The It Sucks Thread

[ShinIchiro]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

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You're assuming america is representative of the rest of the world...no way .5 of world has x-box. That's absurd. Also, not even 1/5 of AMERICA'S population has an x-box. I"d guess more like 1/100th of population of China has x-box (absolute conjecture, so if anyone could find stats...), if that. Really, the american assumption tends to be that the rest of the world is relatively rich like us...we don't understand that if you have an x-box, you're probably not poor.

[Darth Somethingorother]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

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a million millions is 1,000,000,000,000 or in other words thats 1 trillion not 1 billion or 1,000,000,000. I have to ask where where did you learn that 1 trillion = 1 billion? in the first arguement you state that the world population is "6 billion" by your standard of measure that would equal 6 trillion? I know this has no relevance to the given topic but I just had to ask and by no means to I mean to offend or sounds like an arse I just had to ask because it was bugging me. As for below the poverty line that would consit of someone making less than I think $10,000.00 US or $20,000.00 Euro/CAN if I am not misstaken though I could be wrong someone from the states might be able to give the proper info for the US.

 

Now on topic: Good work on finding that info on the number of Xbox owners in both the world and US, Servant of Eru and Atomic Space Vixen. I came up with one thought as to why LA might have held back the PC version till Feb (saying they are going to release the international version at the same time), because they figured it would severly limit the ammount of loss they would incure do to P2P file transfer and ilegal coping. The way I figure it is they thought that if they released the PC version to the US and then had to wait till feb to release the internation version that most people who have the internet would just download it in order to avoid the wait. I know that alot of games now come with anti-copy protection built in but with the proper knowledge it can be easily usurped. Thus in their eyes it would make more sense to release the game on the Xbox and maybe risk loosing some sales rather than releasing the game on both platforms and risk loosing a greater number of sales from people either obtaining the game iligaly through pirating or purchase in the US and Canada.As far as I know there isn't a way to copy a Xbox game and make it work on another xbox or PC though once agian I could be wrong on that.

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Just to clear this up; a million millions is only a trillion in the USA. everywhere else (or at least in the UK) it is a billion. A billion billions is a trillion and so on. I have a GCSE in maths. that's where i was taught it.

[Child of Flame]

And I bet all of them are able to play games too.  Like Dark was saying, there are way more people worldwide that have PC's that can play this game

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I agree.

 

Although I think the difference may be that the XBox version sells for, what, close to $80 per game? PC versions can be had for $49.99.

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That sounds alot like the canadian prices, am I right? Because when I went to pre order TSL the $80 price tag was what I was told (after taxes of course), and the $49.99 is what I was also told for the PC version. Both prices are from my local EB games.

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Dude, you guys get raped. I can order about half my games (PC) online for $30 USD on the day of release. Wait a month or so, and I can get them for around $10. Sheesh.

[Stargate: 2000]

Now on topic: Good work on finding that info on the number of Xbox owners in both the world and US, Servant of Eru and Atomic Space Vixen. I came up with one thought as to why LA might have held back the PC version till Feb (saying they are going to release the international version at the same time), because they figured it would severly limit the ammount of loss they would incure do to P2P file transfer and ilegal coping. The way I figure it is they thought that if they released the PC version to the US and then had to wait till feb to release the internation version that most people who have the internet would just download it in order to avoid the wait. I know that alot of games now come with anti-copy protection built in but with the proper knowledge it can be easily usurped. Thus in their eyes it would make more sense to release the game on the Xbox and maybe risk loosing some sales rather than releasing the game on both platforms and risk loosing a greater number of sales from people either obtaining the game iligaly through pirating or purchase in the US and Canada.As far as I know there isn't a way to copy a Xbox game and make it work on another xbox or PC though once agian I could be wrong on that.

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This is total BS. As I stated earlier:

 

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hmm oops sorry about that, I guess I missed that post sorry for posting something that has already been stated.

[Darth Somethingorother]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

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You're assuming america is representative of the rest of the world...no way .5 of world has x-box. That's absurd. Also, not even 1/5 of AMERICA'S population has an x-box. I"d guess more like 1/100th of population of China has x-box (absolute conjecture, so if anyone could find stats...), if that. Really, the american assumption tends to be that the rest of the world is relatively rich like us...we don't understand that if you have an x-box, you're probably not poor.

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Good Lord, you don't think I'm American do you?

[Child of Flame]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

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You're assuming america is representative of the rest of the world...no way .5 of world has x-box. That's absurd. Also, not even 1/5 of AMERICA'S population has an x-box. I"d guess more like 1/100th of population of China has x-box (absolute conjecture, so if anyone could find stats...), if that. Really, the american assumption tends to be that the rest of the world is relatively rich like us...we don't understand that if you have an x-box, you're probably not poor.

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I don't expect you guys to read the entire thread like I did, most of you actually have a life, but you could at least read the last two pages before posting.

 

North American Billy Gates Box Sales from the last two fiscal years:  16.3

 

Billy Gates Box Sales everywhere else (Asia-Pacific, Europe) from the last two fiscal years:  8.6

 

 

Not sure what the sales earlier than that were as they were harder to find; plus they didn't really sell much anywhere but the US anyway.  I'd say the majority of Billy Gates Box owners are Stateside.  <_<

 

2003 fiscal year sales were taken from HERE. 

 

2004 fiscal year sales were taken from HERE.

 

 

<Edit> Oh, just so you know ASV, corporations operate on fiscal years so as not to end their estimations before the end of the winter season.  The end of a fiscal year is July.    </Edit>

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It's 8.6 million in the entire world excluding the US. Most of those were in Europe. That means that Asia has significantly less than 1/100. <_<

[Stargate: 2000]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

You're assuming america is representative of the rest of the world...no way .5 of world has x-box. That's absurd. Also, not even 1/5 of AMERICA'S population has an x-box. I"d guess more like 1/100th of population of China has x-box (absolute conjecture, so if anyone could find stats...), if that. Really, the american assumption tends to be that the rest of the world is relatively rich like us...we don't understand that if you have an x-box, you're probably not poor.

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Or around 83% the popularion of canada since canada had a population of roughly 30 million. Figured I though that in because its the closest to the population to the ammount of Xboxs sold world wide.

 

North American Billy Gates Box Sales from the last two fiscal years: 16.3

 

Billy Gates Box Sales everywhere else (Asia-Pacific, Europe) from the last two fiscal years: 8.6

for a total of 24.9 million people divided by 30 Million (canadas population)=83%

[Darth Somethingorother]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

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You're assuming america is representative of the rest of the world...no way .5 of world has x-box. That's absurd. Also, not even 1/5 of AMERICA'S population has an x-box. I"d guess more like 1/100th of population of China has x-box (absolute conjecture, so if anyone could find stats...), if that. Really, the american assumption tends to be that the rest of the world is relatively rich like us...we don't understand that if you have an x-box, you're probably not poor.

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I don't expect you guys to read the entire thread like I did, most of you actually have a life, but you could at least read the last two pages before posting.

 

North American Billy Gates Box Sales from the last two fiscal years:  16.3

 

Billy Gates Box Sales everywhere else (Asia-Pacific, Europe) from the last two fiscal years:  8.6

 

 

Not sure what the sales earlier than that were as they were harder to find; plus they didn't really sell much anywhere but the US anyway.  I'd say the majority of Billy Gates Box owners are Stateside.  <_<

 

2003 fiscal year sales were taken from HERE. 

 

2004 fiscal year sales were taken from HERE.

 

 

<Edit> Oh, just so you know ASV, corporations operate on fiscal years so as not to end their estimations before the end of the winter season.  The end of a fiscal year is July.    </Edit>

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It's 8.6 million in the entire world excluding the US. Most of those were in Europe. That means that Asia has significantly less than 1/100. <_<

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So, whatever the facts and figures, LA have still pissed off the majority of their paying customers.

[Child of Flame]

America's population is about 300 million taking into account mormonism, if each houshold has an xbox owner your looking at 50-60 million people who actually own and play an xbox.  I could be wrong, of course, but its only common sense.  The world's population is over 3b, yes, in fact its over 6 billion (before you tell ME to get MY facts straight) Around half of them probably own an xbox, again, I could be wrong, but the point was that u get the idea right? there are, in fact, other places in the world than America, and that America isn't even the world's largest country, therefore giving KOTOR2 early to a small percentage is unfair on the rest of us.

 

Fine, but w're still talking billions, not just millions, and theres a big difference, especially considering my billions are a million millions, not the US thousand millions.  And, define, "below the poverty line".  My cousin is "below the poverty line", but he still has an xbox.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

You're assuming america is representative of the rest of the world...no way .5 of world has x-box. That's absurd. Also, not even 1/5 of AMERICA'S population has an x-box. I"d guess more like 1/100th of population of China has x-box (absolute conjecture, so if anyone could find stats...), if that. Really, the american assumption tends to be that the rest of the world is relatively rich like us...we don't understand that if you have an x-box, you're probably not poor.

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I don't expect you guys to read the entire thread like I did, most of you actually have a life, but you could at least read the last two pages before posting.

 

North American Billy Gates Box Sales from the last two fiscal years:  16.3

 

Billy Gates Box Sales everywhere else (Asia-Pacific, Europe) from the last two fiscal years:  8.6

 

 

Not sure what the sales earlier than that were as they were harder to find; plus they didn't really sell much anywhere but the US anyway.  I'd say the majority of Billy Gates Box owners are Stateside.  <_<

 

2003 fiscal year sales were taken from HERE. 

 

2004 fiscal year sales were taken from HERE.

 

 

<Edit> Oh, just so you know ASV, corporations operate on fiscal years so as not to end their estimations before the end of the winter season.  The end of a fiscal year is July.    </Edit>

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It's 8.6 million in the entire world excluding the US. Most of those were in Europe. That means that Asia has significantly less than 1/100. <_<

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So, whatever the facts and figures, LA have still pissed off the majority of their paying customers.

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Oh hell yes. No argument there. The majority of LA's customers throughout their history as a game dev has been PC gamers. Not to mention, as I stated earlier, I really highly doubt that there's more Billy Gates Box owners, than people who have a PC that meets the pathetic minimum requirements of KotOR. Especially in Asia, tech center of the world. Sheesh.

[Darth Somethingorother]

Well, at least the last half day or so of continually checking and posting on this forum hasn't been totally wasted. B)

[Child of Flame]

Well, at least the last half day or so of continually checking and posting on this forum hasn't been totally wasted. B)

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I think the most awesome message anyone could send, PC AND Billy Gates Box gamers could send, is if everyone started pulling their preorders, even if they do intend to go out and buy it as soon as it hits the shelves. Myself, I'd sure get a chuckle out of seeing it actually go 'Un-Gold'.

[Darth Somethingorother]

Well, at least the last half day or so of continually checking and posting on this forum hasn't been totally wasted. B)

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I think the most awesome message anyone could send, PC AND Billy Gates Box gamers could send, is if everyone started pulling their preorders, even if they do intend to go out and buy it as soon as it hits the shelves. Myself, I'd sure get a chuckle out of seeing it actually go 'Un-Gold'.

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Ahh, yes. wouldn't it be great to see the look on that chubby git's face?

[GhostofAnakin]

I think the X-Box price is the same.  I am not 100% sure though.

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The stores I've seen here in Canada, the XBox games sell for between $70 and $80, while the PC games sell anywhere from $20 to $59.99 at most.

 

I personally bought my KOTOR game for $39.99, but that was about a month after it had already been out.

[Craftsman]

I still dont get why they cant hold off the Xbox version. And dont say cos its Christmas. You would get the game if it came out tommorow.

[Salsabettis]

I still dont get why they cant hold off the Xbox version. And dont say cos its Christmas. You would get the game if it came out tommorow.

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Christmas is a good enough reason. I work in retail and trust me during the holiday season, people buy things that they wouldn't normally buy the rest of the year. If you had children or grandchildren that owned an X-Box and don't normally buy games, what time of the year are you going to buy a game for the child? Christmas and Birthday. Christmas is the same time of year for everyone, so it is as close as it gets to a sure thing.

[GhostofAnakin]

I still dont get why they cant hold off the Xbox version. And dont say cos its Christmas. You would get the game if it came out tommorow.

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Money, plain and simple. What business would hold back on a product during the busiest buying season of the year if it was ready to be shipped?

 

I don't blame LucasArts from a business perspective. I just question their ethics with their marketing of the game leading up to the point in time they decided to announce 2 different release dates.

[ShinIchiro]

Then wouldn't it make sense that moving up the PC version would also be profitible?

 

I have to wonder if many PC players bought the original Knights on X-box at first because it came out earlier, thus messing up stats in favor of x-box.

 

Sorry about not having read the entire thing before posting earlier. I saw a specious statement and I am really really pissed about this whole thing...also I don't quite have time to.

[GhostofAnakin]

Then wouldn't it make sense that moving up the PC version would also be profitible?

 

I have to wonder if many PC players bought the original Knights on X-box at first because it came out earlier, thus messing up stats in favor of x-box.

 

Sorry about not having read the entire thing before posting earlier.  I saw a specious statement and I am really really pissed about this whole thing...also I don't quite have time to.

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From what has been said by the devs, the PC version isn't ready for a december release, while apparently the xbox version is.

 

So realistically, the only options are 1)release xbox in december in time for xmas, release pc as scheduled or 2)hold off on release of xbox until feb.

 

The ethical thing to do would be to hold off on the release, since that is what their entire marketing campaign has been based on. But the business thing to do is what they decided to do, despite the fact they are now suffering backlash from the PC fans.

[DesertHawk]

I read the first 3 pages of this thread, then gave up. Heheh.

 

Maybe, at least, we PC gamers will get a more polished version of the game with more features and better graphics? LArts seems to think that the money is with consoles, but maybe they're wrong? If we showed them the fact that PC gamers buy more - much more - they may think twice about releasing it so late next time.

 

I must admit, however, that I feel like my dreams have been crushed by those LA publishers. I know it's not Obsidian's fault, they're doing everything they can to get the game to us as quick as possible, and make it a better play than KOTOR. We can't blame it on them even if we wanted to.

 

I hope for the extended wait we'll get a few nice things. Maybe a Yavin Spacestation. Maybe the ability to put your hood up/down from the inventory screen (without an animation!), maybe we'll get something LucasArts just won't give to the Xbox gamers. Maybe we'll get less bugs and a WinXP SP2 compatability (Which, considering the errors you get in KOTOR with SP2 would be a great touch.) Maybe they'll make it so the game runs faster for those of us with one year old computers and no upgrades. Maybe we'll get more options for our character, more customization. Maybe we'll get...

 

Anyway, it doesn't matter. It'll come out in time. I think I can wait. Until...oh, a lovely nine months to get KOTOR 2. Yes, of course. Wait. Just 13 more months. . .13 more months. . .Or is it 14? Oh, my math skills are bad when I'm so sad.

 

The only question is, will the rest of the PC community wait idly by? Huh. Maybe we'll riot. Huzzah. Riot.

[Salsabettis]

Unfortunately, when the choices are ethics or revenue, revenue wins.

 

We should be thankful that the game hasn't been delayed. It just happens to be that the X-Box was finished first since, as Akari stated, they received the code for the X-Box before the PC.

[Craftsman]

What else can we do? (Sigh)

[Child of Flame]

Damn, you know what would be freaking awesome is if they added all the things they said would take too much of the Billy Gates Box's memory to do originally just for the PC version. Up/Down hood, more NPC models. That would f*cking rock. :D

[GhostofAnakin]

Damn, you know what would be freaking awesome is if they added all the things they said would take too much of the Billy Gates Box's memory to do originally just for the PC version.  Up/Down hood, more NPC models.  That would f*cking rock.  :D

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Extras would be nice, but my guess is we're not going to get anything extra that the Xbox version didn't have. We just get to wait longer and listen (read) all the spoilers about the story so that it's ruined for us when we finally get to play.

[Salsabettis]

Damn, you know what would be freaking awesome is if they added all the things they said would take too much of the Billy Gates Box's memory to do originally just for the PC version.  Up/Down hood, more NPC models.  That would f*cking rock.  :D

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It would be good for LA too because as people did with KotOR, the Xbox folk would buy it on PC to get all the cool things.

[Child of Flame]

Damn, you know what would be freaking awesome is if they added all the things they said would take too much of the Billy Gates Box's memory to do originally just for the PC version.  Up/Down hood, more NPC models.  That would f*cking rock.  :D

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It would be good for LA too because as people did with KotOR, the Xbox folk would buy it on PC to get all the cool things.

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Yeah it would, but I have a sneaking suspicion Ghost of Anakin is right. :angry: