October 7, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Master was good; Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I thought Kreia had good potential but I didn't really get it with her in the end. She reminded me of Ravel in Torment. But it seemed like there was something missing from her story at the end. I think that RPG developers should avoid sacrificing the story of critical characters in order to meet deadlines - even when those story elements are not otherwise critical for the player. As dark is the absence of light, so evil is the absence of good. If you would destroy evil, do good. Evil cannot be perfected. Thank God.
October 7, 200619 yr Kreia was love/hate, and it's Volourn, so. Let's Play: Icewind Dale Ironman (Complete) Let's Play: Icewind Dale II Ironman (Complete) Let's Play: Divinity II (Complete) Let's Play: Baldur's Gate Trilogy Ironman - BG1 (Complete) Let's Play: Baldur's Gate Trilogy Ironman - BG2 (In Progress)
October 7, 200619 yr SHODAN is the best game villain of all time. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> There definately was something about Shodan. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So we heard. Hades was the life of the party. RIP You'll be missed.
October 7, 200619 yr Ahh, Shodan. She was always putting me down. It didn't do my self-esteem any good.
October 7, 200619 yr The best type of villain is one who keeps knocking you done. It builds up your will to defy the odds and kick her ass. Hades was the life of the party. RIP You'll be missed.
October 8, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Dude, I disagree with you, and I`ll use my right as a pseudo-intellectual gamer to speak my opininon where it is not wanted. Kreia`s one of the few characters that had a lasting impact on me. She still sometimes speaks to me, even after the game, she still sometimes warns me or guides me when I am about to make a choice, she is still my mentor. I have only played trough Kotor 2 once, and when I checked some dialogue few days ago, I discovered that I remembered almost every word that Kreia spoke exactly how it was written in the game. I fell in love with her. I like so totally connected with her, I understood everything she said. She wasn`t just a character, she spoke directly at my heart. She knew me, and she healed me. I am a better person now, she enlightened me, she cast away the blindness and revealed to me the Light. I know now the Truth. I know and I do not fear. She was the best Master ever. Enough with the dancing clown.
October 8, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> words <{POST_SNAPBACK}> dude, you know her dialog was written by a sweaty 40-year old nerd, right?
October 8, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> words <{POST_SNAPBACK}> dude, you know her dialog was written by a sweaty 40-year old nerd, right? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I know. That sweaty 40-year old nerd is my idol. Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer. Edited October 8, 200619 yr by Winterwolf Enough with the dancing clown.
October 8, 200619 yr I think I like my villains to be like my player character, but cracked - like looking in a broken mirror - with a story I can understand. The twins in IWD II were nice in that way (but not well enough developed). As dark is the absence of light, so evil is the absence of good. If you would destroy evil, do good. Evil cannot be perfected. Thank God.
October 8, 200619 yr Different people like different villians. It's just the way things are. And this is a good thing. (w00t)
October 8, 200619 yr Seems like villain awesomeness depends on how much screentime they get to develop their character. Spreading beauty with my katana.
October 8, 200619 yr Seems like villain awesomeness depends on how much screentime they get to develop their character. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Exactly, that was what Melissan didn't had, people have to get the villain to know better.
October 8, 200619 yr As for good characters becoming villains, the only immediate example I can think of is in the Max Payne series. Theirs a particular character who serves as an ally of sorts in the first and a villain in the second. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That was done extremely well. Vlad was my favorite character in the first game, and he was still my favorite character for most of the second game. I was just as blindsided by his betrayal as Max was, and I wished I could've returned the favor by putting a bullet in his head rather than that hinky shoot the pins out of the scaffolding sequence. Superb friend and villian, superb plot twist. RIP
October 8, 200619 yr Also I need another friggin' Max Payne. I'm sure Alan Wake will be good and all, but it's just not the same. RIP
October 8, 200619 yr A good villain (and a good game) will keep you up at night. I played through the last part of BG2 in about 8 hours of straight gameplay, because I couldn't break the tension. Join me, and we shall make Production Beards a reality!
October 8, 200619 yr Dark Raven: "The Valsharess from HotU. " The Valsharess was a character with depth: whenever she appeared, it was like parts of her were popping out of the screen. "When is this out. I can't wait to play it so I can talk at length about how bad it is." - Gorgon.
October 8, 200619 yr The Valsharess was a character with depth: whenever she appeared, it was like parts of her were popping out of the screen. So I take it she had great boobs? Swedes, go to: Spel2, for the latest game reviews in swedish!
October 8, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> words <{POST_SNAPBACK}> dude, you know her dialog was written by a sweaty 40-year old nerd, right? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I know. That sweaty 40-year old nerd is my idol. Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Kreia is great villain when talking about games. In literature however, Kreia wouldn't be very special villain. How can it be a no ob build. It has PROVEN effective. I dare you to show your builds and I will tear you apart in an arugment about how these builds will won them. - OverPowered Godzilla (OPG)
October 8, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> words <{POST_SNAPBACK}> dude, you know her dialog was written by a sweaty 40-year old nerd, right? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I know. That sweaty 40-year old nerd is my idol. Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Kreia is great villain when talking about games. In literature however, Kreia wouldn't be very special villain. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> We weren`t talking about literature. But anyway, never thought of Kreia as a villain, imo the storyline in Kotor 2 was even worse than in Kotor 1: travel trough 4 planets, ooh an plot twist, already an ending? But the characters felt so refreshing. But enough about Kreia. As to my favorite villain, I find most of them lacking in computer games, although perhaps this might be because I haven`t played a lot of them (only most of the games from Ultima IV to Broken Sword 4). What I really would like to see is someone really evil. Irenicus, Sarevok, Guardian, von Glower - they are not truly evil, a little naughty yes, but nothing really irredeamable. I would like to see someone who orders his men to rape the wives and daughter before the eyes of their men, I would like to see someone who puts people on the stake just because he is tired of screwing his Harem and needs to find other things to keep them amused, I would like to see a mass execution were the ordinary good citizens clap their hands in joy while the executioner cuts the head of a little 5-year old girl, I would like to see sack of Bagdad type of evil. French Revolution, Mongolians, history is just full of great evil, why we still need to bear with yet another cartoony villain with a bad childhood. Enough with the dancing clown.
October 8, 200619 yr On a related note, the NWN2 temporary box at EB's got a M rating. Is that the final rating? Spreading beauty with my katana.
October 9, 200619 yr The Valsharess was a character with depth: whenever she appeared, it was like parts of her were popping out of the screen. So I take it she had great boobs? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> So so. Ripburger! Ahh, Mark Hamill. So good at being so bad.
October 9, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> words <{POST_SNAPBACK}> dude, you know her dialog was written by a sweaty 40-year old nerd, right? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I know. That sweaty 40-year old nerd is my idol. Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Kreia is great villain when talking about games. In literature however, Kreia wouldn't be very special villain. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> We weren`t talking about literature. [snip] <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, but you said "Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer.", So I with no actual reason wanted to point out that Kreia is not that special. How can it be a no ob build. It has PROVEN effective. I dare you to show your builds and I will tear you apart in an arugment about how these builds will won them. - OverPowered Godzilla (OPG)
October 9, 200619 yr "The Master and Kreia were good evil bad guys." Kreia was horrible. She was one dimensional, obvious, and wannabe intellect who failed at that. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> words <{POST_SNAPBACK}> dude, you know her dialog was written by a sweaty 40-year old nerd, right? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, I know. That sweaty 40-year old nerd is my idol. Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Kreia is great villain when talking about games. In literature however, Kreia wouldn't be very special villain. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> We weren`t talking about literature. [snip] <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yeah, but you said "Anyone who can up with a character like Kreia, is most probably going to end up as my most favorite writer.", So I with no actual reason wanted to point out that Kreia is not that special. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Maybe he doesnt read.
October 9, 200619 yr On a related note, the NWN2 temporary box at EB's got a M rating. Is that the final rating? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> From information I have seen at the Bio boards its rated Teen. Hades was the life of the party. RIP You'll be missed.
October 9, 200619 yr On EBgames.com the image of the box is labeled RP and the item description rates the game T.
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