bryy
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I may have missed the time where PC or console gamers came together, made an agreement that the other side just sucks and since then we have a warlike situation like kids arguing about which sandbox is the better one. I can enjoy games on a console and on a PC + the artistry you can do with it. But there were bad ports yes... but that goes back into the early days too. If you have the feeling that a specific game can only be good on a PC because of all the hotkeys etc, dont buy it for a console or visa versa or just wait for the reviews of the ports! Easy and stress free ;)

 

Guys on metacritics are always funny and damn honest!

Edited by NWN_babaYaga
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I But there were bad ports yes... but that goes back into the early days too. If you have the feeling that a specific game can only be good on a PC because of all the hotkeys etc, dont buy it for a console or visa versa or just wait for the reviews of the ports! Easy and stress free ;)

Basically.

 

Ports are not bad. Bad ports are bad. 

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