Canadian Election

[Oerwinde]

Well, election day is monday, any Canuckistani posters wanna post their thoughts and such? I'll be voting NDP again, since Jackie boy and his goons were the only ones who did their job in this last term. Harper just whined about the Liberals corruption for 18 months and tried their best to cripple parliament, Paulie and his party did a good job with what they had, but I have no doubt they did a lot of what they did because they had to and not because they chose to. I like the Grits but after 13 years in power they need a bit of a time out. I wouldn't mind a Conservative minority government because the Liberals, Bloc, and NDP, all being left wing parties, wouldn't let anything too radical be passed. A conservative Majority scares me though. I don't want Canada turning into a little midget version of the US.

Edited January 21, 2006 by Oerwinde

[alanschu]

I'm not too worried about Canada turning into a midget version of the US.

 

If Harper takes the country in that direction, I suspect he'll just find himself back in the Official Opposition next election.

 

I'm not voting Liberal because, one we need change, and two I don't like their current track record. Voting them back in basically tells them "we don't care WTF you did with our money...do whatever you want."

 

I'm not voting NDP because I do not think that their platform is fiscally sound. I'm leery about an obviously left wing party that simply says to "trust them" when asked about how certain policies they propose will be funded.

 

I do tend to be right of center, especially economically. I am more left socially though. I think any time spent by a Conservative government "debating" abortion and whatnot is a waste of time, and I'll make sure to let my MP know that (who stands a good chance of being Conservative this time around). At the very least, I'm hoping for a bit more accountability.

 

 

I did laugh my ass off when the Marxist-Leninist went on TV to talk about his stuff.

 

I'm not sure where you get the idea that the Liberals are a left-wing party though. They're very pragmatic.

 

 

Though what is it exactly about mimcing the US that you wouldn't like? At first glance it just sounds like you've bought into the Liberal ad campaign a bit too heavily.

Edited January 21, 2006 by alanschu

[Oerwinde]

haven't bought into the Liberal ad campaign at all. In fact I haven't seen any Liberal ads. No TV.

 

I have no illusions about the NDP being the best party to lead. I vote for them because I know they won't form the government, but I want them to get more seats. Ideally I'd like to see another Liberal minority with the NDP having increased power.

 

My fear of conservatives is mostly due to what I've seen of the modern republicans down south. I know Canadian conservative politicians are a LOT more liberal than the US conservatives, but they're still pretty much opposite of all my social views, and something like half of my economic views. Their support of for profit health care scares me too. After seeing what my girlfriend is going through down there. She was recently sued by a clinic because she couldn't afford the $150 they charged for a misdiagnosis because she was busy trying to pay the $2000 neurologist bill after being diagnosed with MS(they diagnosed her with an Anxiety Attack, her symptoms were that her entire body had been numb for about 4 days and she was too weak to turn a doorknob). She also can't afford the $200 a month for her MS medication. I'd rather pay my high taxes and not have to worry about going bankrupt if I get sick.

 

I just generally disagree with tax cuts. Yipee, I'll save 200 bucks a year on my taxes. That works out to about 8 bucks a paycheck. Put that 200 bucks a person together and that works out to around 4 billion that the government can use to fund schools, hospitals, debt reduction, etc. So disagreeing on tax cuts pretty much kills any possible support I'd have for a conservative government because thats pretty much the only thing they have going for them. Say what you want about the Liberals, but we are the only western nation not running a deficit.

 

And left wing was a bit inaccurate to describe the Liberals, Left of Centre would be more accurate.

 

Anyway, I like Paul Martin. I just think its a shame he inherited the sponsorship scandal.

Edited January 21, 2006 by Oerwinde

[alanschu]

The reason why we don't have a deficit is because the Liberals, as they stand now, are most definitely not a left-of-center government.

 

They're pragmatic, and at the current moment, are right of center. Particularly on the fiscal end. The only reason why they appear to be left-of-center is because they were in a minority situation. They could either make concessions to the NDP, the Conservatives (not going to happen), or do nothing.

 

 

I'm not a fan of private health care either, but all of your girlfriend's woes could probably have been covered by insurance (at least according to my relatives living in the US). With premiums that aren't unlike the premiums I currently pay for the government health care system I have now. British Columbia, Alberta, and Ontario all charge premiums for health care.

 

Having said that, clinics are already for profit. Doctors are not employees of the government. They run their own clinics, and all they do is bill the provincial government instead of you. And regardless of what the Canada Health Act says, private clinics already provide services covered by the Act. The "two-tier" health care system that everyone is afraid the Conservatives will implement already exists (which would be difficult, as a decision like this is made at the provinical level. Federal involvement in Healthcare is restricted to money and modifying the Canada Health Act).

 

There's also issues with brain drain, facility efficiency, and other fun stuff like that. It was funny listening to my roommate get rejected from some of our local practitioners though, because they weren't accepting new patients.

 

But there's no sense worrying about the Conservatives allowing something that the Liberal party has already allowed.

 

I just generally disagree with tax cuts. Yipee, I'll save 200 bucks a year on my taxes. That works out to about 8 bucks a paycheck.

 

I was thinking on arguing this point, but it's pretty subjective, and not something that I necessarily disagree with. I can see the advantages of both systems. Though looking at it as "8 bucks a paycheque" is no different than thinking "wow it's only $1 per day, what a deal" when buying something. $200/year is $200/year. Though if you have no problems with it, then you don't have any problems with it. Fair enough. I'm relatively indifferent to the issue. I do think that I can handle my money more efficiently than the government (since there isn't a gigantic bureaucracy involved), but I can see the advantages that it can provide. At the same time, that $200/year is food on the table for a poorer family (and I can speak from experience, as my roommate and I - as students - have been able to stretch $200 to cover 1.5-2 months worth of food).

 

As for whether or not lowering taxes is a good thing, I guess you can always consider the Laffer curve when thinking of that.

 

 

You should try to get some TV time in. It's pretty entertaining. Liberals accuse Harper of being un-Canadian, and the Conservatives accuse Martin of using private health clinics, and moving his personal business outside of Canada to get cheaper taxes.

 

 

And interesting observation though, is that the US spends a larger percentage of its GDP on healthcare than Canada does (14% vs 9.5%) Though per capita Canadians probably still get more.

 

 

 

As for other issues, I hate the fact that Paul Martin has "assured us" that if re-elected he'd remove the ability for the federal government to invoke the not-withstanding clause. His concern is definitely with respect to his same sex marriage bill (which I've heard required a hardcore invoking of the party whip to pass). But at the same time, I'd rather we not have to go through our ridiculous amendment process to change the Charter, should a non-elected panel such as the supreme court invoke their power to set a precedent for a law that the majority of Canadians might not agree with.

 

I also hate our House, and would love it if free votes were much, much more common. And I would also love an elected senate.

Edited January 21, 2006 by alanschu

[Deraldin]

And I would also love an elected senate.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

You're just trying to ruin my future job! :'(

 

EDIT: Personally, even though I can't vote in this election as I'm still 10 months away from being considered old enough, I really don't like any of the candidates. All of the local candidates are idiots... <_<

Edited January 21, 2006 by Deraldin

[Volourn]

I've been Liberal all my live; but it's most definitely Conservative time. No way am I supporting the Official Party of Crooks tm.

 

Those who think the Conservatives are some extremists who will make a police state are just using lazy scare tatics in order to try to keep the pathetic Liberals from holding on to power.

 

The NDP are a bunch of wussies so no vote for them.

[alanschu]

And I would also love an elected senate.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

You're just trying to ruin my future job! :'(

 

EDIT: Personally, even though I can't vote in this election as I'm still 10 months away from being considered old enough, I really don't like any of the candidates. All of the local candidates are idiots... <_<

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Hehe, welcome to politics :D

[Draken]

I won't vote Conservative, because if Harper gets into parliament he'll ban gay marriages, and kiss Bush's ass like there's no tomorrow.

 

I'll probably vote NDP in the end, though.

[alanschu]

Right

[Surreptishus]

What are the main campaign issues in this election?

[Deraldin]

Hehe, welcome to politics :D

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Damn you... I'm planning on starting off as an MP and introducing such bills as the "Right to run over slow moving pedestrians bill". From there I'll become Prime Minister for a term or two and then settle down as a senator till I'm 75. After that I might consider retiring from the world of politics. There is only so many days one can skip showing up for work as a senator before they get rid of you. "

[Volourn]

"won't vote Conservative, because if Harper gets into parliament he'll ban gay marriages, and kiss Bush's ass like there's no tomorrow."

 

Rather that then stealing Kanandians' money like the Liberals have been PROVEN to have done.

 

This Chicken Little of accusing the PC Party of extremism is silly, and is quite obviously fialing. It reeks of desperation.

 

As for him 'kissing Bush'; it's better that than the hypocrisy of the Liberals when it comes to their (non) relationship with the US.

 

R00fles!

Edited January 22, 2006 by Volourn

[Deraldin]

What are the main campaign issues in this election?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Election Cheat Sheet

[Surreptishus]

What are the main campaign issues in this election?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Election Cheat Sheet

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks

A few questions

 

1. Whats the voting system? e.g. proportional representation?

2. When was the last time, if ever, a single party had a strong majority in parliament.

3. Which tax is the biggest source of govt revenue?

4. WHat is GST (tax)?

[Draken]

As for him 'kisisng Bush'; it's better that than the hypocrisy of the Liberals when it comes to their (non) relationship with the US.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I suppose, but I just don't want Harper to make us, to use your term Alanschu, a midget version of the U.S. In the end, I guess somekind of a friendship with them would be alright.

 

Heh. On a somewhat related note, I remember seeing a promo for the news at eleven, where the voice over guy said "Bush: Why isn't he returning Paul Martin's calls?", cut to Martin on the phone, looking like a guy who keeps leaving messages on his ex's answering machine.

 

Still not voting Conservative though, because I don't share Harper's beliefs.

[Surreptishus]

alanschu was paraphrasing oerwinde with the midget comment.

Edited January 22, 2006 by Surreptishus

[Volourn]

"I suppose, but I just don't want Harper to make us, to use your term Alanschu, a midget version of the U.S. In the end, I guess somekind of a friendship with them would be alright."

 

Well.. In all fairness, in many ways Kanada is headed that way anyways in many aspects and not so in others.

 

 

"Still not voting Conservative though, because I don't share Harper's beliefs."

 

Fair enough. I also have some disagreemnt in some of his stance slike his anti gay marriage thing; but sadly, I much more opposed crooks being in office. And, the NDP reminds me of a heckler shouting as loud as possible just to be heard. Heh.

Edited January 22, 2006 by Volourn

[Jedihuh?]

NDP for me. if the green party had better leadership they might get my vote

[Draken]

alanschu was paraphrasing oerwinde with the midget comment.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

So he was...my bad!

 

Well.. In all fairness, in many ways Kanada is headed that way anyways in many aspects and not so in others.

 

Although I hate to admit it, you're probably right. Maybe the new government will change that, maybe it won't.

 

Fair enough. I also have some disagreemnt in some of his stance slike his anti gay marriage thing; but sadly, I much more opposed crooks being in office.

 

I can understand where you're coming from. But consider this: Harper is likely to suffer some scandal similar to Martin's sometime or another if he wins, so you have to think of the future as well. What happens if Stevie does have a huge scandal? Then you'll have someone in control who's a crook and who's beliefs you don't agree with.

 

And, the NDP reminds me of a heckler shouting a sloud as posisble just to be heard. Heh.

 

Never heard it that way before! But you make a point. I'll consider that before voting.

[Kor Qel Droma]

We vote on Monday, right?

[Volourn]

Heh. That's the thing with the NDP. I don't hate them. And, if theyw ere to somehow win the elction I certainly wouldn't cry about it; but they just don't have the pizazz to make me *beleive* in them.

 

Tru about posisble future Harper scandals. It's just that, I'd feel off if I didn't vote for someone just because he *might* be corru[t in the future when his closest competition are known to be guilty.

 

I await the day where I can vote Liberal again as, overall, the party is closer to my beliefs than Harper is though It, oo, beleive that too many Kanadians look down on the US to an almost fanatical degree. Mostly because of an inferioty complex since we lap up their culture and have basiclaly made it our own.

 

Heh.

[Deraldin]

What are the main campaign issues in this election?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Election Cheat Sheet

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks

A few questions

 

1. Whats the voting system? e.g. proportional representation?

2. When was the last time, if ever, a single party had a strong majority in parliament.

3. Which tax is the biggest source of govt revenue?

4. WHat is GST (tax)?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

1. First past the post system. All that matters is who wins a riding. You can win more seats with fewer votes if you win all the close riding but lose the one sided ridings.

2. 18 months ago, before the last federal election.

3. Not too sure on this as the only taxes I pay are the GST and PST.

4. GST = Goods and Services Tax, or the Gouge and Screw Tax as my dad just put it. It was created in 1991 by Brian Mulroney.

 

Mostly because of an inferioty complex since we lap up their culture and have basiclaly made it our own.

 

Interesting that you should say that. My final exam in history is an exam where I have to describe the creation of a distinct Canadian culture through the 18-20th centuries. Either that, or I can argue that we don't have a distinct culture.

Edited January 22, 2006 by Deraldin

[Draken]

You make good points, Volourn. I think I may have to rethink my voting plan.

 

Anyways, here's a topic: What's you opinion on the negative ad campaigns?

[alanschu]

I'm not sure why people have such an anti-American sentiment.

 

People talk as if we have crap relations with them at the moment. EG:

In the end, I guess somekind of a friendship with them would be alright.

 

Yes, a friendship with thim is alright, because we're each other's largest trading partner. A large part of Canada's economy is related to US trade.

 

 

1. Whats the voting system? e.g. proportional representation?

 

It's a parliamentary democracy, with a first-past the post system. There's 301(ish) seats in the House of Commons. The candidate that receives the most votes in a constiuency receives the seat. The party with the most seats in the house are declared the party in power, with the 2nd place party being the official opposition.

 

2. When was the last time, if ever, a single party had a strong majority in parliament.

 

The last time was 2000-2004. It is not uncommon to have a majority government. Minority governments are quite rare.

 

3. Which tax is the biggest source of govt revenue?

 

Just guessing, but probably income tax

 

4. WHat is GST (tax)?

 

The GST stands for Goods and Services Tax. It is typically only applied to things such as "luxury" items that are not necessities. Though it's a bit bogus, because things such as gasoline still get the GST, as well as other things that we can't really do without. Though AFAIK we don't get GST on basic utilities, and most food (at least if it's bought in a supermarket) does not have GST on it.

 

The GST "hatred" is kind of silly, as it was brought in to replace the Manufacturer's Sales Tax. It actually helps Canada's export industry, as manufacturers no longer pay the tax when the commodity is created. Naturally, the public became upset because the tax was directly placed upon them (an economist would argue that it doesn't really matter where the tax is placed though...we all pay for it somehow).

 

The current party in power, the Liberal Party, made the GST a big issue in the next election (and it has come up in all elections), stating they will remove it. They have yet to do so.

 

 

All in all there are some things that I hate about the Canadian government system. John Nunziata actually voted against the Liberal's first budget, because they were not abolishing the GST. He was expelled from the party.

 

 

According to Wikipedia though, it accounts for 15%-17% of Canada's federal tax revenues.

[alanschu]

I think negative ad campaigns are annoying. I'm much more interested in hearing what a party's plans are in the upcoming term.

 

In terms of voting practices, while I do have right-wing beliefs (fiscally), I typically like to see governments change, even if they aren't doing a "poor" job necessarily. It helps to provide accountability to governments.

 

Here in Alberta the same party has been in control pretty much forever.