XBox 360 Update Preview

[Purkake]

The difference is that your console isn't a record player, they won't be making DVDs for the 360 once they move on to Blu-Ray and even if they did, the games wouldn't work on the (then) outdated hardware.

 

You're going to end up with a box that doesn't have a disc drive and the only way to get the games will be download from the internet or download on some medium like a flash drive and then from there to the console.

 

Sure you can still play your 360 games on the 360, but not the Xbox 5's games on the same 360.

Edited October 26, 2009 by Purkake

[Nightshape]

Digital delivery is the future.

 

Nope.

 

I'm not asking you to like it, I'm telling you what's happening.

 

The industry is sick of the killing that retail is making HENCE, digital delivery avoids retailers, so its one less person taking a munch of the pie.

 

and retail is sick of companies going digital... with no retail, no consoles, so suck it up, like all other industries which have to live with second hand sales, i dont see a reason why software or music should be the only exceptions allowed...

 

and besides one or two more DRM server shutdown and you can bet your ass, European Commission and their US counterpart will have big drama running about it, because of the first sale doctrine, which is in almost every civilised world law...

 

and on other half the future of internet in the eyes of every single ISP are download caps... good luck with digital distribution with harsh caps like most of EU and Australia/New Zealand have

 

You can whine and complain all you like. You won't derail progress, and frankly if you don't see the harm that second hands sales are doing then you're not looking closely enough. The truth of the matter is that second hand sales, and piracy, have the exact same effect on the industry. You clearly aren't able to grasp the effects of that, it's getting stupid, if I walk into GAME right now, I cannot find new software, and they're actively encouraging me to buy second hand stock, to the point where the ratio of second hand to new is 3:1.

 

For retail it is a cash cow, sale, buy back, sale, buy back, sale, buy back on and on.

 

I'm saying what direction things are DEFINATELY going in, I think I'll trust what I know, over your comments. Despite your protests it will be moving in this direction, retail will likely end up shipping DLC codes in boxes as well as hardware.

 

The PSP Go, will likely fail, but it is the first of its type. The XBox 360 has already begun to test the waters.

 

I haven't even mentioned cloud gaming.

 

Lets see what happends over the next few generations of consoles shall we?

[Nightshape]

The difference is that your console isn't a record player, they won't be making DVDs for the 360 once they move on to Blu-Ray and even if they did, the games wouldn't work on the (then) outdated hardware.

 

You're going to end up with a box that doesn't have a disc drive and the only way to get the games will be download from the internet or download on some medium like a flash drive and then from there to the console.

 

Sure you can still play your 360 games on the 360, but not the Xbox 5's games on the same 360.

 

Spot on.

[Purkake]

Cloud gaming is a pipe dream at this point, the infrastructure is nowhere near what it would need to be for it to be viable.

 

Still, that's probably the future of the future.

[Mamoulian War]

...The truth of the matter is that second hand sales, and piracy, have the exact same effect on the industry...

 

... if I walk into GAME right now, I cannot find new software, and they're actively encouraging me to buy second hand stock, to the point where the ratio of second hand to new is 3:1.

 

For retail it is a cash cow, sale, buy back, sale, buy back, sale, buy back on and on.

 

 

sorry but for that you have guilt on your shoulders aswell, the problem of the industry is not only piracy and second hand sales, but lower and lower quality of software produced aswell... you see the same in music and movie industry. If consumers don't see a value in the product they purchased, they are more likely to sell it second hand... it goes for all goods, not only software!!!

 

until you notice that, going 100% digital will not save the publishers, it just makes people spend less money on new goods, because frankly, if you sell your old stuff for 10-30 EUR, you are more likely to buy new stuff for 50-60EUR...

 

unless you change the prices of new digital only software to 10 - 20 EUR maybe even less, you will harm only yourself... 2nd hand market makes adds brings loads of cash into 1st hand sales aswell, and looks like only gaming, music and movie industry is not seeing it, for whatever reason...

 

if i sell my used car for 10000 EUR i am more likely to add another 5000-7500 EUR into the pool and buy me new car... same for games, movies, music, consoles, TVs, just different prices...

 

2nd hand market is aimed for the less fortunate people with lower income, especialy in the time of crisis, and think whatever you want, these people are powerful market aswell, helping to fuel more fortunate people with higher income, but not high enough to spend 50 EUR on new entertainment each month... if you take away their possibility to sell their games seconhand, they just say themselves "**** YOU, I AM GONNA BUY ME AN IPHONE, THEY HAVE GAMES FOR 10EUR EACH I DONT NEED YOUR 50EUR DIGITAL ONLY **** WHICH I CAN'T SELL"

 

to blame everyone else, except myself, is always the easiest thing for humankind to do...

 

edit: more and more people are in these rough economical time just waiting to buy Platinum/Game of the Year/Budget versions of games... even Gabe Newell admited at some time, that most sales they see, is when they do make special sales offer for 10 USD or less...

Edited October 27, 2009 by Mamoulian War

[Mamoulian War]

And yes, i have forgotten one more thing to say, which makes me wonder everytime i think about it, about publishers/developers business sense...

 

with digital only you are killing one profitable bussiness model aswell, media renting... Mr and Mrs Average do not have a clue nor give a damn about digital delivery, but would be happy to spent some cash while going to WalMart/<insert your big local shopping centre name here> rent for his kiddie Joe Average Jr. some games for few dollars...

 

PS3 is out for 3 years and is still uncracked, so if you guys would rather stop bitching about how hard to code it is for PS3 and finaly learn how to do it properly, and rather used all the money and effort you spent on destroying 2nd hand market, into working rental system, you could have already collected few billions <insert your favourite currency here> on royalties, in these 3 years.

 

but yeah, i bet, this lost opportunity is accounted into piracy and second hand sales when you show your annual bottomline to your shareholders, right?

 

EDIT: It is realy ridiculous, how long is your business whining about piracy, and when someone offers you crack-proof (at least until now) all you do is whine about how hard it is to code for... Man just have to wonder how serious is the piracy threat to your business, when you are wasting this opportunity...

Edited October 27, 2009 by Mamoulian War

[Nightshape]

*yawn*

 

You speak to me as if I'm some kind of publisher, whom is also a spokes person. I am not! All I've done is say which direction the industry is going in, and why. Venting your anger at me personally, well that's just silly, obviously you feel very passionately about this, but what you need to realise is that second hand sales and rental services don't help the industry, they benefit retail exclusively, poor software is the result of lack of money for investment, this is see to be a result of the rental/second hand market.

 

Also digital distribution should encourage prices to even out, as retail is currently taking a huge slice of the pie. Removal of retail should reduce prices, and increase quality because profits will be directed to the correct place.

 

As far as the PS3 goes, it isn't hard to code for, it's just not as easy as the XBOX 360, hence the turn around and development of engines has taken longer, because it requires more man hours. The PS3 is starting to have its day, but lets just make it clear, as far as the PS3 goes, alot of people may very well have bought into alot of marketing *ahem*, or maybe they haven't.

[Killian Kalthorne]

PS3 is the Mac of the console world. Nice hardware, but the software conversion is a slow drawn out process. I guess that would make the Wii Linux.

 

[vault_overseer]

I really like new B&N Nook and how you can lend books to others with it. I'd like to see something similar with games.

[Gfted1]

Removal of retail should reduce prices, and increase quality because profits will be directed to the correct place.

 

 

Should, would, could, but doesnt. Not only are DD prices exactly the same as retail, in countries with different currency they are frequently significantly higher then retail. It could be argued that DD is a shameless moneygrab by the producers as they obviously arent passing the savings to the customer. Less for more, yay!

[Killian Kalthorne]

Yep. Take Oblivion for example. Plain old Oblivion on XBox Live costs $30. You can get the Game of the Year edition of Oblivion at the store for that price new, maybe less in some other locations.

[Purkake]

It doesn't reduce prices, at least compared to retail games. What it does do, especially on the PC, is let people make cheaper games and sell them at cheaper prices. Almost none of the download-only games cost anywhere near $50.

Edited October 27, 2009 by Purkake

[Mamoulian War]

Also digital distribution should encourage prices to even out, as retail is currently taking a huge slice of the pie. Removal of retail should reduce prices, and increase quality because profits will be directed to the correct place.

 

All i can say is, that i wish you all luck to sell games like Forza Motorsport 3 or Uncharted 2 through digital distribution to all the people with 10GB per month data caps...

Edited October 27, 2009 by Mamoulian War

[Purkake]

If it becomes big enough the ISPs will happily make a deal with the platform holders to let that traffic ignore the cap. All you need is a little money to grease the ISP's palms.

[Mamoulian War]

If it becomes big enough the ISPs will happily make a deal with the platform holders to let that traffic ignore the cap. All you need is a little money to grease the ISP's palms.

 

and then everybody will start to cry that ISPs are killing the game industries, because they demand extra money for using their tubes, while ignoring the data caps

 

same situation as with classical retailers, but i bet my left nut, that ISPs would want to have even bigger cut of the pie than retailers

[Nightshape]

If it becomes big enough the ISPs will happily make a deal with the platform holders to let that traffic ignore the cap. All you need is a little money to grease the ISP's palms.

 

and then everybody will start to cry that ISPs are killing the game industries, because they demand extra money for using their tubes, while ignoring the data caps

 

same situation as with classical retailers, but i bet my left nut, that ISPs would want to have even bigger cut of the pie than retailers

 

Oh please... This is tiresome, we're all going to find out eventually.