Is a riposte berserker/trickster viable?

[Koo]

Sorry for my bad English.

I will be playing the veteran turn-based mode, not PotD.

Would a berserker/trickster with the following characteristics be viable?

I am looking for fun, not the highest efficiency.

 

- Use the community patch.

- Equip Lord Darryn's Voulge.

- Raise Def with Trickster's Illusion to take advantage of Riposte.

- Use Casità Samelia's Legacy to increase Def and as an HP indicator.

- Cloak and gloves to increase Def.

- Collect Engage with several abilities and equipment.

- Use Voidward to counteract Fury's self-inflicted damage. Also, receive passive heals from chanters and other party members.

 

It's not ideal because the Berserker Fury gives a -10 Def, but we are using a community patch and have Mirrored Image and Llengrath's Displaced Image, which can generate a lot of riposte by the Glades as well as misses!I think.

Lots of attack frequency builds up the LDV stack.

To counter Confused, equip Ring of Mule's Wit, knowing that you will need to supplement Int, or have the chanter use "They Shielded Their Eyes 'Gainst the Fampyr's Gaze".

 

Is this idea viable?

I feel like I am missing something.

I look forward to suggestions and pointers to make it more enjoyable. (Example, Devil of Caroc Breastplate is better, even if the def doesn't go up, etc.)

[Koo]

Sorry for the series of posts.

I'm just adding a note about the build features.

 

Berserker's Frenzy, Rogue's Dirty Fighting, and Uncanny Luck to build up Hits to Critical opportunities.

Debuff with Spirit Frenzy and Rogue's various attack abilities to take advantage of Sneak Attack and Deathblows.

 

And one thing I noticed.

Accuracy is going to be in short supply...

[thelee]

Why voulge? Is it for the engagement?

a riposte build might enjoy a two handed axe with the bleeding cuts modal more.

 

also not just raising def, but lowering enemy accuracy helps. Persistent distraction from rogue gets you -5 perception on enemies. You could pair with a priest who can cast Despondent Blows or Devotions for the Faithful, which would stack with perception debuff. A wizard has easy access to blind from Chill Fog and while the perception penalty won’t stack, blind comes with its own additional accuracy penalty.

Edited April 10 by thelee

[Boeroer]

31 minutes ago, thelee said:

Why voulge?

Because every Riposte would trigger Carnage which would build up stacks of Static Charge/Thunder in an AoE. At least that's what I think was meant with "building up LDV stacks". 

It's a nice idea but I don't know if it will work well enough to be satisfying. 

15 hours ago, Koo said:

 Use Casità Samelia's Legacy to increase Def and as an HP indicator.

That's an option, but you must max Intimidate then in order to reach +10 deflection. Also the AR isn't great. Imo Nomad's Brigandine (up to +10 melee deflection without skill investment) is the better pick because it also has higher AR and potential immunity to disengagement attacks - which turns them into 100% misses. This can contribute to more Ripostes when moving across the battlefield. 

Using Ardent as HP indicator is possible, but something like Blooded or Fighting Spirit is sufficient imo. 

[Koo]

Thank you for your response!

1 hour ago, Boeroer said:

Because every Riposte would trigger Carnage which would build up stacks of Static Charge/Thunder in an AoE. At least that's what I think was meant with "building up LDV stacks". 

Yes, the idea is to attack with frequency for the LDV stacks.

1 hour ago, thelee said:

also not just raising def, but lowering enemy accuracy helps. Persistent distraction from rogue gets you -5 perception on enemies. You could pair with a priest who can cast Despondent Blows or Devotions for the Faithful, which would stack with perception debuff. A wizard has easy access to blind from Chill Fog and while the perception penalty won’t stack, blind comes with its own additional accuracy penalty.

I see!
With Persistent distraction, it would be nice to equip the head with a Thaos' Headdress for accuracy.

1 hour ago, Boeroer said:

That's an option, but you must max Intimidate then in order to reach +10 deflection. Also the AR isn't great. Imo Nomad's Brigandine (up to +10 melee deflection without skill investment) is the better pick because it also has higher AR and potential immunity to disengagement attacks - which turns them into 100% misses. This can contribute to more Ripostes when moving across the battlefield. 

Using Ardent as HP indicator is possible, but something like Blooded or Fighting Spirit is sufficient imo. 

That's good!
I didn't know there was such an armor.
I will do that.

 

I don't know how efficiently LDV + carnage + riposte will work, but at least it can carry the debuffer & tank, so I'll play with it.

[Kaylon]

Riposte isn't something you should build around - it's just a little bonus for defensive rogue builds (trickster/soul blade or trickster/steel garrote for example). It's possible however to force misses either using medium shield modal (Nerian's Ward is nice for that),  items giving "resistances" (like Humility robes) or immunity to disengagement like Nomad's Brigandine/Gipon's Prudensco.

[Koo]

46 minutes ago, Kaylon said:

Riposte isn't something you should build around - it's just a little bonus for defensive rogue builds (trickster/soul blade or trickster/steel garrote for example). It's possible however to force misses either using medium shield modal (Nerian's Ward is nice for that),  items giving "resistances" (like Humility robes) or immunity to disengagement like Nomad's Brigandine/Gipon's Prudensco.

Thank you for your response!

Yes, it is.
Rarely use it to be happy to see Carnage + LDV as a bonus.

[Chaospread]

I think Casita Samelia's Legacy could work with a barb/trickster. You can pump intimidate very high with barb class bonus, background bonuses, infamous captain, training, this equipment:

Type	Item	Enchantment	Modifier
Cloak	Frostfur Mantle [BW]	Ripped from the Source	+3
Gauntlets	Onepahua's Strength	Royal Blood	+2
Ring	Chameleon's Touch	Versatile	+1 (as Barbarian)

(note that the ring give bonus exactly to barbs).

So you can reach +15 intimidate, it ends in +9/+10 deflection and with Ardent you can have until +20 will. Nomad Brigadine is good but IIRC has worse recovery malus than CSL.

You can use Whispers of The Endless Paths with Offensive Parry: another +4 DEF bonus an another "riposte", also good AoE damage even if IIRC it doesn't work with carnage.

But I run precisely with a Barb/Priest with this setup mid game, late I switch WotEP with Aretezzo's Cane, but it was very funny to me.

 

[Constentin Lévine]

I made a Shadow Dancer specialized in riposte from disengagment attacks, reaching 289 in deviation vs dsgmt attacks. (326 with a sage also).

That was about proc some crit chains with Mahora Tanga, with a fast orlan moving on the battlefield around my other party members. That worked very well and I weared the hat that can also proc a riposte on miss. 

I used Gipon Prudensco to +10 dv and +25 dv vs disengagment. This armor is really good for the melee ones. 

[Boeroer]

57 minutes ago, Constentin Lévine said:

I made a Shadow Dancer specialized in riposte from disengagment attacks, reaching 289 in deviation vs dsgmt attacks. (326 with a sage also).

That was about proc some crit chains with Mahora Tanga, with a fast orlan moving on the battlefield around my other party members. That worked very well and I weared the hat that can also proc a riposte on miss. 

I used Gipon Prudensco to +10 dv and +25 dv vs disengagment. This armor is really good for the melee ones. 

Why on earth didn't you use Gipon's enchantment that grants immunity to disengagment attacks (100% of grazes/hits/crits converted to misses) instead of pumping deflection against disengagement attacks? 

Edited Thursday at 06:51 PM by Boeroer

[Constentin Lévine]

48 minutes ago, Boeroer said:

Why on earth didn't you use Gipon's enchantment that grants immunity to disengagment attacks (100% of grazes/hits/crits converted to misses) instead of pumping deflection against disengagement attacks? 

To try another thing, of course, and then reach over 300 deflection.  But the reason i said 

 

1 hour ago, Constentin Lévine said:

. This armor is really good for the melee ones. 

is for the immunity and the free defenses bonus.

[Koo]

Thank you all for the many suggestions!

 

6 hours ago, Chaospread said:

Nomad Brigadine is good but IIRC has worse recovery malus than CSL.

 

I originally had the same idea as you, but B is right, Nomad Brigadine looks better, mainly because of the difference in AR and the fact that I play turn-based, so recovery has less impact. bonus to disengagment attacks, too.

6 hours ago, Chaospread said:

You can use Whispers of The Endless Paths with Offensive Parry: another +4 DEF bonus an another "riposte", also good AoE damage even if IIRC it doesn't work with carnage.

WotEP would also be effective.

- WotEP is corn, but LDV is 360 degrees as it applies to carnage. (* 360 is preferable for tanks)

- WotEP has less base damage, but LDV is standard.

- WotEP's Aoe is the weapon damage itself, but LDV's AoE damage is basically 10 and must be triggered. (* Berserker's Frenzy and Rogue's ability to increase critical rate)

- LDV's AoE does not apply the effect of ability, but WotEP's AoE does. (* in favor of rogue's ability, but Barbaric Smash is good too)

- The AoE (with carnage) of a LDV that is BINDED to a Barbarian gives Disoriented.

- WotEP has Def+4 and a second counterattack ability (with debuff) called Offensive Parry.

- WotEP has a 15% crash attribute lash, while LDV has a 15% shock attribute lash that is limited to when activated.

- The shock effect of LDV is cool.

 

Sorry for the long post.

I can think of a difference like this for example, but it could be either one.

However, WotEP seems to have little synergy with Barbarian.

5 hours ago, Constentin Lévine said:

I weared the hat that can also proc a riposte on miss. 

This was my thought as well, but it is negative that it is turn based and requires a miss.

[Koo]

Do you think it is a bug that the immunity to disengagement attacks in Nomad's Brigandine trigger riposte and Offensive Parry?
Or does it behave like a bug? (CHEESE?)

It seemed useful, but I don't want to use a bug or make it extremely difficult.

[Boeroer]

It's def. not a bug. And it works as intended as far as I can tell. Maybe the devs didn't think about the combo with Riposte and Offensive Parry, but who knows.

Is it cheesy? A little bit. But on the other hand the impact is very limited, especially with Riposte alone. You will do better damage playing the usual way instead of running around like a headless chicken all the time, trying to trigger disengagement attacks. That's also pretty unfun to do - it gets old really fast imo. 

Edited Friday at 05:39 AM by Boeroer

[Koo]

Thanks again for your comments.

You're right, it's not fun for the amount of work it takes and I'm going to get bored doing it.
(I play turn based, so I was wondering what would happen if I repeated the engage and disengage many times within one turn)

[Kaylon]

Turn based is a completely different experience and it is indeed a viable strategy coupled with maxed mouvement speed, however it will increase greatly the length of the fights. 

[Boeroer]

54 minutes ago, Koo said:

I play turn based, so I was wondering what would happen if I repeated the engage and disengage many times within one turn.

I guess it's less of a nuisance in turn based mode since you micromanage everybody's movement and actions anyway. But I can't say how use- or impactful it is because I have no experience with the turn based mode. I don't even know how often you could trigger disengagement attacks in one turn against a single enemy.

Edited Friday at 05:44 AM by Boeroer

[Koo]

Thank you all so much!
It was very helpful.
I will try and do some trial and error myself.

I am off to Eora world!

[thelee]

14 hours ago, Koo said:

Thank you all so much!
It was very helpful.
I will try and do some trial and error myself.

hey just a friendly nudge that you should post anything useful you find. i think the deadfire fan base is heavily skewed towards RTWP so there's a big knowledge gap with turn-based mode. if you find something that works in TB pretty well, you should post it for the benefit of posterity.

Edited Friday at 10:03 PM by thelee