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Any strong cipher multiclasses?


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16 replies to this topic

#1
Hamhaus

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The nerf on soul annihilation and body attunement kinda destroyed my cipher-monk idea (Soul Annihilate + Swift Flurry + debuff target's defenses), and atm I can't really think of another multiclass build that's better than a single class cipher.


Edited by Hamhaus, 13 June 2018 - 09:48 AM.


#2
KDubya

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Melee will generate focus faster than ranged and any of the martial classes paired with Cipher will generate more focus faster than a pure Cipher. Unless you really want the tier 8 and 9 powers I'd multi. Even a ranged guy will do better paired with Rogue or Ranger rather than go pure Cipher.

 

A Shattered Pillar mixed with Cipher still works good, just skip Soul Blade, go either Beguiler or Ascendent.

 

Body Attunement still gets you +2 armor and debuffs them -2 armor so its not trash, the +5/-5 was way too strong.



#3
evilcat

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If SoulBlade, then Rogue backstab, Assasin for better effect. Not sure what OE tried to achieve but now it is the best to play SB at all.

You could also play SoulBlade as regular Cipher with less focus, and dont use SoulAnihilation, but use more Shreds. Not sure what for, and if massive shreds really pay off, but you can.

 

Other than that any Cipher+Martial is good/ok. Rogue is even better now since you have better burst. BleakWalker works as usual.

 

Only Wizard/Priest/Chanter combo is more questionable. Shifter is an option, but simple martial class is probably better.


Edited by evilcat, 13 June 2018 - 10:12 AM.


#4
Anoregon

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Ranged Streetfighter/Cipher (ascendant works nice) with blunderbuss modal is a decent option. You can have permanent streetfighter passive up due to blunderbuss modal keeping you distracted. It's a static -5 perception (and thus accuracy) but that can be worked around with other buffs.


Edited by Anoregon, 13 June 2018 - 10:53 AM.


#5
rheingold

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Rogue(any) goes really well with cipher. Melee or ranged works fine - or a combination of both.
Missing SA is no biggie, cipher and rogue have more than enough hard hitting abilities as is.

#6
mosspit

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Hmmm, I am actually thinking that theres no huge benefit to going pure Ciphers

I mean which of the PL 8/9 abilities are game changing? Defensive Mindweb is a shadow of its PoE1 predecessor, Time Parasite got nerfed. Maybe TP is still viable, I dont know. But thats a PL8 ability after all.

On the other hand as other poster mentioned, there are marital classes that can further improve the Ciphers weapon attacks. That in turn help with Focus generation.

Also I don't see too much benefit with getting more Cipher abilities. You can just pick the notable ones like WoT, Echo Beam, Borrowed Instinct, Disintegrate. You will probably just be using those as a pure Cipher after all.

Edited by mosspit, 13 June 2018 - 11:57 AM.


#7
Achilles

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I’m really enjoying my Psyblade (Unbroken Fighter + Soulblade Cipher) build. Very durable, able to generate a decent amount of focus with abilities like Clear Out and Mob Stance, which then gets used to gib whatever sucker is engaging me.

Next pass at this build is going winnow Cipher active abilies down to just 2 or 3. Using focus for anything other than annihilation feels counter to the spirit of the subclass. My 2 cents.

#8
Tigranes

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Soulblade/Paladin remains pretty good, I'm experimenting with the AOE 2handers (Whispers, Wahai) to basically save up and do Soul Annihilation on multiple opponents. And honestly, 50% of cipher in POE1/2 is whispers of treason.

 

I haven't tried SA in 1.00, but right now it's a bit buggy where SA damage doesn't correctly display in the log.



#9
Dorftek

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Is quickswitch a thing in this game? In the first PoE I enjoyed quickswitch cipher with multiple arquebuses/Arbalests. But I haven't tried blackjacket in this game so I don't know if it's as good in this one.

In case it's good a blackjacket would be cool with an Ascendant

#10
mrscojangles

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Ranged Helwalker/Ascendant is sweet. Generate wounds with dance of death/enduring dance. 10 might from Helwalker at 10 wounds, 10 int from duality at 10 wounds, 5 might/2 pen from thunderous blows, 5 dex and lightning lash from lightning strikes. Since you only lose 1 power level when not at full focus as Ascendant, you can still toss out CC or debuffs just fine even when you're not ascended. Can spam around mind waves/mind blades/silent scream/amplified wave for great damage when ascended. Borrowed instinct for a nice accuracy boost. Secret Horrors is a solid aoe debuff and obviously have great CC with Whispers of treason and the likes.

 

It is squishy but even dumping resolve and only having 8 or 10 con, its still ok as long as you have some heals and a front liner or two. Depending on your difficulty, I'd recommend very high perception. Perception and accuracy are king for this build, then dex and then you want a decent bit of int/might but don't really need to go much higher than 15 or so, since you're going to be getting so much of both from all the monk buffs. I'd recommend dual wielding with serafen's gun and some other 1hander. Serafen's gun works very well for generating focus since it has the built in aoe and the fact that it has two different damage types.

 

I enjoyed the build pre 1.1 but didnt really need the CC portion much and basically played it as a straight up damage machine. I'm sure could still go that route post 1.1 on easier difficulties, but i've been playing upscaled POTD with the hardcore deadly deadfire mod now and its working great as a hybrid character. On tough fights you can spend a lot of time CCing with Whispers, debuffing with secret horrors, etc, and then when you're able you can pump out serious damage and interrupts and stuff too. It is a very flexible character. If you have other people locking down CC or don't need to CC much for a specific fight, you can do a ton of damage. If the fight has 15 enemies you can spend the majority of your time controlling the battle with all the mind controls and debuffs and interrupts. Surprisingly, even with all the CC I'm doing on this playthrough, it still is holding its own on overall damage since with the mod, fights are pretty drawn out and when my other characters may be all out of spells and resources towards the end, the cipher can keep on trucking. On the pre 1.1 playthrough it was top damage by a solid margin, and it wouldnt surprise me if it still ends up that way on this playthrough once i unlock silent scream and amplified wave. But even at low levels, mind wave is decent damage with an interrupt and mind blades is great for 2+ targets, especially against enemies with high saves but not super high deflection. It also has a short cast time so you can really pump out a bunch of them quickly with high dex.

 

I would highly recommend the combo. Perhaps I'll get around to making a guide for it at some point.

 

Edit: I just remembered to grab Scordeo's Trophy in my current playthrough and wanted to mention that is a great second weapon to go with Hand Mortar. Enchant it with opening barrage and you'll be stacking up reduced recovery time the entire fight, which applies to all your attacks and spells.


Edited by mrscojangles, 13 June 2018 - 08:38 PM.


#11
1TTFFSSE

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^ same only I went zerker/cipher.

 

in hardcore deadly deadfire upscaled the longest fight I had was the boss on Hosango ie waves of adds. 

Here is the video. in such a fight persistent charm/ summons really shine. 

 

feel free to fast forward the boring parts.

also only about 60-65% complete on the run but already at 125k/90k/65k damage between my 3 damage dealers lol. 



#12
Verde

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Rogue/Soulblade is still powerful.

#13
Thormind

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Also I don't see too much benefit with getting more Cipher abilities. You can just pick the notable ones like WoT, Echo Beam, Borrowed Instinct, Disintegrate. You will probably just be using those as a pure Cipher after all.

 

Quick question about disintegrate: if your target is destroyed with this ability, does it eliminate the loot as well?



#14
flazeo25

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No only downside to disintegrate is if they have arcane reflection then your char ashed.



#15
Shadenuat

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Any dps class basically. Ydwin multi-classed is actually an excellent example. I gave her ghostlady estoc during my first playthrough and she was teleporting around, doing nothing personnel kid and casting spells.



#16
Ichthyic

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Soulblade/Paladin remains pretty good, I'm experimenting with the AOE 2handers (Whispers, Wahai) to basically save up and do Soul Annihilation on multiple opponents. And honestly, 50% of cipher in POE1/2 is whispers of treason.

 

I haven't tried SA in 1.00, but right now it's a bit buggy where SA damage doesn't correctly display in the log.

I went through the entire game as bleakwalker/soulblade and never used any charm spell, ever.  you have a lot of other great CC without them, frankly.  the nerf to annihilation only means that you don't always one-shot enemies using it, and also that you have focus left over usually to cast a spell before you generate more focus with bleakwalker skills.

by the time you can cast time parasite... nothing can stop you, and you have enough utility abilities like lay on hands etc to do plenty of other things than just dps too.  the bigger nerf wasn't what they did with annihilation, it was what they did to whispers of the endless paths.  they basically ruined that sword completely.  I had to mod it back to the original way it worked.  It wasn't actually that OP, frankly, and you were relying on the double hit to proc crits.  Still, although a bit lesser, the sanguine sword is a fair substitute.

bottom line, inquisitor is still just fine and plenty interesting build to play.



 


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#17
antoniokolano

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Multiclass ciphers cannot cast time parasite though, it's a level 8 spell they don't get access to. You mentioned that in another thread before, but it's just not possible unless you also modded that part of your game.




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