Medieval: Total War II

[alanschu]

So, I finally decided to do some research on this game, and so far I'm really stoked!

 

 

I love the idea that you can finally recruit more than one unit at a time, provided of course you have the money and the manpower.

 

I'm looking forward to this since I won't have to keep gigantic standing armies when not at war.

 

I also love the ideas behind guilds, and the city/castle system. Oboyoboyoboyoboy :D

[Pidesco]

Is there a release date already for this game?

[alanschu]

Best I have heard is Winter 2006.

 

IGN has the European date set at November 24, 2006.

 

 

EDIT: They also talk about a soon to be released demo! :D

Edited August 31, 2006 by alanschu

[Tigranes]

Since I loved MTW more than RTW, I'm quibblin'.

 

Still, the biggest problems with TW have always been AI, both battlefield and campaign (nevermind the stupid diplomacy that doesn't work, inability to found new cities/real forts on the campaign map (I think this was addressed?) and siegecentric mentality). If these are fixed then we have a truly wonderful game on our hands; if not, then sure I'll buy it and play it, but the novelty won't last long.

 

...that and there won't be much novelty with a Radeon 9600.

[alanschu]

I don't think you can found new cities perse, but you can decide whether they'll become populated, money making trade centers (cities) or a military focused castle.

 

Sieges are definitely common place, but it's much, much easier to get into a fight outside of a siege with the new map style that Rome brought in (and it looks like M2 is using the same idea). I actually don't really mind sieges...it's just that it seems the AI is rarely willing to do an offensive one unless it has a huge numbers advantage. This is probably smart from a unit preservation perspective, but it'd be nice if I wasn't always bashing down the walls on a siege, and defending them on occassion.

 

It seems like the "cities" will be more Rome style city fighting sieges, probably with a town wall, with the Castle being huge, multilayered walls (go go Citadel!). I'd love to have some epic sieges take place...but they just don't seem to happen too often. Why press forth when you can just hang out and let them sally forth and fight on the defensive.

 

I know they are trying to allow for more variety in diplomacy, and are also giving you an indicator as to whether or not the trade is balanced, generous, or demanding. You'll also have an idea of what their situation is like financially, and militarily (hopefully this info is based on spies and whatnot), and you can make a more demanding trade if it will take advantage of a weakness (Offering even just a bit of money to a broke nation is potentially a good idea, even if it means "losing" the trade).

 

 

I have mixed feelings about founding new cities, because I think it'd be too easy to just have the map cluttered with cities. If you thought it was siege centric before, imagine if you have a few extra cities to go through!

[Calax]

I'd love it if I could make a field fort that was more than a bunch of circled wagons (wild west TOtal WAR

[Tigranes]

Sieges are definitely common place, but it's much, much easier to get into a fight outside of a siege with the new map style that Rome brought in (and it looks like M2 is using the same idea). I actually don't really mind sieges...it's just that it seems the AI is rarely willing to do an offensive one unless it has a huge numbers advantage. This is probably smart from a unit preservation perspective, but it'd be nice if I wasn't always bashing down the walls on a siege, and defending them on occassion.

 

Actually, I thought it was easier to get a big decisive field battle going in MTW; certainly you didn't have to chase down individual stacks all over the place, since there was only a certain number of places you could go to. AI invasions would also take the form of stacks coming into your province, so youc ould choose to fight a battle or be sieged. When I am sieged I hate attacking the besiegers because it takes 10 minutes just to get everyone out the door with the stupid pathfinding, and its not like the AI takes that opportunity to attack you anyway.

 

'd love to have some epic sieges take place...but they just don't seem to happen too often. Why press forth when you can just hang out and let them sally forth and fight on the defensive.

 

Precisely. I actually liked medieval sieges better, because there was a lot more room to fight inside the castle as well (in the courtyards); RTW is like trying to control 500 men with 1995 pathfinding.

 

I have mixed feelings about founding new cities, because I think it'd be too easy to just have the map cluttered with cities. If you thought it was siege centric before, imagine if you have a few extra cities to go through!

 

Agreed. I was thinking more in terms of smaller villages or walled military forts; and the fortunes of the cities, trade routes and empires will dictate the prosperity of that city (as well as neighbouring resources). You could found a city in a strategic position to guard military, or direct trade away from a rival city; if an empire collapsed, that empire's capital may decline and lose population, etc, etc. But TW has always been a battle-centric game, and the campaign map really often devolves into where and when to fight your next battle. I suppose I'm looking forward to MTW2 for that, and EU3 for the other part of strategy... once again.

[kumquatq3]

the new religion system seems fun

 

 

Fairly certain this is going to rock hard

[Musopticon?]

I'm also waiting for the new religion system the most. Everything else is guaranteed to be good and I'm actually eager to take on the new world.

 

I'm just hoping that the amount of morale is increased from RTW, because the fights in the vanilla campaign were ridiculous. Oh, and it would be nice to not have one faction above them all, Rome as a faction was just too good. It had every unit imaginable except HA, ellies and chariots, plus the best frontline troops in the game, that ALSO had 2 hitpoints. I mean, c'mon, make a balanced game, not this factioncentric crap.

 

Oh, realistic colors would be nice too. I'm still horrified by the pink Parthians and cyan Sassanids.

Edited September 1, 2006 by Musopticon?

[alanschu]

Well, Rome is the star of Rome: Total War, so it probably makes the most sense.

 

It's also a faction that (barring mods) everyone is going to play.

 

 

As for M2TW, I sort of expect a bit of bias towards Western Europe (Eastern Europe and the Middle East/Africa seem to have less cities). Looking forward to the Zweilhanders of the Holy Roman Empire.

 

The fights also look cool, with soldiers actually parrying, and providing visual feedback of actually landing blows. Eye candy, but when it's a good game, eye candy is always appreciated.

[Tigranes]

Rome: Total War was designed to have Roman supremacy from the start, so MTW2 will definitely not have that. I too am glad to see Rome gone. I mean they've always had and will have tendencies to focus more on the West, especially because information is more 'ready' (not more plentiful) on those areas.

 

So far the colours have been good, afaik, and perhaps the cashies from Rome and the Sega backing will act positively and we will not have fluorescent warriors anymore. Still, things like that and morale values are easily modded even by those such as myself; I think the real factors in how much better this iteration is going to be is in core gameplay decisions such as those regarding cities, siege/field battle ratios, AI, etc.

 

What's the latest on guilds anyway?

[alanschu]

Sounds like guilds approach you based on how you act, and you can allow them to set up a guild hall in a province.

 

Making lots of trade income, the merchants guild will come calling. Assassinating people, sniper crossbow style? Assassin's guild comes a knocking.

 

The guilds will also provide missions for you to do.

 

 

I'm not sure if you'll be able to approach the guilds or whatnot, but it sounds like they provide some pretty significant bonuses. I imagine an Assassin's Guild will probably get you higher quality assassins (always sucks training them on useless captains and crap diplomats in Rome). The merchants guild seems to have significant boosts to your trade economy.

 

To make things interesting, it sounds like you can only have one guild per city (now when it says city, I'm not sure if it means town/province, or actual city as opposed to castle....I'm interested either way), so you have to make some decisions.

 

 

Speaking of missions, it sounds like when a factions asks you for help in exchange for something, it sounds like it becomes a mission. Helps with record keeping and whatnot...reminding you of the details of the mission.

[Tigranes]

That sounds fantabulous. (w00t)

Edited September 1, 2006 by Tigranes

[Musopticon?]

Yeah, I hadn't even heard of these guilds. It seems like there's going to be more depth than RTW.

[Xard]

System requirements yet revealed?

Edited September 1, 2006 by Xard

[alanschu]

I haven't seen any.

[alanschu]

The uneven terrain makes for cool looking cities:

 

http://media.pc.ign.com/media/800/800327/img_3860055.html

Edited September 1, 2006 by alanschu

[Xard]

I agree totally *drools*

 

Man, another reason to get new computer ASAP

[Tigranes]

Dear lord, that's a great looking city.

 

At the same time, it's a pathfinding HELL if that AI doesn't improve. We've still got the narrow streets, tiny tower gates and 'section''d walls.

[Calax]

worse pathfinding can be found tigranes...

 

I wond if they put sucession wars in.

[alanschu]

Yes, I hope the pathfinding in towns is better.

 

Though for the most part I was able to make due in Rome. The most annoying parts were coming up and down walls.

[alanschu]

Guilds I have found:

 

Assassins Guild

Masons Guild

Theologians Guild

Merchants Guild

Alchemists Guild

Thieves Guild

Explorers Guild

Swordsmiths Guild.

[Tigranes]

Though for the most part I was able to make due in Rome. The most annoying parts were coming up and down walls.

 

Yes. Fighting was often over by the time I got inside the town anyway.

 

I wond if they put sucession wars in.

 

One thing that would really be excellent is to designate rebels to proper 'factions'. Each 'faction' of rebels that appear will have a specific reason for rebelling; for example, if a city rebels it can rebel in concert with some other cities, then they will be a faction that wants liberation, though some may be more amenable to limited rights and re-annexation; disinherited heirs could rally a couple of family members and cities to themselves and start a rebellion, though this could be easily dissipated once the leader himself was killed; etc, etc.

[Calax]

I just realized how bad my previous post was... ugh

 

I was looking at the boards for this and it would appear the turn system will be 2 per year. Meaning it's exactly like RTW. It was interesting to learn people like to roleplay their leader.

[alanschu]

Man, I seriously don't think I have been this hyped for a game since Half-Life 2.