ncr Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I was just looking at some dev. interviews at Gamespot. Everything seemed okay... the devs. seemed pleased with their work, Chris was talking about all the research they did... but then something got me. He said something to the effect of: "we saw what had been done before [with Star Wars] and we wanted to do something different". Okay, that's the problem right there. If I were making a game for a series I hate, like Ultima for example; I wouldn't try and change the Ultima universe so I'd enjoy the game more. I would make a game that fans of Ultima would enjoy. This is really the responsiblity of developers to please fans of the series, not themselves. Most of the people who liked KOTOR II, didn't like the first one: i.e: they were not fans of the series. In fact most of them aren't Star Wars fans at all, they're Black Isle fans. I think this is such a typical show of arrogance, overconfidence and ambition when developers take a well known series and "innovate" to the point where the feel of the series is lost. (looks like a Star Wars game, but certainly doesn't feel like it) With that said however, Lucasarts should have done a better job reigning them in. I guess it just goes to show Star Wars fans what a diamond in the rough the original KOTOR was. The way Bioware captured the feel of Star Wars effortlessly and completely is amazing... and Lucasarts was obviously a VERY small part in it.
vl182 Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 actually i liked both games and so did many other people. its just that after the great atmosphere the first game has offered many were disappointed about the second game. im always asking me what would have happened if the sith lords would be the first kotor game
Haitoku Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I guess you have a point NCR. TSL had a very deep and complex storyline. Filled with philosophy and symbolism. Star Wars never had any of that, guess it's too much for the [/i]hardcore fans to accept alittle change.
Oerwinde Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I was just looking at some dev. interviews at Gamespot. Everything seemed okay... the devs. seemed pleased with their work, Chris was talking about all the research they did... but then something got me. He said something to the effect of: "we saw what had been done before [with Star Wars] and we wanted to do something different". Okay, that's the problem right there. If I were making a game for a series I hate, like Ultima for example; I wouldn't try and change the Ultima universe so I'd enjoy the game more. I would make a game that fans of Ultima would enjoy. This is really the responsiblity of developers to please fans of the series, not themselves. Most of the people who liked KOTOR II, didn't like the first one: i.e: they were not fans of the series. In fact most of them aren't Star Wars fans at all, they're Black Isle fans. I think this is such a typical show of arrogance, overconfidence and ambition when developers take a well known series and "innovate" to the point where the feel of the series is lost. (looks like a Star Wars game, but certainly doesn't feel like it) With that said however, Lucasarts should have done a better job reigning them in. I guess it just goes to show Star Wars fans what a diamond in the rough the original KOTOR was. The way Bioware captured the feel of Star Wars effortlessly and completely is amazing... and Lucasarts was obviously a VERY small part in it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Just because people liked KotOR2 better than 1, doesn't mean they didn't like 1. I'd say probably 90% of the people who bought KotOR2 bought it because they liked the first one. And probably about 80-90% of those people liked it. The problem with the game is that its not finished. Which had nothing to do with them wanting to do something new with Star Wars, as the story and such is all figured out during pre-production. The area between the balls and the butt is a hotbed of terrorist activity.
jaguars4ever Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 Maybe it means that ncr's the evil man, and I'm the righteous man, and Mr. Narwak here's the Shepherd protecting my righteous ass in the Valley of Darkness. Or, it could mean: ncr's the righteous man, and I'm the Shepherd, and it's the world that's evil and selfish. I'd like that, but that sh** ain't the truth. The truth is: ncr's the weak, and I am the tyranny of evil men. But, I'm tryin', Nartwak, I'm trying real hard to be the Shepherd.
Cantousent Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 That was quite... poetic, jaguars. I mean it. Weird, but poetic. At any rate, I liked both, but I thought they had different strengths. I was quite surprised about where KoTOR2 did well and where it failed. Fionavar's Holliday Wishes to all members of our online community: Happy Holidays Join the revelry at the Obsidian Plays channel:Obsidian Plays Remembering tarna, Phosphor, Metadigital, and Visceris. Drink mead heartily in the halls of Valhalla, my friends!
Baley Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 Most of the people who liked KOTOR II, didn't like the first one: i.e: they were not fans of the series. In fact most of them aren't Star Wars fans at all, they're Black Isle fans. I think this is such a typical show of arrogance, overconfidence and ambition when developers take a well known series and "innovate" to the point where the feel of the series is lost. (looks like a Star Wars game, but certainly doesn't feel like it) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well a lot of people here like both games sa your argument is almost entireley wrong. Yes,there are people ,like me for example,who didn't like the feeling of the first game..it was the only Bio game I've never replayed. And yes I love what Obsidian did with the feeling of K2,do I care it's not a SW feeling?...no way simply because I don't like most SW games(with some exeptions of course) So do I care if they didn't do a regular SW story?...No because SW stories seem to be week and boring...with some exeptions of course(K1 not being one of them). Maybe it means that ncr's the evil man, and I'm the righteous man, and Mr. Narwak here's the Shepherd protecting my righteous ass in the Valley of Darkness. Or, it could mean: ncr's the righteous man, and I'm the Shepherd, and it's the world that's evil and selfish. I'd like that, but that sh** ain't the truth. The truth is: ncr's the weak, and I am the tyranny of evil men. But, I'm tryin', Nartwak, I'm trying real hard to be the Shepherd. Then what am I?
Musopticon? Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 The Gimp, of course. kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
Musopticon? Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 There, there, just but the ball-plug on and it's gonna all right. kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
Musopticon? Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 Sir Spam-a-lot ascends to godhood when, then? kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
Baley Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I belive 100000 post will suffice...which should be in about 2388.36 days
Musopticon? Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I may have something like 5000 posts if the Obsidian fortress still stands then. (w00t) kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
Oerwinde Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 Hey, Oerwinde... ncr's a troll. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Well call me a nature lover. I'm feeding the trolls The area between the balls and the butt is a hotbed of terrorist activity.
Musopticon? Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 Trolls should be torched, except if you happen like green fluffy things. kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
metadigital Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I belive 100000 post will suffice...which should be in about 2388.36 days <{POST_SNAPBACK}> And you well be 22 years 6 months and about a week old. (Well, you might be a week older, anyway) OBSCVRVM PER OBSCVRIVS ET IGNOTVM PER IGNOTIVS OPVS ARTIFICEM PROBAT
edu11 Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I was just looking at some dev. interviews at Gamespot. Everything seemed okay... the devs. seemed pleased with their work, Chris was talking about all the research they did... but then something got me. He said something to the effect of: "we saw what had been done before [with Star Wars] and we wanted to do something different". Okay, that's the problem right there. If I were making a game for a series I hate, like Ultima for example; I wouldn't try and change the Ultima universe so I'd enjoy the game more. I would make a game that fans of Ultima would enjoy. This is really the responsiblity of developers to please fans of the series, not themselves. Most of the people who liked KOTOR II, didn't like the first one: i.e: they were not fans of the series. In fact most of them aren't Star Wars fans at all, they're Black Isle fans. I think this is such a typical show of arrogance, overconfidence and ambition when developers take a well known series and "innovate" to the point where the feel of the series is lost. (looks like a Star Wars game, but certainly doesn't feel like it) With that said however, Lucasarts should have done a better job reigning them in. I guess it just goes to show Star Wars fans what a diamond in the rough the original KOTOR was. The way Bioware captured the feel of Star Wars effortlessly and completely is amazing... and Lucasarts was obviously a VERY small part in it. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> 1) Fact: LA are a bunch of idiots. (i hate generalizing but this is an exception) 2) Things are simple. Do you want to do something "different"? Be my guest. If you succeed, you get the spoils (money, fame etc). If you screw up (like OE did), you get flamed.
Baley Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 OE did not screw up..the game got an 87% average rating and it also sold a lot of copies... ...+I liked it :cool:
Plano Skywalker Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 I would just say this about that: LA needs to realize that this is not Jedi Knight on steroids....this is a comic that you run on your computer/console. They had such an overwhelming response to the characters in the first game that they got Dark Horse to create a comic simply to justify the existence of Revan and Malak in the EU. They need to realize that that is what they are dealing with here. They need to have the story *not just screened* but WRITTEN by someone like Zahn and THEN adapted to RPG format. They got lucky the first game...the second game ALMOST lost the Star Wars mythos, IMO. However, I generally enjoy the second more than the first because of certain gameplay and presentation devices. But the overaching story in the Star Wars setting needs to be simplistic.
mstormrage Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 OE did not screw up..the game got an 87% average rating and it also sold a lot of copies... ...+I liked it :cool: <{POST_SNAPBACK}> How many of those reviews were "sponsored"? MoO ]I[ had fantastic reviews before the game came out. It was only after the fans got the piece of crap called a game and noticed how flawed it was before reviewers started being honest. At this point in time I can't give this game a higher rating than 70%. My opinion may change after another playthrough (which I started last night) but as of now I would steer people away from II unless OE and LA can show their support by making a real patch. KotOR I was more seamless than II. Sure, it had a simpler plot (some would say non-existant), but at least there weren't gaping holes in it like in II. II had more potential, but they screwed it up with how shodily the game was put together. For a game built on an existing engine, Obsidian managed to make II look worse than I and introduced numerous bugs in an attempt to make it run better (it doesn't; it runs worse). Before certain people pipe up and start accusing me of being a Bioware phanboi, I've only played two Bioware games: Baldur's Gate II and KotOR. Baldur's Gate II was one of the worst games I have ever played. KotOR was one of the best games I have ever played. With that being said, if it came down to Bioware or Obsidian making KotOR III, I'd say let Bioware make the game but let Obsidian write the story.
Musopticon? Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 "Baldur's Gate II was one of the worst games I have ever played." I cry for you. kirottu said: I was raised by polar bears. I had to fight against blood thirsty wolves and rabid penguins to get my food. Those who were too weak to survive were sent to Sweden. It has made me the man I am today. A man who craves furry hentai. So let us go and embrace the rustling smells of unseen worlds
Baley Posted May 12, 2005 Posted May 12, 2005 "Baldur's Gate II was one of the worst games I have ever played." I cry for you. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I second that :'( You must haven not played many games then BG2 is so much better than K1 in almost every aspect I loved the detailed visuals,the beautiful music,the story,real romances,almost everything K1 is far from the same league as BG2
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