KotoR 3: Ideas and Suggestions

[Plano Skywalker]

Yeah Malachor was mentioned in K1, i think it's Candarous that tells you about it in one of his war stories. I'm pretty sure anyways, i havent played K1 in a loooong time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

yup, Canderous talks about the great battle over Malachor 5....however, the way he describes it

it sounds more like a conventional battle....nothing about a cheap trick such as the Mass Shadow Generator

.

 

I don't think this was originally drawn up as a trilogy....however, they intentionally left a number of unresolved threads (in both games) for future games.

 

Now, they have a choice: keep it going as an open-ended soap opera (the most convenient for them) or go with quality and wrap up the story we are in now and all the dangling threads out there. There could still be future games but with their own story archs.

[Plano Skywalker]

If you are going to make a trilogy, or even a sextet you plan it out from the start, otherwise you get crap like the KotOR 2's ending and the prequel SWs.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

right. I say find a good way to pull the Revan Saga all together in a ROTJ kind of way (trust me, MCA and company can do this if they are given the artistic leeway to do so). IMO, K3 has to be the end of the current story....I will (and I think alot of others will) be extremely disappointed if it doesn't wrap up the current story arch.

 

and I agree that future games should either be planned as trilogies or as self-contained stories....no more, "patch up the soap as we go along" kind of thing.

 

with regard to d20....just because there will be no more support for PnP SW d20 does not mean that LA cannot continue to license that system for gameplay. d20 is a totally generic system that you can use for fantasy (i.e. D&D), modern, post-apocalyptic, etc.

 

however, that being as it is, now might be a good time to look at using a totally new system....something that uses a mili scale such as Morrowind would be good, IMO. Morrowind-style stats but keep BG-style multilayered combat.

[Weiser_Cain]

So you'd sit in a room getting mad at the wall to get good enough at force rage so that it wont fail you when you're fighting a rat? I think we should just stickwith the D20 system.

[Plano Skywalker]

So you'd sit in a room getting mad at the wall to get good enough at force rage so that it wont fail you when you're fighting a rat? I think we should just stickwith the D20 system.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

point taken....they could still have a mili-based system without having the kind of grinding you are taking about.

 

they could still use d20 but it would need so many tweaks to be competitive at higher levels that it may as well be another system.

 

but regardless of which system they use, being able to advance in specific fighting forms (a la Jade Empire) would be really nice.

[Bulgarian Jedi]

The current systen is as good as it is.

The have to focus on the story. As there was mentioned there qutie a lot of Revan and Exile combinations. I think it wil be best not to mention those two and just determine whether they were LS(cannonical) or DS. All references(and especaly gender ones shoud be kept on a minimum). BUt then what happen to those two??

Oh, it is a writers nightmare!

 

Someone mentioned andther Sith place called Zhenor or something. That could be the Sith Empire or whatever source of Evil it can be.

[metadigital]

I think at this point it will be necessary to determine what becomes canon for KOTOR I and II if we want things solved in III. Personally, I think canon will be Revan being LSM and Exile being LSF, but that's just me...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep, that's just you.

Yep that sounds about right to me also

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The current systen is as good as it is.

The have to focus on the story. As there was mentioned there qutie a lot of Revan and Exile combinations. I think it wil be best not to mention those two and just determine whether they were LS(cannonical) or DS. All references(and especaly gender ones shoud be kept on a minimum). BUt then what happen to those two??

Oh, it is a writers nightmare!

...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They're dead, Zed.

[Plano Skywalker]

They're dead, Zed. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

actually, that would be a way to use those characters and still give them resolution....they die in a crash of some kind....they are wrapped up in conversation using the terms "Revan" and "the exiled Jedi" while not using their pronouns in the dialog trees (or just pattern the pronouns after whatever gender the PC is).

 

there are actually a number of ways to wrap this up. I just hope they pull it all together in a trilogy-ender.

[metadigital]

My favourite is they die in a final spurt of the-universe-is-bigger-than-my-life self-sacrifice (either for light or dark ends) to save the PC.

[Hello.T.Jedis]

I SAY BRING BACK REVAN AND THE GENERAL AND LET THEM BE IN YOUR PARTY. First it starts as these new creatures are hunting all sith and dont realize jedis exist. So you with your lightsaber are attacked and sent off to the edges of the galaxy with only your clothes. You find Revan but since he was banished he has no lightsaber either but wants to join you to reunite the Kotor parties. This should all happen near the old planets so the stories get around and the events occur. Reply to find out more.

[Nartwak]

You had better not fix that Hello.T.Jedis.

[Surreptishus]

Don't PM me to ask what i think about kotor 3 you freak <_<

[Gabrielle]

Bastila. Bring her back as evil as she wants to be.

[vaxen83]

One of the KOTOR planets that might be considered would be Nal Hutta. A concept of a system/planet of which crime is presented as a main element would broaden the theme of lawlessness. Since Nar Shaddaa was mentioned in K2 as being a planet mainly under Exchange territory, developing the theme that was used in Nar Shadda through Nal Hutta might be done with an escalation in poverty. So, an example might be how many people (including NPCs) have actually been trapped on Nal Hutta for several years. (possibly even decades) There has yet to be a part of the KOTOR story that is actually devoted to explaining how the activities of the Hutts have affected the operations of its neighbouring planets. (Nar Shaddaa would be one of them) Elements from Sleyheron could be integrated into the homeworld of the Hutts. It would probably be a planet that is reasonably a vast area which is not necessarily as organised as Nar Shaddaa was.

 

The themes of crime, lawlessness and gang activities would need to be closely related to the operation of the planet by the Hutts. Also, the environmental terrain of Nal Hutta would be as close to being swampy as imaginable. (That is, those parts of the planet that are not directly under Huttian territory) And given that those parts are generally unexplored, having monsters or even creatures within the swamps would allow a PC to participate in various sidequests while fighting randomly generated monsters (Like the way rakghouls were encountered repeatedly in the Lower Sewers on Taris) The possibility of bringing rancors into the planet might be considered. Although rancors were mentioned in K1, their habitation tendencies were hardly explained and tended to be transported or even used by other hostile people or NPCs which the PC had to eventually defeat.

 

In other words, rancors might be commonly encountered while passing through the swamps. The environment of swamp-like areas on Nal Hutta could be enhanced through the lack of adequate light from the sun from reaching some of the deep parts of the swamp or even certain caves that lie beyond the edges of dangerous swamp-like terrain. Also, not all of the monsters in the swamps need necessarily be obviously visible. Certain creatures that lurk under the surface of large areas that are abundant with lakes and rivers which are thick and murky would add to the mode of challenge which had not been previously encountered in the previous Kotor games. The difference between water-borne creatures in the swamps and the firaxan sharks in K1 is that the first tends to relate to themes of subterranean origins while the latter involves being submerged deep under water.

 

Trees, as a concept, has yet to be brought into a Kotor game. For example, some sidequests might involve obtaining certain parts of a particular tree plantation, which when obtained, simultaneously attracts the attention of hostile-like creatures that are lurking nearby. Certain slow-moving creatures that glide from one part of the forest to another would present some themes of monsters that are air-borne.

 

Another issue that might be important to include in the swamp areas would be how the breeding of monsters makes the difficulty of getting into, across and out of the swamps considerably challenging. So, if certain creatures were encountered, those creatures might be merely younglings that roam around in groups. (Maybe between 4 to 5 of them together) And as the PC travels across the vast expanses of the swamp, the variety of monsters becomes territorial, that is monsters are almost intensely hostile and harder to deal with. And when the PC returns to the forest in an effort to return to the non-hostile areas where the Hutt lords are, monsters would have regenerated, which would provide kinds of challenges similar to previous encounters in the forest.

 

Beyond the terrain of the forest might be various shrines and temples, of which the possibility of existing cult groups and ritualistic summoning acts of devilry by people who have learned to manipulate different aspects of the Force would make the challenges of the forest pale with regard to what the PC has yet to face in dealing with certain cult-like groups, with at least two of them being at odds with each other. (Nal Hutta seems to be a planet of lawlessness and unregulated evil generally)

 

There could also be bodies of certain people in different swamp areas who unsuccessfully attempted to explore the forest, in which several datapads could be found that might describe their backgrounds and what they might have been looking for.

Edited October 18, 2005 by vaxen83

[maldarth]

It would also be nice if we could have our own swoop bike like in K1, and be able to modify/upgrade it like we heard about in K1, but couldn't do. 

 

Also, it would be sweet to be able to hijack or pilot vehicles and ships, like GTA or Halo. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

yes owning a swoop bike would ownz with all the sweet upgrades.

 

i would also like to see to kotor 3 not so linier. is that the word?

[Plano Skywalker]

I don't know about Nal Hutta, per se. It would all depend on the storyline and if the storyline is about a pending invasion, then I doubt the Hutts would play a significant part in the story.

 

However, I do like the idea of having to traverse difficult terrain and to encouter primitive shamanistic type peoples who have a basic yet untamed knowledge of the Force...to be able to convince them to help you....if you fail, then you'll be drawing that lightsaber.

 

Essentially, we need more Dxun scenarios and we need to be in some places where the terrain is so harsh, only a vehicle will get you to where you need to go.

 

Rideable vehicles and rideable mounts would be cool.

[Bulgarian Jedi]

No, no Nal Hutta. Wer had already NarShadaa

 

A planet similar to Coruscant or Sleheyron might be nice. Huge spacestations can also count as planets.

[vaxen83]

Strangely though, in terms of force users and regarding Jedi masters in the Council so far, none of them were actually Sentinels or even Watchmen. Not too sure about how this will be done in K3. Since K2 brought Sith Assassins into the game, then it would make sense for the Jedi Council to have some members skilled in stealth detection based on their own understanding of the Force in K3. And Bastila is not even a member of the Council although she was a Sentinel. Stealth, surprise and detection might certainly enhance K3's story.

 

The Sith Assassins in K2 were almost like usual enemies using force pikes or weapons that were close to being quarterstaffs. Only one Assassin in the Trayus Academy used lightsabers.

 

Some of the quests in K3 might involve an attempt to rescue a few Jedi masters who might perhaps have been besieged by Sith masters in combat. A few examples might include having Jedi being trapped in stasis fields by certain Sith masters and being brought off to certain places while the PC follows from a distance behind. (Stealth would be required to sneak past certain Sith enemies that are left along the trail where the Jedi hostages are being brought away from) For classes like Consulars and Guardians, force powers and fighting will help as it did before.

 

Stealth as a way of following enemies without needing to attack them has yet to be demonstrated through secretly listening in on the conversations of certain NPCs and Sith enemies. It might also help when certain hostages have to be rescued without needing to constantly resort to fighting. So, for example, if a character was beside an NPC, certain lines of dialogue would be heard and when the same character had Stealth, dialogue around the same issue that the NPC was discussing would be heard and with reference to things that would be inaccessible to non-stealthed characters.

 

It would also be a way to allow the PC to have an understanding of how the game is progressing, which is an alternative to journals as a reference for information about past happenings. In other words, journals tell things that have passed, either since early times and also possibly recently. Dialogue from Stealth might either tell what is about to happen, what is occurring presently, and depending on the lines of dialogue that the player has heard, will affect the way in which a sidequest might be completed, or kinds of sidequests that the same PC would be involved in.

 

Intelligence might affect the difficulty with which the PC is able to make out what is being discussed between NPCs and certain Sith enemies after Stealth has been activated. Thus, PCs with a minimum modifier in Intelligence would be able to barely understand conversation exchanges generally while having additional Intelligence points would make listening to dialogue specific and detailed.

 

Dialogue that has been heard by PCs with Stealth and a reasonable amount of Int would be reflected through different quest information for the same quest. Those lines of dialogue where Intelligence checks were successfully satsfied would have detailed quest information along with what other issues it had under the different quests headings in the journal menu while PCs with barely minimum Int would have only general quest information in their journal that is essential to doing what is required. By detailed quest information, it would indicate how additional information about the quest related to certain key figures of the Sith or other people who are involved in a collaborated effort against the Republic and Jedi.

Edited October 20, 2005 by vaxen83

[Plano Skywalker]

more of a squad-based mentality on the missions...if you are going to use a disguise, then every non-droid in your squad needs to be dressed as such.

 

* Squad commands that temporarily override individual AI.

 

* Squad tactics (i.e. Group Stealth)

[hawk]

May I suggest in Kotor III:

 

1) A very good selection of party members:

 

A) a hot looking very tough female Jedi guardian.

B) a Jedi Consular, one of the Vandar / Yoda / Yaddle species, I am not against using Vandar himself either. There is just not enough evidence he died.

C) a Rodian Scoundrel

D) HK-47 and T3-M4, they just have to be included just like the Ebon Hawk

E) How about a Dark Jedi not allied with the Sith but instead a guy who truly hates the Sith (maybe a Cathar from Telos, he could fill in the Jedi Sentinel role)

 

That's 6 party members, there are 3 or 4 places left, a Soldier, a Scout, possibly a Tech specialist / anything new. Maybe someone can come up with some more people / species here.

 

2) A good selection of Planets. How about at least including:

 

Coruscant

Some sith planets, IMO: Khar Shian and Khar Delba, Ziost, Almania. Possibly Byss

Falleen

Ilum

Alderaan

Myrkr

 

That's enough

 

3) Player character:

 

This is crucial since it will have a huge inpact on the story. For some reason, you always tend to play the most powerful Jedi in the universe. I would not chance this and I think it would be very bad if you are not somehow related to the Exile or better: Revan.

Now, I think it would be quiet all right to play as a much younger character this time, let's say a 16 year old boy / girl. It could be Revan's child. Not a bad idea IMO. Or we could play as some wound in the force created by the exile. And otherwise, play as a normal everyday powerful Jedi. But then you must be able to choose a new species. Play as a Twilek, Cathar, Wookie, Yoda species, Sullustan, Zabrak etc. etc.

 

4) Revan and the exile:

 

Revan should be alive and you must be able to pick Gender / alignment and face, if you are Revan's son, this is a bit easier since Revan would just look like you, only older.

As for the Exile: he/she I think should have fallen DS no matter what happened in Kotor II, the Jedi see him / her as a danger and it would make perfect sense if he / she fell. I don't mind if the exile would be one of the enemies you have to face.

 

5) The most important part:

 

The storyline.

No matter how crude the gameplay, the storyline is the most important part of any RPG. Gameplay additions we have seen in Kotor II are good, but I can do very well without all these.

Bring us back the perfect storyline of Kotor I, and please give the developers the time they need to complete the game this time. Revan was the best created character I have ever seen in Star Wars. We know you can do it again.

Edited October 19, 2005 by hawk

[darthjardon]

Here's me basic idea for KOTOR 3, and that's what it is -- basic. Anyway, I would like for them to begin your charcter off as an apprentice. The whole concept of that could open new doors, you should have the choice of who your master is during the set up phase when your creating your character and such. The conflict between those two alone could be cause for some interesting plot twists and that, along with the plot stemming from the first two would be more basis. Other things I WISH would be done are

 

1) I would like to see your charcter age as the game progresses, to see you go from a young apprentice to a Jedi Master would be fun and it would also be able to cover more ground in terms of the plot.

 

2) A new fighting scheme implamented, a lot of people have suggested Jade Empire but I say no to that strongly. For me the fighting scheme from Star Wars Revenge Of The Sith would be a good starting point to build off of. There would have to be adjustments to make it work for KOTOR but you can;t have a truly epic battle just by programming your lightsaber/vibroblade shots, and that's what KOTOR 3 needs to be -- epic.

 

3) Better enemies, if there was anything the first two lacked it was this. I never really feared any of them, although Malak was the closest to being a beast. But Darth Sion, Kreia, and maybe Bastilla depending on how you played the game were not the most fearsome foes. Darth Nihilus was pretty feirce, when I saw him in KOTOR 2 I did not look foward to that fight, even though it turned out fairly easy I look foward to enemies with more reputation to them. Like an accomplished swordsman or a strong manipulator of the force.

 

4) Also, in regards to the Master/Apprentice scenario I offered I would suggest a similar idea as to KOTOR 2. You character goes one way while your master goes the other (LS & DS) so a confrontation is inevitable. It was a good basis for KOTOR 2 but it flopped in my opinion. Nobody who pleayed the game enjoyed Kreia as a party member, so when she double-crossed you there was a somber 'wtf, oh well'. I would like to see a bong reminiscent of Obi-Wan/Anakin in my version of KOTOR 3.

 

Darth Jardon :cool: Out

[darthjardon]

Also as for Revan and the Exile, i think they should both have a signifigant involvement in the plot.

 

REVAN - Have him return from his crusade against the True Sith, one Jedi could never take them on and maybe have him encounter bring back some Sith Lords who followed him. He should be with Bastilla either way, but Carth should be with him during LS scenarios.

 

EXILE- I enjoyed this character just because of his power so he would serve as a perfect apprentice to a powerful Sith Lord, alla Vader to Sidious. That's what I want to see, a Sith regarded as the most dangerous person in the galaxy and you need to take him down. Now a planet destroyer like Nihilus but a powerful Jedi with his mind currupted from former experiences: (Mandalorian Wars, Atris Betrayal, Kreia's Betrayal)

[Akhan225]

I want to see a choosable main character. I mean choose to play as Revan or the Exile and play two different intertwined storylines with completely different NPC's, planets, missions, the works. This would give a new storyline the second time around and it will expand on the idea of a free roam sort of game that KOTOR is. Plus Revan would kick the Exiles ass all the way back to the Unknown Regions

[hawk]

I want to see a choosable main character. I mean choose to play as Revan or the Exile and play two different intertwined storylines with completely different NPC's, planets, missions, the works. This would give a new storyline the second time around and it will expand on the idea of a free roam sort of game that KOTOR is. Plus Revan would kick the Exiles ass all the way back to the Unknown Regions

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That would be a lot of work, not to mention a very difficult to near impossible storyline. I say we stick to the original, play the game LS or DS. Don't make it to difficult for the developers to accomplish.

[vaxen83]

The effect of having randomisation of lightsaber crystals in K2 was painfully tedious. Although there were randomly generated crystals for lightsabers in almost every shop inventory, the crystals that were obtained only provided damage increments of between 1-6 and 1-8 (Upari for one of the shop vendors on Nar Shadda) Pontite crystals (1-10) were rare and only one could be found in the Onderon palace. (So if a character had two single lightsabers and used Power Attack or Critical Strike, two Pontite crystals were needed, while another crystal could be Velmorite or Nextor) Some of the crystals provided only meagre bonuses like Dragite (+1 to Con and +1 Sonic damage) yet they were found most of the time in the salvager's inventory on Dantooine.

 

If there was more than one force-sensitive cave on planets where past Jedi had been to before, at least two to three, it might be easier to be allowed a wider range of crystals to be ued for lightsabers. And it would mean having to get through creatures and enemies guarding those crystals. (Possible to have variety in boss enemies)

 

If lightsabers are going to be found at random, having two different crystals together in the same lightsaber might give certain combination bonuses that add either to some attributes, damage or even defence. This would be essential if lightsabers were going to do critical damage. Most of the emitters, cells and lens did not give the option of added damage to critical hits although normal damage could be increased by 1-12 with an Adegan lens. Diablo 2: Lod had a rune system where rune formations/words would give some sort of bonuses that were previously unavailable on most magic items.

 

Even the added damage to critical hits tends to be more for melee weapons through devaronian edges and sonic cells. (Although lightsabers have six slots while melee weapons have three)

Edited October 20, 2005 by vaxen83

[hawk]

Lightsabers and their crystals are always a top priority in Kotor and you can never have enough upgrades. There are however some crystals that really stand out in Kotor II:

 

The Ankarres Sapphire

The Kaiburr

The (good old) Opila

Your personal crystal

 

I also think that most DS players are fortunate with the Qixoni crystal and all other upgrades available for DSiders in this game.

It's also quiet nice to actually read through the crystals descriptions, where they come from. You would like to go there in Kotor III to collect some of those crystals wouldn't you.