KotoR 3: Ideas and Suggestions

[astr0creep]

It still looks like the only way to cater to most peoples whims is to copy Suikoden III's model.

 

In essence the game is split into three sub stories with each having it's own protagonist. As the game progresses the level of the protagonist raises. Protagonist one will start off at level 1 , two will start off at level 20 etc.

 

All will end up more or less the same level at the point you have to make a choice of which to use to the end. The others will then take on other roles determined by the story.

 

The problem is if you only have a 40 hour game thats a lot of leveling in a short period of time to get the characters upto the same sort of levels.

 

It should go without saying that the story should be concluded here period. Any further games need a clean slate so this sort of effort isnt required again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That's not a bad idea.

 

But I don't want to think about the implications it has for QA

 

And 40 hours is too short for any RPG. There should at least be the possibility of 100 hours of gameplay.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Why just 40 hours of gameplay? How about having a really complex story tree that takes into account just about everything you'd be able to do in the game, so instead of having three stories you'd have a really complex story no matter what you do that changes depending on what you do? The technology is there it just requires a lot of writing. A lot a lot.

Also I like the idea of picking your revan and exile and I put forth the notion that the typical RPG fan, even console fans aren

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

That's not a bad idea.

 

But I don't want to think about the implications it has for QA   

 

And 40 hours is too short for any RPG. There should at least be the possibility of 100 hours of gameplay.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well all credit to the makers of Suikoden III.

 

I dont think it would be particularly bad. The number of outcomes are not infinite by any means.

 

Well KOTOR and KOTOR II average at that or less, and Jade Empire at about half that so thats the benchmark that seemed appropriate.

 

100 hours is tough to pull off unless you introduce a lot of time sinks. I'd guess at that point your looking at more than one DVD.

 

FFX I played and got 90 something same with FFIX I'd guess ShadowHearts:Covenenet would be around that , or more since I was pushing 90 and still didnt complete everything (Thats on 2 DVD's btw).

[astr0creep]

That's not a bad idea.

 

But I don't want to think about the implications it has for QA   

 

And 40 hours is too short for any RPG. There should at least be the possibility of 100 hours of gameplay.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well all credit to the makers of Suikoden III.

 

I dont think it would be particularly bad. The number of outcomes are not infinite by any means.

 

Well KOTOR and KOTOR II average at that or less, and Jade Empire at about half that so thats the benchmark that seemed appropriate.

 

100 hours is tough to pull off unless you introduce a lot of time sinks. I'd guess at that point your looking at more than one DVD.

 

FFX I played and got 90 something same with FFIX I'd guess ShadowHearts:Covenenet would be around that , or more since I was pushing 90 and still didnt complete everything (Thats on 2 DVD's btw).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I never tried Covenant because I hated the first Shadow Hearts.

[Weiser_Cain]

I have Disgaea, Makai Kingdom, and Phantom Brave. Running throw the game should take at least 60 hours if not more. This will most likely be the last game in the series, better make it good.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

I never tried Covenant because I hated the first Shadow Hearts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What did you hate about it ? And I'd keep away from Darque if I were you she might bite you if she hears that :D

 

I thought covenent was a lot better than the first one anyway.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

I have Disgaea,  Makai Kingdom, and Phantom Brave. Running throw the game should take at least 60 hours if not more. This will most likely be the last game in the series, better make it good.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Really never could get the hang of Phantom Brave having my army disapear was annoying :D

 

Playtimes always a tough call since it's so variable. Although you get the odd exception like Jade Empire which is clearly and obviously short.

 

Games like Disgaea will take longer because of the slower pacing. I think off hand it took me 120 hours and thats without doing any of the alternate endings. Yuki who tends to be more of a completist than I , put around 400-500 hours into it. If the game is 60 , 80 or 100 hours so much the better. But being a realist I'm not expecting that to be the case.

 

There is a tendancy to want to fit things on to one DvD especially this early in a consles life and I think that will be a limiting factor , unless they go with the PS3's blu ray of course.

[astr0creep]

I never tried Covenant because I hated the first Shadow Hearts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What did you hate about it ? And I'd keep away from Darque if I were you she might bite you if she hears that :D

 

I thought covenent was a lot better than the first one anyway.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I found it bland, repetitive and boring and that was enough to turn me away from it. I didn't like the main character either, like a jerky Cloud Strife(although I love Cloud).

I liked the combat system and the setting though but the story, well I didn't play enough of it to like it, due to the repetitiveness.

Pacing was too slow as well.

 

I felt like a was playing a pale copy of Final Fantasy 7.

 

And if Darque wants to hurt me... I'll PM her my phone number and address...

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

I found it bland, repetitive and boring and that was enough to turn me away from it. I didn't like the main character either, like a jerky Cloud Strife(although I love Cloud).

I liked the combat system and the setting though but the story, well I didn't play enough of it to like it, due to the repetitiveness.

Pacing was too slow as well.

 

I felt like a was playing a pale copy of Final Fantasy 7.

 

And if Darque wants to hurt me... I'll PM her my phone number and address... 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

He reminded me more of Squall.

 

The second one refines pretty much everything as well as being huge.

 

I'd take it over FFVII any day to be honest. but then FFVII is low on my FF list.

[astr0creep]

Ok.

 

To get back on topic :

 

There should be Jedis and Sith in KOTOR3

 

[Darth Duck]

I drew a comic to illustrate my point: see attachment

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

"

 

Amusing ...

 

Weak, but amusing ...

[Dyan]

I'd like to see a Biege coloured lightsabre. Just for kicks.

[Darth Duck]

they definitely need to introduce opportunity costs with regard to lightsaber forms and make it so where you allocate points into specific forms as you level up...Jade Empire has something along these lines.

 

and, speaking of Jade Empire, that game proves that you can have RT combat and still have a third-person, stat-based RPG.  I think the idea of having real time combat (especially if they do it similar to the Obi-Wan game, in which you have an incredible amount of control of the saber) would be great.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

My point, exactly ... and as icing on the cake, Jade Empire was BioWare! I think it's safe to say that most KOTOR fans would like to see BioWare take another crack at it.

 

I think Obsidian did a fine job, personally, and could probably run with the ball on KOTOR III if they were given enough time to do the project properly ... but I gather from the notes and diaries of the Obsidian and LA developers, that they were not only rushed but were using graphics technology they considered sub-standard (I'm reading that into it -- they never said that in so many words, but it was strongly implied). I think the mistakes in KOTOR II were administrative, not creative, and that can be remedied.

 

That said, Obsidian may not have the time or the resources needed to start a project of this size.

[Darth Duck]

Why just 40 hours of gameplay? How about having a really complex story tree that takes into account just about everything you'd be able to do in the game, so instead of having three stories you'd have a really complex story no matter what you do that changes depending on what you do? The technology is there it just requires a lot of writing. A lot a lot.

Also I like the idea of picking your revan and exile and I put forth the notion that the typical RPG fan, even console fans aren

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Hey, that goes for X-Box users, too!  Morrowind remains one of the top X-Box titles, and there is nothing simple about that game.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Umm ok..

[Darth Duck]

Hey, that goes for X-Box users, too!  Morrowind remains one of the top X-Box titles, and there is nothing simple about that game.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Umm ok..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

You disagree?

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

You disagree?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

About Morrowind being complex ? Well I wouldnt personally call it complex the Xbox control scheme is probably the most complex thing about it.

 

Baten Kaitos, now thats complex. Perhaps even more so than Disgaea if your the completeist type.

 

While there are undoubtably stupid console owners I dont think the idea that games need to be made less complex holds any merit whatever the platform.

[Darth Duck]

You disagree?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

About Morrowind being complex ? Well I wouldnt personally call it complex the Xbox control scheme is probably the most complex thing about it.

 

Baten Kaitos, now thats complex. Perhaps even more so than Disgaea if your the completeist type.

 

While there are undoubtably stupid console owners I dont think the idea that games need to be made less complex holds any merit whatever the platform.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well, I disagree about Morrowind. When I think of complex, I think of open-endedness. To me, the more freedom the player has to influence the course of events as well as the ultimate outcome, or to not influence them at all, the more complex the game is. Games with tough puzzles or mental mazes are not necessarily complex (they can be, but it's not a given) ... just difficult. Difficult does not equal complex.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Well, I disagree about Morrowind.  When I think of complex, I think of open-endedness.  To me, the more freedom the player has to influence the course of events as well as the ultimate outcome, or to not influence them at all, the more complex the game is.  Games with tough puzzles or mental mazes are not necessarily complex (they can be, but it's not a given) ... just difficult.  Difficult does not equal complex.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Difficult is a very subjective thing. Disgaea was complex but I didnt find it difficult.

 

A puzzle may be complex, but you may just look at it and see the solution. In which case it's not difficult.

[alanschu]

Err....all you really did was repeat what he just said Shadow.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Err....all you really did was repeat what he just said Shadow.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Kind of but from the other direction.

[hawk]

As each day passes by, with no news of a K3, I'm beginning to wonder. Does anybody want to clean up the mess? What I mean by that is, K3 is going to be a big headache for the writers, it's not going to be an easy task.

 

WHAT I WANT IN K3 IS...

 

-  To play as a new main character

-  The ability to lie to your companions in order to gain influence with them

-  A game that is not rushed and is not so god damn bug and glitch ridden!

-  I want the story to take place something like 2-4 years after K2

-  I want to be able to choose the genders and alignments of Revan and the Exile

-  I want them to get rid of the random item generator

-  I want storyline closure

-  I want the same combat system but I want better graphics

-  I want more than just the LS or DS ending. I want a neutral ending, I also want an ending where I'm able to command a combined Mandalore-HK Army and go against the Jedi, the Republic and the Sith. I want at least 4 different endings

-  I want hooded robes

 

WHAT I DON'T WANT IN K3 IS...

 

-  Well, I want them to make the game for starters! I don't want them to abandon this project

-  I don't want to play as Revan and/or the Exile but I don't mind playing as them towards the end of the game

-  I don't want LucasArts to push for an early release for K3, resulting in an incomplete, cut-content ridden mess of a game

-  I don't want K3 to be a prequel game and I don't want the story to take place any further than 10 years after K2

-  I don't want them to have a fixed gender, alignment and worst of all, appearence for Revan and the Exile, I want to choose all that!

-  I don't want the random item generator in K3

-  I  don't want them to change the combat system and I don't want this to be an action/advenutre type of game. I want it to be an RPG with plenty of dialogue choices, just like the previous KOTOR's

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Exactly.

Same combat system isn't really neccesary as long as it is good system and it could be handled by people who are aged 50+. Not that I am one myself but I remember when people complained about the Turret game in Kotor I. That's one good job Obsidian did when they made all mini games optional.

I often let all the sith troopers board the Ebon Hawk on Peragus so I will get some new items and a lot of XP.

T3 is on that moment the best party member you can use for this task.

Okay, some other things I would like to see are:

 

- Customizable lightsaber hilts.

- A Yoda/Yaddle/Vandar species as a party member.

- Realistic grenades / rockets and mine damage. In Kotor I and two you could just stand there and walk through them and loosing maybe 1/6 of your vitality on level difficult. Not realistic.

- How about the often rumoured group stealth.

- If there are new force powers I want to be able to force throw. I would like to throw footlockers / plasteel cylinders and maybe computer consoles to opponents. Off course they should also be able to throw them to you.

[Dyan]

So anyone got any ideas for plots? *ASIDE* from the Architect

[Weiser_Cain]

So anyone got any ideas for plots? *ASIDE* from the Architect

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sure, but I don't think they'll accept script submissions in the form of posts written completely in leet speak.

How's this, another five years have passed, there's a dire threat to the republic (the one revan foresaw) though most are unaware of it for the fact that conflict has already returned to the republic (they

[hawk]

So anyone got any ideas for plots? *ASIDE* from the Architect

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well yes, but when I post a thing like that on this forum, almost nobody cares. It's a waste of time writing a thing like that.

 

To Weiser_Cain.

Sorry but I don't think I understand what this is all about. And this pilot/tech specialist/fringer thing?

I always say, forget it. There are enough choices to be made in the game and the non jedi thing is just for people who have played the game a 1000 times and are tired of being a Jedi / Sith.

Go strap yourself in an armor and equip a blaster. Then play the game.