[MECHANICS] Various Testing

[Boeroer]

Cool, thanks!

There are also the abilites of Animated Weapons (FoD from Great Sword, Knockdown from Pike and Wounding Shot from Warbow).

[Testlum]

Yep, but I didn't include those as they're modded out of vanilla in my game 

[Elric Galad]

I never took the time to check it before, but underpenetrating starts when Armor is 0.5 above PEN.

Iron Wheel is a bit better than I expected because of it.

[thelee]

13 hours ago, Elric Galad said:

I never took the time to check it before, but underpenetrating starts when Armor is 0.5 above PEN.

Iron Wheel is a bit better than I expected because of it.

interesting. that means even the partial PEN bonuses from scaling can be useful, so long as the enemy has partial AR or you have .75 PEN. i thought the game just truncated everything.

[Elric Galad]

2 hours ago, thelee said:

interesting. that means even the partial PEN bonuses from scaling can be useful, so long as the enemy has partial AR or you have .75 PEN. i thought the game just truncated everything.

Now I am honestly wondering about the exact rule because I haven't run many tests. Only the following :

13 PEN Vs 13.25 AR was normal damages.

13 PEN Vs 13.5 AR was -25% underpenetration.

How the rounding is done exactly, I haven't tested.

Maybe 12.75 PEN is rounded up and 13.25 is rounded down so it ends up without penalty ? So it's not the difference that is rounded but each value ? Or maybe the rounding rule is different for AR and PEN, who knows ?

 

Iron Wheel is a rare case of decimal armour.

In both cases, Iron Wheel is about as good as +3 AR with 10 wounds.

Edited January 24, 2022 by Elric Galad

[Elric Galad]

Corpse Eater special PL food bonus don't stack with other PL bonus from active abilities.

+1 from Acute and +2 from food will result in only +2.

Except if you save/load, then it will probably stack as other food bonuses do.

[Elric Galad]

Hi Dudes and Dudettes,

Just found another Beguiler bug.

Draining Whip adds +100% focus gain.

Beguiler gets half of normal focus (0.25 focus per damage ratio instead of 0.5), but +100% focus gain against sneak attack targets.

 

Consequently, Beguiler Draining Whip will get 0.25 +100% focus +100% focus gain against sneak attack targets.

Both bonuses stack additively !! So Beguiler with Draining Whip only get 0.75 focus per damage vs sneak attack targets while other Ciphers get 1 focus per damage. Beguilers aren't supposed to get a penalty vs sneak attack targets...

 

(note : it will of course be addressed by next BPM version, cheers !)

[thelee]

18 hours ago, Elric Galad said:

Hi Dudes and Dudettes,

Just found another Beguiler bug.

Draining Whip adds +100% focus gain.

Beguiler gets half of normal focus (0.25 focus per damage ratio instead of 0.5), but +100% focus gain against sneak attack targets.

 

Consequently, Beguiler Draining Whip will get 0.25 +100% focus +100% focus gain against sneak attack targets.

Both bonuses stack additively !! So Beguiler with Draining Whip only get 0.75 focus per damage vs sneak attack targets while other Ciphers get 1 focus per damage. Beguilers aren't supposed to get a penalty vs sneak attack targets...

 

(note : it will of course be addressed by next BPM version, cheers !)

interesting interaction; ironically if they had just used the difficult-to-grok inversions this wouldn't be an issue (the first +100% would cancel out the inversion, and then the rest would work normally). though in practice, could one consider it a balance trade-off for the powerful ability to being able to generate focus by casting deception powers?

[Elric Galad]

53 minutes ago, thelee said:

interesting interaction; ironically if they had just used the difficult-to-grok inversions this wouldn't be an issue (the first +100% would cancel out the inversion, and then the rest would work normally). though in practice, could one consider it a balance trade-off for the powerful ability to being able to generate focus by casting deception powers?

Well, sort of.

But it's pretty surely unintended and undocumented.

It is also avoidable if picking Biting Whip. Biting Whip is very bad, unless using CP though.

[NotDumbEnough]

 

There is a truly incredible amount of jank with how Spearcaster works. As you can see from the screenshots I'm getting Daze and Immobilize procs on enemies that I haven't actually damaged, nor shot projectiles at (including Driving Flight bounces). It may have to do with my Arcane Archer abilities, but really I haven't been able to find out why this happens.

[Boeroer]

Did you do any other hit rolls on them? It may be that Spearcaster's enchantments work with non-weapon atttack rolls, too (like some other weapons out there)?
But when looking at the positioning of the Imp for example that doesn't seem to be the reason. I can also see no other attack rolls aganst him in the log. Weird...

[hansvedic]

Don't know if this has been documented elsewhere, but the great sword Burden's Grieving enchantment and the "Rightful Vengeance" enchantment of several late-game amulets (e.g. Tooth of Toamowhai) works when a non-Ghost Heart animal companion is downed. Reviving the animal companion, at least with the ranger revive skill, does not take the bonuses away; it only removes Bonded Grief. Suddenly, the pet going down could actually be a good thing!

Given the potential with Brilliant to continually revive the pet, one could feasibly max out the bonuses from these items. I've read that Burden has a maximum of +4 to MIG, but I don't know if the amulets have a maximum.

Thoughts?

Edited February 22, 2022 by hansvedic

[Bosmer]

I assumed that all these effects have a maximum value and that the death of all summons that are considered to be part of your party would contribute to it, but never tested it. Are you sure that it is only working with the rangers animal companion?

[Elric Galad]

41 minutes ago, Bosmer said:

I assumed that all these effects have a maximum value and that the death of all summons that are considered to be part of your party would contribute to it, but never tested it. Are you sure that it is only working with the rangers animal companion?

I tried one of them with a summon once, and it didn't work.

I don't remember the details...

[Kaylon]

1 hour ago, Bosmer said:

I assumed that all these effects have a maximum value and that the death of all summons that are considered to be part of your party would contribute to it, but never tested it. Are you sure that it is only working with the rangers animal companion?

Those procs require party members, not allies. Ranger's companion is considered a party member and indeed you can exploit his death because he doesn't get injuries. From what I remember you can get at most +4 MIG/RES until the end of combat. 

[hansvedic]

1 minute ago, Kaylon said:

Those procs require party members, not allies. Ranger's companion is considered a party member and indeed you can exploit his death because he doesn't get injuries. From what I remember you can get at most +4 MIG/RES until the end of combat. 

Thanks for explaining this, Kaylon; I was about to comment much the same thing.

Just to be clear, the Ranger's companion is a party member IF AND ONLY IF you are not a Ghost-Heart ranger; the Ghost-Heart ranger has their animal companion as a summon.

[Constentin Lévine]

26 minutes ago, Kaylon said:

From what I remember you can get at most +4 MIG/RES until the end of combat. 

The bonus from Burden is removed if you switch your weapon, or spiritshifting

[Boeroer]

Do the bonuses of Burden and the Crown of Woedica stuff stack?

[hansvedic]

38 minutes ago, Boeroer said:

Do the bonuses of Burden and the Crown of Woedica stuff stack?

They did in my testing!

[Bosmer]

wow, that's really underwhelming.. IIRC none of these items would be overpowered even with 4 or 5 (maximum?) stacks on it. And besides using your animal companion I can't think of a reliable strategy to use them.

It's not like they would buff the "last man standing" of your party for a major comeback.

[Testlum]

If an enemy has a Weakness to Perception Afflictions and is engaged by a character with Persistent Distraction, that enemy will remain flanked even after the engagement ends.

[NotDumbEnough]

I suspect Rynhaedr was originally intended to fight Neriscyrlas in more than just a cutscene. She has a unique ability if you attack her:

Edited February 27, 2022 by NotDumbEnough

[Testlum]

The Strategist ability for Bronlar's Phalanx isn't very clearly worded. It actually Confuses the first enemy engaged in combat, rather than Confusing all enemies engaged for the first time in combat. 

Same goes for Tactician which triggers on the first Engagement.

Edited February 28, 2022 by Testlum

[Elric Galad]

Shadow Step has an interesting property : the paralysis part is applied on next weapon Hit (Miss and Graze don't count). As long as no attack Hits the Paralysis charge isn't spent and last forever. 

Also, the paralysis is applied without a roll.

Basically, you're pretty much guaranteed to get something paralysed at some point  (Ok, without mod, it's probably not worth it for 3 Guiles, but still...)

[thelee]

7 hours ago, Elric Galad said:

Shadow Step has an interesting property : the paralysis part is applied on next weapon Hit (Miss and Graze don't count). As long as no attack Hits the Paralysis charge isn't spent and last forever. 

Also, the paralysis is applied without a roll.

Basically, you're pretty much guaranteed to get something paralysed at some point  (Ok, without mod, it's probably not worth it for 3 Guiles, but still...)

yeah, this is one of those things where it's most annoying that enemies get this benefit, versus yourself. i remember being really annoyed in some fight way back when that no matter what i did, i could not prevent a rogue from paralyzing one of my guys after a shadow step.