NHL

[Volourn]

"I wonder if Volo would even bother posting if there weren't Edmonton fans' buttons to push on these boards."

 

Meh. Edmonton is far the first, or last team to have a disgruntled played who forced a trade or release. the Rangers have been through it. And, I had to 'suffer' through taunts about the Rangers. I managed to survive it.

 

I just dislike this idea that 'fans' think they actually own players, and somehow their feeling of entitlement that they and their team (or in this case, their city) should be a player's number one concern. You know, instead of someone's family.

 

Pronger is far from the first employee that left a company because the family no longer wanted to live in a certain city. It shouldn't be treated like he committed some great sin.

 

To answer the question directly, the existence of Edmonton fans is irrelevant. Besdies, I wodner how many would have made as much fun of the Rangers' collapse in the play-offs if there was a certain Ranger fan whose face could be rubbed in it?

 

R00fles!

Edited July 4, 2006 by Volourn

[Hurlshort]

Well, sports cause emotional responses in both players and fans. You rarely see that in the business world. Arguing on these forums will not stop the fact that Oiler fans will now boo Pronger everywhere he goes. Heck, Shark fans have been booing him for years, and I can't even remember why.

[Kor Qel Droma]

But more important than both your points, Edmonton resigned Marty Reasoner today! He's not the most skilled player on the block, but this guy loves Edmonton and shows more heart than the Rangers entire second line.

[Kor Qel Droma]

Then again I think everyone is going to the Coyotes. 

 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

see?

[Oerwinde]

Holy crap. Vancouver is going to be a vastly different team next season. No Jovo, Allen, Ruutu, Bertuzzi, and possibly Carter.

[Hurlshort]

I think Vancouver made some good moves though. They needed an overhaul, because that team was basically dead after the whole Bertuzzi incident. It seemed like they were just drained by it. They had enough talent to win, but not the heart. The new look will help get rid of that shadow, and Luongo gives them a shot to win on any given night.

[Delta Truth]

I for one am glad that Ruutu is gone from Vancouver what a stupid pest he was . and that stupid smirk . Never wanted to stand up and fight against Dion and Jarome hah

 

anyone think the Northwest division is only gonna be tighter this year. Minnesota made soem good moves and if they sign Gaborik look up

 

I picture that standing as such

 

Calgary "

Edmonton

Minnesota

Colorado

Vancouver

[Kor Qel Droma]

I don't want to agree with you DT, but I will. Thank jebus Ruutu has moved out east.

 

Rumblings on other message boards have Jaro Spacek not wanting to resign with the Oilers either. If that's the case our thinned out blueline will be a little thinner.

 

Who do you trade for? Sergei Gonchar, that's who.

 

Are you catching this Kevin Lowe?

[Draken]

I'm not sure how to feel about the Vancouver overhaul, being a diehard Canucks fan since, it seems, forever.

 

Yes, the new additions could be what we need to actually give it our all and go for the Cup next season, but seeing some of my favorites like Bertuzzi and Jovo leave the team can't help but make me lose a little faith in the team. These guys were with the 'Nucks through the good times and bad. It's hard to see them go...at least, for me, and I probably have too much attatchment to my team.

 

Luongo looks like he'll spice it up, though. He better be well worth the trade. I'm expecting some good work on his part, so I'm not too worried, but you never know.

 

Other than that...I definitley think next season will be interesting.

[Kor Qel Droma]

I wonder who will play with Naslund on their top line. Morrsion didn't do himself any favors last year at all, but having that new French coach might bring him back up to form.

 

And it looks like Anson ( trade me for a bag of pucks and some doritos, please) looks to be on his way out as well. If I were him, I'd sign a one year deal at what the 'Nucks are offering and then try for a big payday. He's been too inconsistant in the last few years to really command any big bucks.

 

Although Vancouver still has two upper level offensive d-men in Salo and Ohlund you have to wonder who else is going to play with Willie Mitchell.

 

I didn't think the northwest division could get any tighter than last year. Looks like I was wrong.

 

And Phoenix will still suck.

[Laozi]

'Hawks continue their trend of making either baffling moves or sitting on their hands, I'm not sure which to file signing Lalime under, baffling?

[mkreku]

Is Samsonov still available? That's one player I'd love to see in a Leafs uniform, especially on the wing of Sundin.. I guess he's a bit too expensive for my blue-and-white's though. Only $4-6 million left on the cap space.

 

Holding my thumbs for Anson Carter instead then!

[Checkpoint]

Is Samsonov still available? That's one player I'd love to see in a Leafs uniform, especially on the wing of Sundin.. I guess he's a bit too expensive for my blue-and-white's though. Only $4-6 million left on the cap space.

 

Holding my thumbs for Anson Carter instead then!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Samsonov will get his $4m+ and you can have him for all I care. Ineffective player made for the regular season.

 

What's with all these teams out of cap room talking about more players? Don't you have enough woes scraping a roster together? Boston are talking about Shanahan and your man Samsonov, Toronto have locked up insane amounts of money on just-above-average-defensemen while looking for forwards, and New Jersey are almost at the cap with Gomez and Gionta unsigned. 'Tis madness I tell you!

 

I like Kevin Lowe's approach better. Stay away from the McKees and the Whites and their humongous contracts, and sign cheap depth players like good old Marty Reasoner. Don't be surprised to see Lowe poach one of these teams for a steal.

[Hurlshort]

Sorry, Samsanov is going to San Jose to play with his buddy Thornton.

[Oerwinde]

I think Vancouver made some good moves though.  They needed an overhaul, because that team was basically dead after the whole Bertuzzi incident.  It seemed like they were just drained by it.  They had enough talent to win, but not the heart.  The new look will help get rid of that shadow, and Luongo gives them a shot to win on any given night.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Most of the changes are fine, but what the hell. Carter was the team's top scorer and they're not willing to give him 2 million?

[Kor Qel Droma]

Well moving Cloutier for essentially nothing should help the Canucks financial situation. They still have nearly half a team to sign still, don't they?

 

And it looks like Spacek has ended up in Buffalo. <_< That's too bad because now Edmonton is even weaker on defence right now.

[Volourn]

Well... hopefully, Cloutier will recover from last year's wash and play as the number oen goalie he is. He had a good record last year though his GAA and S% needs to be improved though his action was limited, of course.

[Kor Qel Droma]

And au revoir to big number 27. Jumping Georges Laraque has decided to join the..ahem...Phoenix Coyotes. Edmontons' teenaged girls will be in trouble without having Georges radio show to call in to talk about their little boyfriend problems.

 

Plus his charity work around the city will be sorely missed. Laraque would go to a kids birthday party if you asked him.

 

I can remember a time when the Oil had three brothers on it. Now there is none.

[alanschu]

I just dislike this idea that 'fans' think they actually own players, and somehow their feeling of entitlement that they and their team (or in this case, their city) should be a player's number one concern. You know, instead of someone's family.

 

I just dislike this idea of you blaming the city of Edmonton for not doing their job. You're slagging on the city and saying it's the fault of the city for not putting in the effort or whatever.

 

Same with things such as it being "obvious that Oilers fans didn't like him" because they're upset he requested a trade. Only if you're being absolute and referring to us liking him as a person. Which is silly, because clearly so few of us actually know him as a person. When fans say they like a player, it's because they like what he contributes to his team (whether on the ice or off of it). I don't expect you to like Jagr as a person, but when you start screaming because you feel he somehow got "cheated" out of being the Hart trophy and essentially insulting the league because of it, it's clear that you "like" Jagr in some way. Would you still like him as much if he asked for a trade and went to say, New Jersey?

 

 

 

As for Delta Truth's assessment, I would love for it to be Edmonton at #2 in the division. I think that will be pretty difficult though. Right now we have a very young defensive corps. Here's the depth chart:

 

Jason Smith

Staios

Bergeron

Greene

Smid (A guess here....I have no idea what he's like but the word on the street is he has tons of upside and could very well be NHL ready this year).

Roy/Dan Smith

 

Not exactly intimidating. The X-Factor is whether or not Tarnstrom is interested in coming back. Not a world better, but he played really well down the stretch of the post-season, and can be a guy that runs a powerplay (he did it Pittsburgh, with less talent up front as far as I'm concerned). It'd make us a bit deeper if nothing else.

 

Our frontline looks a bit better:

 

The top 3:

 

Smyth-Horcoff-Hemsky

Torres-Stoll-Lupul

Moreau-Reasoner-Pisani (an excellent combination in 2003-2004 before Marty was hurt)

 

the 4th line, as it stands now, is getting filled with young players. Probably a bit too young to play on their own, so you'll probably get some mix and matching with the other lines, or perhaps some depth signings like a Dean McAmmond or something. Maybe even hold on to Rem Murray (if he even wants to play for free that is), whom I felt was starting to get his game back throughout the playoffs. The younguns looking to make the roster will be Schremp, Pouliot, Jacques, Winchester, Mikhnov (if he can get through the red tape), Brodziak and probably Peterson.

 

 

With the lineup as it stands now, the Oilers will have to gel and find some good chemistry, as well as totally buy into whatever MacTavish is selling. It'd be cool to see this team play great, as no one expects it. But no one expects it because, on paper, the team still has some growing to do.

 

Having said that, Lowe has shown he can do decent trades in the past. It's still a long ways away from the start of the season. And quite frankly, many of the free agent signings seemed a bit knee-jerkish to me. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Toronto have nearly half of their cap tied up in 4 players (Sundin, Kaberle, McCabe, and Kubina)? New Jersey is screwed with the Malakov and and Mogilny contracts (since they still provide a cap hit, even if they aren't playing). Buffalo's entire team is pretty much a RFA, with 12 of them filing for arbitration. It's possible that teams may have some difficulty signing some of their RFAs, especially if arbitration (69 players have filed) ends up rewarding some relatively high contracts. Which might just be the case, as a lot of players signed for high contracts recently. I'd be particularly concerned if I had an RFA go to arbitration that was a defensemen, whom seem to be very valuable contract wise this off season.

 

 

As for Georges, c'est la vie. Fans around here seem pretty disappointed that he wasn't resigned. Definitely a class act player, even if he wasn't particularly good on the ice. I am a bit surprised though that he got a raise over last year. IMO the time of the enforcer is disappearing, as fights went way down this past year.

[Volourn]

"Would you still like him as much if he asked for a trade and went to say, New Jersey?"

 

I like Jagr as a player. I felt, that as a player, he deserved the MVP. I could care one wit about him as a person 'cause like you said I don't know him as a person which is why if he were to demand a trade tomorrow I wouldn't be referring to him as evil or scum. I'd be dissapointed that my team lost a good player, and that's it. If Jagr wanted to play for NJ, I'd be dissapointed; but I wouldn't act like he somehow owes me anything.

 

Take that in comaprison to the various Edmontonian reactions in this thread about they wish all sort sof nasty stuff on Pronger, and call him all sorts of nasty names.

 

I read an article on another site from an Edmonton fan, and he had the PERFECT reaction to the news. I wish that would rub off on all the immature people who wish death, torture, and maiming on Pronger.

 

And, oh, I don't hate Edmonton. I like Edmonton just fine. I simply hate fans from any city - including NY - who think they own players and pretend to be 'loyal' to players when they are not.

 

 

P.S. Ther eis no asbolutes here. Like anything, different people react different. If you aren't reacting in the way I described above, my 'issue' isn't with you.

 

I've seen Ranger fans act like this before, and I bash them just the same because it's an immature, selfish thing.

[alanschu]

I like Jagr as a player. I felt, that as a player, he deserved the MVP. I could care one wit about him as a person 'cause like you said I don't know him as a person which is why if he were to demand a trade tomorrow I wouldn't be referring to him as evil or scum. I'd be dissapointed that my team lost a good player, and that's it. If Jagr wanted to play for NJ, I'd be dissapointed; but I wouldn't act like he somehow owes me anything.

 

Exactly. People are just disappointed.

 

The wishes that he gets maimed or whatever is just because the city has a strong emotional attachment to the team. They were able to get over the Gretzky and Messier trades. They'll get over the Pronger trade.

[Volourn]

"The wishes that he gets maimed or whatever is just because the city has a strong emotional attachment to the team."

 

There's a definite difference between having a 'stronge motional attachment' to a team, and being a 'psycho' about. Seriously wishing harm on someone because they basically want to switch jobs (for whatever reason) is simply uncalled for and wrong.

 

And, don't tell me that those who have wished harm on him don't mean it; because most definitely some of them actually do. I have a 'strong emotional attachment' to the Rangers but I have NEVER wished harm on any player who for whatever reason has said he wnated to leave the team.

 

There is no exuse for that kind of nonsense. Even if if he had demanded a trade in midseason, or basically stopped trying ther estill be no reason to wish harm on him.

 

But, then again, I'm civilized. I don't think wishing harm on summon whod oens't wish to live in a certain town is a good thing. Meh.

 

Again, it has nothing to do with either it's an Edmontonian, a New Yorker, or hatever city.

 

That's why I laughed at Quebec's reaction to Lindros not wanting to play in Quebec espicially what he did was even cooler than Pronger; because unlike Pronger he never agreed to play for Quebec. He was 'enslaved' to them buy the lame draft system that sports teams have.

 

Still, in good news, Edmonton got someplayers who might possibly turn out to be good players while Pronger now gets to be part of possibly the best defensive tandem in the league.

 

[mkreku]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Toronto have nearly half of their cap tied up in 4 players (Sundin, Kaberle, McCabe, and Kubina)?

Yeah, Belfour is also still biting us in the rear. But Gill and Kubina were definite plusses (mostly Kubina, don't know so much about Gill..) as our defence was.. less than good last season. But we desperately need scoring wingers for our strong centers. That's why I wish they'd spend every little penny they have remaining in the cap room on a player like Anson Carter or Sergei Samsonov. I know both players are kind of overrated (when it comes to salaries) and they both have been quite inconsistant the last few seasons, but still.. they would only have to better players like Chad Kilger and it would be a huge improvement!

 

Just for once.. I would love to see what Sundin could really do if he had talent on his wings. Year in and year out, ever since he got traded to the leafs, he's had to put up with so many deadheads on his line.

 

 

 

There's an article about the (early) signings, on ESPN.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/columns/stor...cott&id=2509753

 

I thought it was quite good in analysing what the teams have gone through so far. I especially liked this part:

 

"Still, long-suffering Washington fans might have been happier if the Caps had shown some sort of pulse, but once again, it appears they'll simply hope someone will show up to see Alexander Ovechkin skate his brains out and Olaf Kolzig get shelled with 40 shots a game."

 

Hahaha! So funny because it's true! )

 

Anyhow, it looks like the Wild (imagine that!) have been the most successful in strengthening their team, so far. They kept Gaborik, added Pavol Demitra, Kim Johnsson, Keith Carney and Mark Parrish. Now that's what I call good trading!

[alanschu]

There's a definite difference between having a 'stronge motional attachment' to a team, and being a 'psycho' about. Seriously wishing harm on someone because they basically want to switch jobs (for whatever reason) is simply uncalled for and wrong.

 

And, don't tell me that those who have wished harm on him don't mean it; because most definitely some of them actually do. I have a 'strong emotional attachment' to the Rangers but I have NEVER wished harm on any player who for whatever reason has said he wnated to leave the team.

 

There is no exuse for that kind of nonsense. Even if if he had demanded a trade in midseason, or basically stopped trying ther estill be no reason to wish harm on him.

 

Uh huh. I'm sure all those people actually want him to be hurt and all that. Unless someone actually DOES harm him, you can't say that anything is "definite."

 

 

Given the rest of your post, I'm not too surprised though. And yes, the players that get drafted are definitely enslaved with no other options in life but indentured servitude.

 

If you actually believe that these people actually wish genuine harm on him based on what you read in front of your computer screen, then that's your problem.

 

But I guess you clearly are the "bigger man." Have a cookie. I personally have had enough, and can't be bothered with you anymore.

 

As for why people rubbed it in when New York lost. Well, when you go around claiming silly things like the Capitals don't think that Ovechkin is their best player because he got benched for a period, what do you expect?

 

Not to mention the mountains of other bull**** you've spewed forth in this thread.

 

Have a nice life.

Edited July 6, 2006 by alanschu

[mkreku]

And this is the reason why I think it should be possible to ban some members from a single thread.. Some people just don't add anything to a discussion, no matter what it's about, and just continue to troll away endlessly. The NHL threads are the best threads on these boards, with one smelly exception.

 

 

 

Moving on: why did Spacek want to leave Edmonton? Didn't he play brilliantly in the playoffs? Why did Edmonton let him go? I understand why Pronger had to leave, but after losing Pronger, wouldn't it be so much more important for Edmonton to try to retain the other solid d-men in the roster? I don't understand that trade.

 

Laraque and Domi are gone. Although Laraque got a new contract (Domi probably won't), it really looks like the end of the big-hearted, talentless enforcers. As long as the physical aspect of the game remains intact (or close to intact) I don't mind at all that they free up roster space for young talent by firing their enforcers. I guess the few fights that will occur in the future will be more "honest" in the coming seasons. By honest I mean that the fights will start between two players that are severely pissed off at each other, instead of between two stupid enforcers who only play for 40 seconds per game and then only to instigate a fight, on orders from the coach.