Royal Marine caught smuggling for Taliban

[Monte Carlo]

I don't consider myself European in any meaningful political sense. The idea that there is a cultural European identity is nuts, ask folks in the Balkans or Germany.

 

I don't consider myself particularly special. You've got a bug up your arse about my country, that's clear. And I couldn't care less about that either.

[Raithe]

We could go the European way

So, you Brits don't consider yourself European? What then?

 

Sorry to disappoint you, but you're not special.

 

Ah , but we're not European either.

 

It's a bit political thing. The majority of the population in the UK doesn't want to be dragged into the EU idea.

There's a bunch of other issues involved, but one of the key is that the majority of Europe runs based on Napoleonic legal systems. We don't.

 

Plus there's a shedload of cultural aspects to it. Most of the people I know from the continent tend to think of the UK as "seperate, but kind of hanging onto the outskirts" of Europe 'proper' rather then as a concrete part of it.

[Humodour]

We could go the European way

So, you Brits don't consider yourself European? What then?

 

Sorry to disappoint you, but you're not special.

 

[...]

 

Plus there's a shedload of cultural aspects to it. Most of the people I know from the continent tend to think of the UK as "seperate, but kind of hanging onto the outskirts" of Europe 'proper' rather then as a concrete part of it.

 

Which is, of course, incorrect. BUT it stems directly from a lingering attitude of the superiority of the British Empire.

 

Then again, it begs the question: So is Australia part of Europe? No, dumbass, it's a totally different continent on the other side of the planet.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Krezack

[Raithe]

Which is, of course, incorrect. BUT it stems directly from a lingering attitude of the superiority of the British Empire.

 

Hm, so the fact that I know people from France, Germany, Italy, and Poland who all think that the UK isn't a part of Europe 'proper' is a lingering attitude of superiority about the British Empire?

[Humodour]

Which is, of course, incorrect. BUT it stems directly from a lingering attitude of the superiority of the British Empire.

 

Hm, so the fact that I know people from France, Germany, Italy, and Poland who all think that the UK isn't a part of Europe 'proper' is a lingering attitude of superiority about the British Empire?

 

Yep.

[Monte Carlo]

But the British Empire was superior.

[Morgoth]

Britain was an Empire in name only.

 

Because invading poor and defenseless countries an robbing them of their resources and manpower doesn't make you "superior".

 

The only real Empires back in the 19th century were USA, Germany and Japan, because they did all this without the exploitation of other countries.

[Walsingham]

Britain was an Empire in name only.

 

Because invading poor and defenseless countries an robbing them of their resources and manpower doesn't make you "superior".

 

The only real Empires back in the 19th century were USA, Germany and Japan, because they did all this without the exploitation of other countries.

 

 

 

Please, _please_ tell me you're being serious.

[Raithe]

Britain was an Empire in name only.

 

Because invading poor and defenseless countries an robbing them of their resources and manpower doesn't make you "superior".

 

The only real Empires back in the 19th century were USA, Germany and Japan, because they did all this without the exploitation of other countries.

 

Uh huh.

I'm sure the Chinese and Koreans who suffered under the Japanese of the time would say they weren't exploited.

Or the Japanese having their ports forced open under American guns... Although the USA generally liked to push the "economic empire" more then an outright political one.

The Germans like so many in Africa and the many insurrections they faced from natives.. including what was termed "the first genocide of the 20th century"

 

It's pretty much impossible for any nation to take an "Empire" without someone getting screwed over. Sure, the British Empire had the bad habit of getting the natives brought back to blighty, giving them an education here, then installing them back in their own countries as the local bureaucrats and administrators... I have to say, that was frankly appaling behaviour on our part..

 

But I'm beginning to sense a little thread dereailment here..

 

Edit: And I'd say we're superior because we did it better then anyone else, for a lot longer ... and happened to naturally let it go into the Commonwealth, and keep on damn good terms with the majority of our former conquests.

Edited June 11, 2011 by Raithe

[Walsingham]

Blood knew the native mind;

He said we must be firm, but kind.

A mutiny resulted.

I shall never forget the way

That Blood stood upon that awful day

Preserved us all from death.

He stood upon a little mound

Cast his lethargic eyes around,

And said beneath his breath:

'Whatever happens, we have got

The Maxim Gun, and they have not.'

[Monte Carlo]

Britain was an Empire in name only.

 

Because invading poor and defenseless countries an robbing them of their resources and manpower doesn't make you "superior".

 

The only real Empires back in the 19th century were USA, Germany and Japan, because they did all this without the exploitation of other countries.

 

 

Bwahahahahhaaaaaa

[Malcador]

Heh, the British.

[Morgoth]

Well good thing at least the Germans put an end to this spook.

[Humodour]

But the British Empire was superior.

 

I agree. It also had the unique property of turning into something much greater - look at the legacy it left Australia, America, Canada, New Zealand, India, etc.

 

Not that I'm implying it was all sunshine and lollipops, but it's not like every empire left such a positive legacy (in fact, no other empire did).

[Morgoth]

but it's not like every empire left such a positive legacy (in fact, no other empire did).

Nah, that would be the Roman Empire.

[Humodour]

but it's not like every empire left such a positive legacy (in fact, no other empire did).

Nah, that would be the Roman Empire.

 

Yes, I suppose the Roman Empire is comparable magnitude to the British Empire.

[Gorth]

Empire magnitude is a hard one to convert between. Heck, even Fahrenheit and Celcius are easier.

 

Empire size compared to "the known world", longevity comparison, impact on the modern "western" world, etc.?

 

The Angevin empire caused most of the conflicts between England and France that shaped western Europe throughout the middle ages, the Mughal Empire influenced most of south Asia for several centuries, Alexanders empire brought Greek culture to most of the known world at its time (much of which was adapted by the Romans and passed on the the invading Germanic tribes) etc.

 

As empires go, the English wasn't bad, but like most others it was better if you were English, rather than one of those people who used to live in the areas expanded into. Native Americans, the Gaelic people on the British isles (Welsh, Cornish, Irish and Scottish), the south African Boers, Aborigines, Maori and just about everybody else have different versions of how good it was to live there.

 

The only legacy I've noticed so far is countries where people eat Vegemite and drive in the wrong side of the road

[Raithe]

As empires go, the English wasn't bad, but like most others it was better if you were English, rather than one of those people who used to live in the areas expanded into. Native Americans, the Gaelic people on the British isles (Welsh, Cornish, Irish and Scottish), the south African Boers, Aborigines, Maori and just about everybody else have different versions of how good it was to live there.

 

Actually one interesting fact that came up was that while initially the British Empire had some issues with the Native Americans when we entered the New World.. we actually established proper treaties with them about how far we'd push into the country.

Who knows how that might have turned out in time, but it was one of the matters that annoyed the colonialists who kicked off the American War of Independance.. That His Majesties government of the time refused to let them expand into the natives lands...

It wasn't all about Tax and Representation