nightcleaver Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 If they'll ask questions about ANYONE, it'll be about Bastila and Carth. They were the two leads of the previous installment in the series, as I recall. That said: You can kill Bastila if you're lightside, and you HAVE to kill carth as darkside female. Darkside male, Carth is left on the unknown world, very likely to be dealt with later. I think it would be cool for Carth to escape and try to find revenge on male DS Revan, and you see that in some form in this sequel - but I would suspect that they just lump the two together, making Carth die by Revan's hand either way in the end. Yes, this is a different story - but as has been said before, people want something to remember the original in the sequel, and the sequel should be the continuation in a SEQUENCE of episodes. Bastila and Carth were central to the first plot, so I really don't see them taking those two as totally un-necessary. Well, anyway... I'll be happy as long as I hear what happens to the characters since the first game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fighter Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I hope I dont hear: "they droped dead end of story"! That would be really bad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostofAnakin Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 IMO, if they just kill Bastila off with no real purpose other than to avoid having her in KOTOR2, that would show a lack of creativity on Obsidian's part. There are countless ways that she can be incorporated into the story without having to make her one of the central focusses again. So IMO, there's no reason, other than laziness, why she shouldn't be alive in TSL. "Console exclusive is such a harsh word." - Darque"Console exclusive is two words Darque." - Nartwak (in response to Darque's observation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinIchiro Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 She'll be mentioned (maybe even have a cameo appearance), but will never be a major character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nur Ab Sal Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 She should be member of the Jedi Council. More wise than those fools in KOTOR HERMOCRATES: Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned. SOCRATES: This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShinIchiro Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 The KOTOR jedi council didn't really do anything. I think that in KOTOR 2 we should see jedi more powerful than us fighting. Also, the occasional ally in combat would be nice (e.g. suppose a republic base is attacked while you're there. The soldiers would be allies in combat. It would be cool that the more soldiers you kept alive the more they would help you or give you cool items). Was anyone else yearning for mass combat in this game? Where there are 10-30 sith and alot more sith troopers fighting you and your 5-15 jedi allies and your soldier allies? P.S. Is there a jedi council in this game? I thought you were like the last of the jedi. That means there might be jedi around, but no centralized leadership group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nur Ab Sal Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I do not really believe that Obsidian will be so stupid to copy storyline of the "Return of the Jedi" where Luke was last prevailing Jedi... I think that more logic would be in Jedi Order dissolved by the Senate and some unofficial Jedi Underground leaded by Jedi Council with Bastila as a member that will advise your main character or give him assignments. HERMOCRATES: Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned. SOCRATES: This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GhostofAnakin Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 P.S. Is there a jedi council in this game? I thought you were like the last of the jedi. That means there might be jedi around, but no centralized leadership group. That's still under wraps. But i believe the exact wording is you're the last known Jedi alive. Maybe the Jedi Council on Coruscant just went in to hiding. "Console exclusive is such a harsh word." - Darque"Console exclusive is two words Darque." - Nartwak (in response to Darque's observation) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSun Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I do not really believe that Obsidian will be so stupid to copy storyline of the "Return of the Jedi" where Luke was last prevailing Jedi...I think that more logic would be in Jedi Order dissolved by the Senate and some unofficial Jedi Underground leaded by Jedi Council with Bastila as a member. If she's alive,wouldn't she be where Revan is? If she's not it sort of kills part of the story of Knights,that being the strong bond between the two characters. No matter what side you're playing as Revan went off to parts unknown,if she's alive she'd pry be with him. Not to mention if you're playing lightside Zal and Mission as well considering the life debt Zal had and Mission wouldn't leave Zal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nur Ab Sal Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Continuity between KOTOR & KOTOR 2 is none of my concern...devs can always invent some excuse for Bastila as a Jedi Council member...Revan can be in this Council too-as a master HERMOCRATES: Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned. SOCRATES: This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSun Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Continuity between KOTOR & KOTOR 2 is none of my concern...devs can always invent some excuse for Bastila as a Jedi Council member...Revan can be in this Council too-as a master They can true,I don't see it happening though. But time will tell one way or the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fighter Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Well you are obviously not the only jedi in the game! I think most likely there is some kind of effort to rebuild the order after destrucion, disolvment or whatever happened. Bastila is either with Revan or helping to rebuild the jedi order. Whatever her role is it is probably tied to Revan's. Possible other role. If there is some kind of major battle involved in the storyline, you might need to find for her battle meditation. And there probably is a battle involved because the sith seem to be numerious from what we know so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabahattin Dere Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 One problem for the fans is that although we're talking about the two episodes of one basic story concerning a spesific time period in SW 'history', our experience of these two episodes will be from two totally different points of view. So the continuity between the two games is not exactly the same thing as the coherence of that one story; the latter is a broader concept and includes elements of the story that we still don't know, having played only Kotor 1, and only from one POV -although it was the point of view of the people who seemed to determine the fate of the galaxy, all by their own deeds. It's virtually impossible to imagine at this point how this new party that gamers will be leading in TSL will relate to the events and characters of the first game; but one thing is certain, and it's that the second game will *still* have its roots in whatever it was that Revan and Malak did before the events of Kotor, as they fell to the dark side, as well as in the outcome of 'the battle of the Star Forge'. Having key characters (which in my opinion excludes Mission, Zaalbar, Juhani and Jolee) just drop dead at the end of Kotor, or make sure that 'all endings happened' (so that no gamer will feel slighted) will probably rob that one story of any consistency, and won't leave a trace of coherence in case these 'Sith Lords' just pop up after whatever it is that happened after the Star Forge, and the characters of Revan or Bastila are reduced to brief guest appearances, as if they were as crucial for the fate of the galaxy, as a Rodian shopkeeper! On the contrary: I think we'll start learning a more profound story of the original conflict, while we deal with new enemies. (The problem, by the way, with the 'all endings happened' approach the way I understand it is that in case Obsidian really goes as far as to incorporate every sort of Kotor 1 final-picture that you could come up with, that would mean, given the broader scheme of things during that time period --of which the devs. must have a clear view, since they designed Kotor in at least 2 installments, and didn't decide to make a sequel because the first ep. sold well--, that all our decisions were all the more insignificant. That would make *all* gamers feel slighted!) I think we'll hear plenty about what happened before the events of Kotor, and will definitely be re-introduced to the Revan character as well -in terms of seeing him emerge as a character with a deeper history. Given the 'bond' between Revan and Bastila, I'd think we're going to learn more about her, let alone decide if she survived it or not. I think a great many surprises await all fans, as well as perfectly familiar stuff, since the bigger picture will start to emerge now. and it'll be so interesting that no one will regret that there's no 'plot twist' as the devs. have been saying -seriously or not. Zwangvolle Plage! M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSun Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I'm not sure where the problem(s) that you've said would come into play. This game more then Knights seems to be based on allowing the individual player to create a good part of the story around how they played Sith Lords. Now I don't know how in depth they're going but they've said more then once that they did not want to step on the choices made by the players in Knights. From what I've seen they're trying rather hard to take a look at and allow for a number of different experiences based around what choices were there to make in Knights. Not sure how it is that all the players would end up slighted if they do so in depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steelfiredragon Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I'm tell you the Sith Lady Malice killed Bastila, and took off with all of Bastila's stuff, well either that or Darth Malice is Bastila in disquise.... Strength through Mercy Head Torturor of the Cult of the Anti-gnome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabahattin Dere Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I assume that both Kotor 1 and TSL are different adventures within one broader scheme. If it doesn't really matter for that bigger story if Bastila survived or not, then 'all gamers will feel slighted'. We don't know at this point how any character of event in any of the two episodes really relates to the underlying plot; if the bigger story works well while allowing any Kotor 1 decision to find its place seamlessly, then obviously there's no problem. I just tend to think that unravelling an interesting tale where Obsidian imposes the necessary ending(s) is more fun, than seeing how well I can trace every little decision that I make in the former game inside the sequel, at the price of reducing the heroes of the first saga into guest appearances and having the core of the drama develop around different events and characters that are really independent -but again, only if there is an all-encompassing broader story which we don't know yet. anyway, I'm not sure if any of what I've said above makes sense! but one thing that ought to be mentioned is that almost everyone must have played this game more than once, to see the possibilities. Why do we have to assume that everyone has to have a deep commitment to one such possibility, and insist on seeing it in the next game? Zwangvolle Plage! M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nur Ab Sal Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 In Jedi Knight we had two alternative endings yet later in Jedi Outcast devs showed only light side ending as real one. Here should be the same solution: only one of the endings is real. Who remembers today that Katarn became Dark Emperor? Everyone just know that he freed jedi ghosts from the forgotten valley. I think that bioware made a great mistake by giving players chance to kill Bastila. Now we have "a great dilemma" becouse of that. I said earlier: THERE WILL ALWAYS BE A PRETEXT TO PLACE HER IN THE JEDI COUNCIL. The problem is if devs are normal guys (Bastila fans) or dangerous perverts who enjoyed killing her. HERMOCRATES: Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned. SOCRATES: This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSun Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 anyway, I'm not sure if any of what I've said above makes sense! but one thing that ought to be mentioned is that almost everyone must have played this game more than once, to see the possibilities. Why do we have to assume that everyone has to have a deep commitment to one such possibility, and insist on seeing it in the next game? Played 5 full times,have a save file on a 6th,played both male and female, but I've only played the light. That's just me. I've talked to some who have only done the dark side and others that have played each side. Some have played one side only once and then played the rest with their Fav. You just don't know what choices were made. I don't think it's about assuming that everyone has a huge commitment to one side or the other. But when you create a game like Sith Lords,how do you decide which path the characters took? Do you force a light or dark ending on the players? That kind of goes against allowing the player to choose light or dark to start with. As they said,they did not want to step on the choices that were made. The way they're setting things up allows people to play how they feel it should have played out. It's about allowing individual choice and creating an individual gaming experience. And just because I can see a certain someone making a comment about it. If it were up to me there would more then just humans to pick from and non jedi classes. However the lack of those things are not enough for me to dislike the game. showed only light side ending as real one. Here should be the same solution: Options are your friend. I fail to see how letting the player have more control on an individual level is considered a bad thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabahattin Dere Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Now we have "a great dilemma" becouse of that. I said earlier: THERE WILL ALWAYS BE A PRETEXT TO PLACE HER IN THE JEDI COUNCIL. and everyone will cringe at seeing the Master-Vrook-like dumb character of a Bastila, or Revan. I hope nothing of the sort happens, and we get to see them as more than just accessories. Zwangvolle Plage! M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nur Ab Sal Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Options are your friend. I fail to see how letting the player have more control on an individual level is considered a bad thing. It would mean more chaos and I'd prefer clear solutions in basic things. There must be some stable elements and Bastila's presence should be such element. and everyone will cringe at seeing the Master-Vrook-like dumb character of a Bastila, or Revan. Well that's why I want to see bastila and Revan in Jedi Council. Surely they can be more intelligent that Assner-voiced-Vrook. Mace Windu is in Jedi Council but he is still interesting character. I want to see some normal guys in the council... HERMOCRATES: Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned. SOCRATES: This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSun Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 It would mean more chaos and I'd prefer clear solutions in basic things. There must be some stable elements nd Bastila's presence should be such element. Her presence could be in the game even if she as a character is not seen. She doesn't have to be a member of the JC for that to be in the game. And the lack of her presence could mean a lot to people who hated her. I've seen a few people who loved to kill her the way some love to kill Carth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bokishi Posted June 27, 2004 Author Share Posted June 27, 2004 Umm... Yeah, all the women and sadists love killing her right? Current 3DMark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nur Ab Sal Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 I've seen a few people who loved to kill her the way some love to kill Carth. Perverts are not important. HERMOCRATES: Nur Ab Sal was one such king. He it was, say the wise men of Egypt, who first put men in the colossus, making many freaks of nature at times when the celestial spheres were well aligned. SOCRATES: This I doubt. We are hearing a child's tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabahattin Dere Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 As they said,they did not want to step on the choices that were made. The way they're setting things up allows people to play how they feel it should have played out. It's about allowing individual choice and creating an individual gaming experience. I think the possibilities within one episode does provide a great sense of individual gaming experience -not to mention that it constitutes the very replay-value that is so impoerant; but still I'd say it's a different matter when it gets to inter-episode choices. anyway, how long do we have to wait in order to find out? until Dec. or Feb.? Zwangvolle Plage! M Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverSun Posted June 27, 2004 Share Posted June 27, 2004 Perverts are not important. *LOL*WTF?? How does disliking a character make you a pervert? This may come as shock but not everyone loved Bas and not everyone hated Carth either. Allowing the player to choose does not bring about chaos. Player makes a choice and the game repsonds based on the choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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